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  1. #401

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    Quote Originally Posted by johndockley92 View Post
    ^^ who else would you say is even in the running though?

    Davis/Ladwig haven't looked good at all, Yank/Reagan haven't either, Vise/Baldwin are past their prime, and Donlan/Speroff don't have a minimum for world's either so...
    Donlan/Speroff still have an opportunity to get the min.

    S/K getting 96+ in an LP isn't the most exciting news.

  2. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    S/K getting 96+ in an LP isn't the most exciting news.
    When you consider the fact that 1) they've only been together since April of this year, 2) got 59 pts. in the SP (along with an awesome performance at Skate Detroit), and 3) that they have the 3rd highest total by a wide margin among US pairs, I think it's rather exciting ...

  3. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    When you consider the fact that 1) they've only been together since April of this year, 2) got 59 pts. in the SP (along with an awesome performance at Skate Detroit), and 3) that they have the 3rd highest total by a wide margin among US pairs, I think it's rather exciting ...
    That and beating Stolbova/Klomov, who are the reigning Euros bronze medallists, two-time World Junior medallists, multiple-time JGP/JGPF participants, third season on the GP, etc. Not too shabby.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  4. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by shan View Post
    Davis/Ladwig at SC.
    They performed well in the sp, but didn't get great marks. Perhaps Lindsay was placing too much pressure on herself in the fp, plus they are a new pair adjusting to performing on GP for the first time. They don't yet have a 3-twist, and they need to improve unison as well as timing on jumps and lifts. I wish them good luck.

    C/K are looking good and they have the advantage of youth, plus a good, reputable coach in Sappenfield. Donlan/Speroff apparently need more time to improve their jumps and build confidence under pressure. Do C/K have a GP assignment? I like Castelli/ Schnapir and Y/R have as yet untapped potential. I'm hoping that Rockne Brubaker is able to find a good partner and come back to make the Olympic team. U.S. pairs have solid contenders in Denney/ Coughlin, but need another pair to perform well internationally to help preserve two spots for Worlds and Olympics.

  5. #405

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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    When you consider the fact that 1) they've only been together since April of this year, 2) got 59 pts. in the SP (along with an awesome performance at Skate Detroit), and 3) that they have the 3rd highest total by a wide margin among US pairs, I think it's rather exciting ...
    Two good SPs and now they have a clear path to the Nat'l silver medal (or bronze)? I just think that's silly. I wish them the best and hope they continue to improve, but Nationals is a different beast entirely and they just got together.

  6. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    U.S. pairs have solid contenders in Denney/ Coughlin, but need another pair to perform well internationally to help preserve two spots for Worlds and Olympics.
    There are so few pairs in the world these days, it would be pretty much impossible to lose 2 spots regardless of who we send with D/C.


    S/K were definitely impressive in the SP. The LP is the true test, and that's where they look a lot more new. The program isn't great and they don't look as comfortable. But even though they made several mistakes, it's still great to see a well executed triple twist, big throws (that 3FTh still looks impressive even when not landed cleanly), and solid enough lvl 4 lifts with decent positions (even though they struggled a bit on the exit of the last one).

  7. #407

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    Congrats to Scimeca/Knierim on their win!!

    I'm hopeful about their potential, but I'm not crazy about the programs for CO Springs teams. They just look empty skating from element to element. It is impressive to see a newly matched team win an international and I hope that they get more intricate choreography as they can handle it.

  8. #408
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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    Two good SPs and now they have a clear path to the Nat'l silver medal (or bronze)? I just think that's silly. I wish them the best and hope they continue to improve, but Nationals is a different beast entirely and they just got together.
    But re-read my post. Who is in their way?

  9. #409

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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    Two good SPs and now they have a clear path to the Nat'l silver medal (or bronze)? I just think that's silly. I wish them the best and hope they continue to improve, but Nationals is a different beast entirely and they just got together.
    Their 156.00 ranks third among U.S. pairs internationally this season, behind Denney/Coughlin and Castelli/Shnapir. Scimeca/Knierim's score from Coupe de Nice is more than 10 points higher than Donlan/Speroff's SB, ~15 points higher than Vise/Baldwin's, and way, way higher than Davis/Ladwig's.

    Scores aren't always comparable between events, but S/K have shown that they have the goods to medal at Nationals if they can continue to improve their PCS and hold it together mentally.

  10. #410

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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    But re-read my post. Who is in their way?
    Fine, let's give them the 2nd World's spot now based on their 59+ SP.

    My point is that it's one thing to post a nice SP score at a summer comp and a Senior B, but they are hardly a shoe-in for a medal, let alone a top 5 finish at Nationals. It's October!

  11. #411

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    I'm interested to see how Kayne/O'Shea look at Sectionals- they scored quite well earlier this season and his programs with Christine Mozer at Sectionals last year were quite impressive as a junior- unfortunately for them, there was an injury before Nationals. I'm also looking forward to seeing teams like Denney/Frazier and Zhang/Bartholomay. That said, since Scimeca/Knierim were able to do so well at Cup of Nice, this sets them up nicely for the rest of the season- its really exciting for them to win because they are now the only team on the GP alternates list- would be fantastic for them to have a chance to attain an ISU SB this season. It's been a long road for both Alexa (I remember she battled some really tough fields at Mids as a singles skater) and Chris, so its great to see things finally coming together on a higher level for them. At the moment, I do feel Castelli/Shnapir have a great advantage in the presentation aspect over most of the US pairs and I'm rooting for them to get to Worlds this year, but I'd be pretty thrilled for whoever ends up making it (which, we'll see if anyone else besides D/C, C/S, and S/K can make the minimum score at an international comp)...

  12. #412
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    Quote Originally Posted by reese View Post
    Fine, let's give them the 2nd World's spot now based on their 59+ SP.

    My point is that it's one thing to post a nice SP score at a summer comp and a Senior B, but they are hardly a shoe-in for a medal, let alone a top 5 finish at Nationals. It's October!
    But, those SP scores are in addition to the other points I made in my earlier post: Being the 3rd highest-scoring US pair this season ... by a hefty margin no less ... after only being together for 6 months is IMO pretty eye-popping and merits them being a podium threat. I didn't say that they would be on the team!

    They don't strike me as being head-casey either. I personally can't wait to see them develop ...

  13. #413
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    Yeah, my only complaint about them is that they're a little slow.. And if they ever want to compete internationally they need a lot more speed. Obviously the SP has been their strength this year, so hopefully by the end of the season their FS will be just as good ( I think they look slow even in the SP)

  14. #414
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    I like S/K and think they have potential. Hopefully, they can somehow get a GP. It is a shame, with Pair teams dropping out of GP's like flies, that some of US's teams with potential like Z/B, S/K, and even D/F can't get a shot at the GP, while teams like D/L and Y/R get two chances at the GP and aren't ready (I know Y/R pulled out of one, but still....). Nationals should be really interesting! From 2nd on the field is fairly wide open. It's anyone's game at this point. A lot of teams have the potential to medal with a solid performance.

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    To me it's honestly anybody's game. The only pair I would say is almost certainly a sure thing is Denney & Coughlin, rightfully so. As for the rest, it's just whose game is on that day. Of course repetition repetition repetition helps, but they don't want to overdo it in case of injury. And reputation does help, but not always. A brand new team can come out of nowhere (with no prior reputation) and hit a home run. Therefore my point that "it's anybody's game".

    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DONLAN & SPEROFF!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by NadineWhite View Post
    To me it's honestly anybody's game. The only pair I would say is almost certainly a sure thing is Denney & Coughlin, rightfully so. As for the rest, it's just whose game is on that day. Of course repetition repetition repetition helps, but they don't want to overdo it in case of injury. And reputation does help, but not always. A brand new team can come out of nowhere (with no prior reputation) and hit a home run. Therefore my point that "it's anybody's game".

    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DONLAN & SPEROFF!!!!!
    Pairs is anyone's game from 2nd on. Denney and Barrett came out of nowhere to win the SP and make it to Worlds in 2009. Who would have expected that? It makes pairs in the US exciting, but I wish there was more stability. D/C, D/L, Y/R, and V/B are most likely done after 2014, but there is a lot of potential for 2018 if we can get some teams to stick it out and stay together.

  17. #417
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    Quote Originally Posted by LilJen View Post
    5Ali3, your analyses are SOOOO helpful and so detailed. You'll make experts of us all if you don't watch out!
    That's why I post!

    Duarte/Grafton: The very first time that I saw Duarte and Grafton skate, the very first element that I saw them do was a Lutz lift that failed spectacularly: I think she jumped around him (like she was rotating a Lutz, instead of just "popping" straight up, like a Lutz lift ) and he dropped her. Even at Juvenile Pairs, it's unusual to see a team miss a Lutz lift so completely! When I think about watching them compete over years, I remember their first year in Novice, struggling with an attempted double twist; Lake Placid JGP, trying new lifts and s/s triples; Junior Pairs and that remarkable wipe-out into/against the boards on a spiral sequence. Because this what I'll remember about them: they always went for it. In pairs, there's an expression that almost everyone uses: "If you're going to go, go big." Duarte and Grafton never held back in competition: they always, always went for it, each throw as big as possible, each crossover pushing out as fast as possible, each program showcasing their full technical content, even if they would have placed higher by playing it safe. Duarte/Grafton deserve the highest kudos for always competing as full-out as they practiced, and for genuinely caring more about how they were developing as a team, in the big picture, than in their placement. It was a pleasure to watch them mature, both as skaters and as individuals, and to see the mutual respect and support that they had for each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by madm View Post
    In order to skate Junior level at Nationals, only one of the partners may have passed the Senior pair test. The rules say that if both have passed the Senior pair test, then they must skate Senior level. Also, if one of the partners has ever competed at the Senior level at a qualifying competition (which Colin has not), then the pair would have to compete at the Senior level.
    In order to compete Junior at Nationals, both partners may have passed the Senior Pair test, but not together (and neither may have competed at Sectionals or Nationals in Senior Pairs). For example, Duarte and Grafton tested their Senior Pair together, so they may not compete Junior Pairs at Nationals again, even if they got back together in five years. However, Grafton, who has passed his Senior Pair test, could compete Junior Pairs with Mariel Miller, the partner with whom Rockne Brubaker passed his Senior Pair test: Miller has passed Senior Pair, but not with Grafton, so they could compete Junior Pairs since neither has competed Senior Pairs at Sectionals/Nationals.

    Quote Originally Posted by carriemarie View Post
    Pairs is anyone's game from 2nd on. Denney and Barrett came out of nowhere to win the SP and make it to Worlds in 2009. Who would have expected that?
    Denney and Barrett came out of Indy Challenge '06; by January 2009, I would have been far more surprised if they did not qualify for Worlds than by the fact that they qualified. All of which is merely to say - pairs don't come out of nowhere, but injuries/illness/crises can: unfortunately, ice is slippery and pairs is dangerous. All of these pairs being compared for spots on the World team, including Denney and Coughlin? I just hope we can see them all skate at full strength in January.

  18. #418
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    I wouldn't say Davis & Y/R would necessarily be done after 2014... I do agree though, lots of good Junior Pairs coming up the next two years (including the already upcoming D/F) should make for hopefully a bit more successful cycle next time 'round.

    Our pairs don't look exceptionally strong this year outside the top few, only the 1,4,5,8, & 9 teams from last year are returning, along with only 1 team moved up from junior, means that new formed teams that make up half the field. I think though that by the 2015 season we should have a new top 4 force to be added to the pairs we have

  19. #419
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    All the Colorado springs pairs have great potential, and they all have great technical ability. But they need a new choreographer.

  20. #420
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    Quote Originally Posted by johndockley92 View Post
    I wouldn't say Davis & Y/R would necessarily be done after 2014... I do agree though, lots of good Junior Pairs coming up the next two years (including the already upcoming D/F) should make for hopefully a bit more successful cycle next time 'round.

    I would be suprised if Caitlin went past 2014, but Davis and Reagan certainly could. They are young. I was just saying their partnerships would most likely not continue post-Olympics.

    Quote Originally Posted by 5Ali3 View Post
    Denney and Barrett came out of Indy Challenge '06; by January 2009, I would have been far more surprised if they did not qualify for Worlds than by the fact that they qualified. All of which is merely to say - pairs don't come out of nowhere, but injuries/illness/crises can: unfortunately, ice is slippery and pairs is dangerous. All of these pairs being compared for spots on the World team, including Denney and Coughlin? I just hope we can see them all skate at full strength in January.
    I agree D/B had considerable buzz in 2009 and were quite impressive before they broke up in 2006, but unless you followed skating closely you hadn't really heard of them. Besides, I suspected a good skate maybe even a 3 or 4 finish, but to win the short program against a good field with former World/Olympic team members and previous National Champions and to nearly win the long against the defending National Champions is very, very unexpected. A pair that was barely together a full season almost becoming National Champions is crazy, especially considering they weren't huge names in pairs at the time, Jeremy being more well known due to winning Junior with Shantel Jordan in 2004. It's not the same as Denney/Coughlin because both were previous National Champions and expected to win from the get-go with a fairly empty field. If that is not out of nowhere tell me what is. I can't imagine most fans or even people 'in the know' in skating truly saw that coming, but I could be wrong.

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