2012-13 Grand Prix Pre-announcement Thread

[query5]

when i did it i got caroline 24-25--zijun was 26, cynthia was 24.
how i current rankings subtracted the 2009-2010 season from the scores, added the full weight of the 2011-2012 season and 70% 2010-2011.

also was i supposed to add the 4cc/euro with the worlds or just the highest number.

[icellist]

when i did it i got caroline 24-25--zijun was 26, cynthia was 24.
how i current rankings subtracted the 2009-2010 season from the scores, added the full weight of the 2011-2012 season and 70% 2010-2011.

also was i supposed to add the 4cc/euro with the worlds or just the highest number.

just the higher number

[barbk]

You only get to count one ISU Championship per year, right? (So take the highest points from Euros, 4CC, Worlds or Junior Worlds.)

I think this formula would better reflect realities if the current season reflected up to two ISU Championships per skater.

[SamuraiK]

You only get to count one ISU Championship per year, right? (So take the highest points from Euros, 4CC, Worlds or Junior Worlds.)

I think this formula would better reflect realities if the current season reflected up to two ISU Championships per skater.

I agree, having two Senior B count but only one ISU championship is nonsense IMO.

[DORISPULASKI]

You could 'fix' that by allowing people to count their 2nd ISU championship as a Senior B.

[Sylvia]

when i did it i got caroline 24-25--zijun was 26, cynthia was 24.

What are your total points for these 3 ladies when you added them up?

You could 'fix' that by allowing people to count their 2nd ISU championship as a Senior B.

This doesn't seem fair to the skaters from the deeper countries that often divide their ISU championship assignments among different skaters.

[barbk]

This doesn't seem fair to the skaters from the deeper countries that often divide their ISU championship assignments among different skaters.

I'm not following you here, Sylvia. If the goal is to have World Rankings that somewhat reasonably reflect actual reality, including a second ISU championship would seem to be a pretty straightforward way to do that. And I don't think too many countries divide their ISU Championship entries in such a way as to "spread the wealth" any more - though perhaps they will for 4CCs in an Olympic year depending on travel distance.

Unfortunately, the current ISU ranking system is a rather poor approximation of reality.

(I think if I had my druthers it would also reflect only two years of competitive history, not three, and that would help too.)

[oubik]

Konstantin Menshov picked up 250 points for his win at Gardena Spring Trophy which should move him into the top 24 in the ISU World Standings after the forthcoming update, thereby guaranteeing him 1 Grand Prix invitation under the current selection rules.

Not so sure Sylvia, there was not enough skaters from not enough countries in Gardena, but as far as I know there were some later withdrawels which should finally count, we will see soon.

[sandra_persch]

Not so sure Sylvia, there was not enough skaters from not enough countries in Gardena, but as far as I know there were some later withdrawels which should finally count, we will see soon.

Now there is an idea ... maybe ISU should increase the minimum requirements for Senior Bs. seriousley 5 pairs and 8 single skaters is a joke!

[Sylvia]

I'm not following you here, Sylvia. If the goal is to have World Rankings that somewhat reasonably reflect actual reality, including a second ISU championship would seem to be a pretty straightforward way to do that. And I don't think too many countries divide their ISU Championship entries in such a way as to "spread the wealth" any more - though perhaps they will for 4CCs in an Olympic year depending on travel distance.

It currently seems to be mainly USA and Japan who are spreading out the ISU Championship assignments.

Of the top 19 men in the current ISU World Standings, Chan, Takahashi, Brezina, Gachinski, Amodio, Verner, Fernandez, Contesti, Joubert, Rippon, Denis Ten, and Majorov competed at both 2012 Worlds and Four Continents/Europeans (van der Perren withdrew after the SP at Euros and Oda withdrew from his Nationals).

Hanyu, Kozuka, and Abbott (initially assigned to 4CC but WD) competed at Worlds only, not at 4CC; Machida and Miner competed at 4CC only.

Unfortunately, the current ISU ranking system is a rather poor approximation of reality.

(I think if I had my druthers it would also reflect only two years of competitive history, not three, and that would help too.)

When the 2009-10 ranking points are erased from the World Standings then the updated list -- the one used for GP selection -- will only have 2 seasons worth of points.

I think -- and many others have pointed this out -- the Senior B competitions skew the current rankings the most. Maybe the ISU should consolidate them into one Grand Prix/Senior B category so that only the best 2 count per season?

Not so sure Sylvia, there was not enough skaters from not enough countries in Gardena, but as far as I know there were some later withdrawels which should finally count, we will see soon.

The top 5 Senior ladies and men received their Senior B ranking points for Gardena in the most recent World Standings update (April 21, 2012).

[npavel]

World ranking lists has been updated.

LADIES

Seeded, guar. 2, poss. 3: Kostner, Leonova, Suzuki, Wagner, Murakami, Asada

Places 7-12 at Worlds, guaranteed 2: Kexin Zhang, Valentina Marchei, Ksenia Makarova, Elene Gedevanishvili, Viktoria Helgesson, Yretha Silete

Top 24 SB, guar. 1: Lipnitskaia*, Tuktamysheva, Czisny, Zhang, Nagasu, Gold*, Sotnikova, Korpi, Biryukova, Korobeynikova, Shelepen*, Miyahara*, Shoji*, Zijun Li*

*= junior, would need to move up to seniors internationally

Top 24 World Rankings who aren't listed above, guar. 1: Mae Berenice Meite, Joshi Helgesson, Haruka Imai, Agnes Zawadzki, Amelie Lacoste, Miki Ando?, Sarah Hecken, (Cynthia Phaneuf, Flatt, Yuna Kim? falling out of top 24)

[luenatic]

Didn't Gold move up to senior internationally at World Team Trophy?

[kwanfan1818]

Not unless the new rule passes, and then only if it's retroactive to the 2011-13 season.

[Sylvia]

Didn't Gold move up to senior internationally at World Team Trophy?

The part in post #91 npavel posted/copied above ("*= junior, would need to move up to seniors internationally") was from haribobo's Grand Prix projection posts compiled right after Worlds, before Gold was selected to World Team Trophy.

ETA:

World ranking lists has been updated.

Thank you for the heads up earlier today! I've started a new thread in GSD: ISU World Standings updated (2009-10 ranking points have been removed & 2010-11 points reduced to 70%)

[luenatic]

Thanks Sylvia. That makes sense. I thought WTT was not counted as senior event

[toddlj]

Well, if no one else is going to, let me update the men!

MEN

Places 1-6 at worlds, seeded, guaranteed 2 (no longer have option for three!): Chan, Takahashi, Hanyu, Joubert, Amodio, Brezina

Places 7-12 at Worlds, guaranteed 2: Ten, Abbott, Fernandez, Contesti, Kozuka, Reynolds

Top 24 SB, guaranteed 1: Plushenko, Gachinski, Oda, Song, Verner, Miner, Rippon, Yan (JR), Farris (JR), Mura, Brown (JR), Van der Perren (retired)

Top 24 World Rankings who aren't listed above, guaranteed 1: Majorov, Dornbush, Menshov, Machida

[oubik]

I have recieved two interesting updated information regarding ISU Grand Prix assingments for 2012:

- it would be no longer the possibility of 3 events for Top 6 from Worlds
- Pairs has to decide - either SGP or JGP.

Good decision in both cases.

Also, it sems Galyeta / Shumski of Ukraine (JGP ID finalists) split.

[Jarrett]

I have recieved two interesting updated information regarding ISU Grand Prix assingments for 2012:

- it would be no longer the possibility of 3 events for Top 6 from Worlds
- Pairs has to decide - either SGP or JGP.

Good decision in both cases.

Also, it sems Galyeta / Shumski of Ukraine (JGP ID finalists) split.

At least people will stop complaining about people getting three chances to gain points now.

[pani]

When we will know GP event participants?

[Sylvia]

I posted this earlier in the thread:

Phil Hersh's recent article on Gracie Gold and WTT mentioned that the Grand Prix assignments would be on made on May 19, which is a Saturday.

Can anyone else confirm this date?

Thanks for the new info, oubik!