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  1. #161
    The wiener takes it all
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    Great post, kwanfan1818. I've now saved Comm. 1313 to my hard drive!

    For those of you interested in the Russia/Olympic Spots/Host Country topic, it was also discussed in the From Russia with Love thread last month:

    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...&postcount=798

    When it comes to Olympic spots questions, Rule 400 is your friend!!


    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    This isn't explicit in the Special Regs, but the maximums are, with no provision to add one, like they do at World Championships before the Free Skate. I believe the provision to have Host Countries have a skater in the Free Skate regardless of whether they qualify normally was dropped within the last few years. I'm not sure if the Host Country skater/team gets added to the SP/SD if there's a prelim round, if s/he/it doesn't qualify that way, or if it's just the first phase.
    Right, the rule for ISU Championships is as follows (from 2010 Figure Skating Rule 378.8, italics added by me):
    In case the Competitor(s) of the Host Member went through the normal qualifying procedure and did not qualify for the first segment of a Championships/discipline according to paragraphs 5 (Direct Entries) or 6 (Prelim Round) above, one Competitor of the Host Member shall have the right to additionally enter and participate in each discipline (Ladies, Men, Pair Skating and Ice Dance), provided the Host Member Competitor(s) fulfils the Minimum Score requirements according to paragraph 3 above. This competitor will have the starting number one (1) and in Single Skating the first warm up group will be exceeded with one (1) Skater; in Pair Skating and Ice Dance, if necessary, the first warm up group will be divided into two subgroups with a separate warm-up for each of them.
    In the 2008 Figure Skating Rules, ISU Championships – Special Technical Rules, Rule 579.6 stated:
    For the starting order in the Free Skating, when the Host Member’s Competitor is placed among the twenty-four (24) best placed Competitors in the Short Program, he will be drawn in the warm-up group according to the placing. If no Competitors of the Host Member qualified for the Free Skating, one (best placed in the Short Program) Competitor of the Host Member will have the right to participate in the Free Skating as Competitor twenty-five (25) with starting number one (1) and this warm-up group will be exceeded with one (1) Competitor.
    In the case no pairs of the Host Member qualified for the Free Skating, one (best placed in the Short Program) pair shall have the right to participate as pair number twenty-one (21) with starting number one (1). The corresponding warm-up group will be divided into two (2) subgroups with a separate warm-up for each of them.
    The infamous* Communication 1562, Cost Savings at ISU Events, May 2009, eliminated the provision from 579.6 quoted above as of the 2009/10 season. So, that is why many fans are still confused about this rule because it has changed within the last few seasons.

    *this is the communication that first cut the number of skaters making the FS at Euros/4CCs and introduced the splitting of the free skate into two sessions, with the first FS group skating in an afternoon session and the rest of the groups in the evening session. The split session FS was dropped from the rules after the 2009/10 season. The split session provision did not apply to the 2010 Winter Olympic Games.
    Last edited by HisWeirness; 05-19-2012 at 12:47 PM.

  2. #162

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    Thinking ahead a bit: I wonder if Korea has a dance or pairs team.

  3. #163

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theatregirl1122 View Post
    Technically Evan wasn't a "comeback", I don't think. He was a host pick and was in the top 24 in the World Rankings so he was also selected by another country. So technically this would not have applied to him at the time.
    I've heard conflicting information regarding whether or not last year is being counted officially as a "comeback" for Lysacek, even though he later withdrew from his 2 GP assignments. I wonder if he can or will be listed initially as a host pick for Skate America (or fill a TBA slot there?), but we'll have to wait and see what happens.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  4. #164

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    I've heard conflicting information regarding whether or not last year is being counted officially as a "comeback" for Lysacek, even though he later withdrew from his 2 GP assignments. I wonder if he can or will be listed initially as a host pick for Skate America (or fill a TBA slot there?), but we'll have to wait and see what happens.
    If the ISU wants to count last season as a comebcak season, I hope that Lysacek challenges the decision. Based on ISU rank, Lysacek qualified for one assignment plus a host pick. I could be argued, quite convincingly in a legal proceeding, that that is what he got..SA & TEB.

  5. #165
    I <3 Kozuka
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    Quote Originally Posted by HisWeirness View Post
    Right, the rule for ISU Championships is as follows (from 2010 Figure Skating Rule 378.8, italics added by me):
    Thank you so much for this -- I think I passed this in a blur last night
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  6. #166

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    If a country doesn't earn a spot at Worlds, there is a b-international in the fall where they will have an opportunity to earn one Olympic spot. And unless something has changed, the host country is always guaranteed one spot in each discipline, and that skater gets to skate in the free even if they don't qualify after the short. So Russia will definitely have at least one men's spot.
    The B's are there and could provide a spot if 2013 worlds is a problem. There is conflict over automatic slot for host country. The posts above conflict.

    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    You're doing Gachinski a massive disservice. He is more than capable of a top 5 at the minimum. They only need a top 10 finish at 2013 Worlds to have two spots for Sochi, yes?
    He could be top 10 and he can also be below top 10. I'm just thinking about non-participation as well. What if someone is assigned and withdraws. Then there is no one and you have to wait until September for a senior B to qualify. Only really trustworthy people who could win a senior B are Plushenko or Gachinski.

  7. #167
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    There is no conflict over whether the host country gets an automatic slot: it's all there in Rule 400:

    400 A&B 3: (all members): Attempt to qualify at prior year's Worlds.

    400 A&B 4: (all members): If unsuccessful, attempt to qualify one at Fall qualifying competition.

    400 A&B 5: (host nation only): If still unsuccessful,get automatic slot into the SD/SP.

    The only question was whether a lone host nation skater who didn't qualify for the FD/FS from the SD/SP got an automatic spot in the FD/FS, and the answer is "no", at least according to the current rules.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwizzlerS View Post
    Thinking ahead a bit: I wonder if Korea has a dance or pairs team.
    5 recently formed (I think all Junior IIRC) Ice Dance teams trained by Sergei Astashev.

    I don't know about any Pairs.

  9. #169

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    5 recently formed (I think all Junior IIRC) Ice Dance teams trained by Sergei Astashev.

    I don't know about any Pairs.
    There is also one new Korean-Russian dance team that is coached by Irina Zhuk and Alexander Svinin in Moscow.

  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eislauffan View Post
    There is also one new Korean-Russian dance team that is coached by Irina Zhuk and Alexander Svinin in Moscow.
    Oooh that is very interesting, thanks!

    You mean one partner is Korean and the other Russian and they're going to represent Korea?

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