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  1. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Frank Carroll may be a very good coach for some people, but this doesn't mean he's right for Mirai at this time. Maybe they'd rather attribute the breakup to the distance than criticize each other.
    Quote Originally Posted by modern_muslimah View Post
    Just like it was over for Carolina and Michelle when they left Frank.
    Consider the source.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    It's over for Mirai. If she was truly committed to being the best skater she could be she would have found a way to move closer to Frank.
    I don't agree with this assessment. The last two years haven't made her a better skater so it's obvious this combination isn't yielding the kind of results either have expected. Three years and not much progress? It's time to move on and find a situation that does work. Frank isn't going to change and Mirai isn't getting any younger...

    Staying put is what's easier to do. A lot of the time it takes more courage to walk away and try something different and unknown.

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by modern_muslimah View Post
    Just like it was over for Carolina and Michelle when they left Frank.
    Well Michelle looked like she could have used Frank's coaching at the 2002 Olympics instead of her dad being there instead. Plus Carolina and Michelle were much more accomplished then Mirai who has been falling in the standings for two years now and has somewhat a reputation of not training as hard as she needs to.

  4. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    ...Mirai who has been falling in the standings for two years now and has somewhat a reputation of not training as hard as she needs to.
    A coach can't make a skater train harder. That has to come from within the skater. A coach can help a skater train smarter, can help find the right people to work with the skater - choreographers, psychologists, trainers, etc. But the want to work and the desire to be a champion has to start with the athlete. Frank may be a fabulous coach, but if it is not working for Mirai, then they need to part and move on. Time will tell if Mirai has it within herself to be the best in the world. Athletic talent alone will not get her there, ask Mr. Sandhu about that!
    A good rant is cathartic. Ranting is what keeps me sane. They always come from a different place. Take the prime minister, for example. Sometimes when I rant about him, I am angry; other times, I am just severely annoyed - it's an important distinction. - Rick Mercer

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    It's over for Mirai. If she was truly committed to being the best skater she could be she would have found a way to move closer to Frank.
    I agree Mirai didn't look like she wanted to be at Nationals. She almost looked disinterested. She hasn't skated with any fire for some time now. Maybe she wants to do something else, but I think this the beginning of the end too!

  6. #86

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    I hope that Mirai finds the coach who is right for her; and finds joy in training/competing/skating again.

    Frank is a truly great coach. I don't think that he's quite ready to retire.
    He seems to work best with people who are already highly motivated and disciplined.
    At this point in his career, he shouldn't have to "develop" talent.
    I'm sure he won't lack for students, if he wants them.
    Remember, Evan intends to return to competition, also.

  7. #87
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    Mirai did not seem happy under Frank's tutelage. And if someone is not happy, it doesn't bode well for them to succeed. Perhaps new coaches will help her find the spark, like happened (eventually) for Zhang and Wagner.

    And many elite skaters train with more than one coach. They tend to have a primary coach and then ones to help with them choreography/edges, spins, jumps, etc. I don't think it is particularly dramatic that she will be working with multiple coaches. She will only have one with her at a competition, and I'm assuming she will choose the one she feels she has the best working relationship with to be her primary coach. Let's just wish her well on her new path rather than trying to make something so dramatic out of it.
    I meant to take the high road.... but I missed the exit.

  8. #88
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    I see just about zero chance that Mirai will go to Arutunian, since he's at Lake Arrowhead and that's a long--and arguably dangerous--drive. She seems to like skating at Pickwick and East-West and I know she was trying out one or two coaches at East-West, which is a reasonable commute from Irvine. I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up with someone like Alex Chang. Whoever she ends up with, I hope he/she has better luck dealing with her mother than her past coaches have.
    Last edited by Doubletoe; 04-04-2012 at 07:28 PM.

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    It's been shown that when Mirai has a coach who goes easier on her she tends to slack off even more. Charlene Wong wasn't a taskmaster like Frank but Mirai even admitted that she wasn't working as hard as she should under Wong. Now she's being coached by 4 people we've never heard of? This is not the way to get back on top.

  10. #90
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    Just because people have never heard of a coach doesn't mean he (or she) isn't an excellent coach. It simply means he is not a self-promoter and/or hasn't had a prominent skater fall into his lap yet. Sometimes a coach will just be fortunate enough to end up with a world class skater and gets other famous skaters because they assume he must be good.
    Last edited by Doubletoe; 04-04-2012 at 07:38 PM.

  11. #91
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    Her mother seems to be in the way of a lot of things.
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

  12. #92

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    Hmmmm I'm not sure how credible Hersh's tweets are...

    I heard her trial with Alex Chang before he left for Worlds didn't work out.. he team coaches with Jere Michaels, so Jere is out of the picture as well. Also Craig Heath is in Idaho. If her mom didn't help her move to Cathedral City, why would she let her move to Idaho?

    I just don't believe whatever Hersh writes....

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChibiChibi View Post
    Hmmmm I'm not sure how credible Hersh's tweets are...

    I heard her trial with Alex Chang before he left for Worlds didn't work out.. he team coaches with Jere Michaels, so Jere is out of the picture as well. Also Craig Heath is in Idaho. If her mom didn't help her move to Cathedral City, why would she let her move to Idaho?

    I just don't believe whatever Hersh writes....
    I must admit I wondered about his facts when he said, "Nagasu apparently will work with several coaches at Pickwick - close to home - including Weldy Olson, Jere Michael, Craig Heath, Alex Chang," since not all of those coaches actually coach at Pickwick. . . Well, if Alex isn't going to be working with her, good for him! He seems like a very nice guy and I wouldn't wish that kind of headache on him.

  14. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by skatesindreams View Post
    I hope that Mirai finds the coach who is right for her; and finds joy in training/competing/skating again.

    Frank is a truly great coach. I don't think that he's quite ready to retire.
    He seems to work best with people who are already highly motivated and disciplined.
    At this point in his career, he shouldn't have to "develop" talent.
    I'm sure he won't lack for students, if he wants them.
    Yup, all of this.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Isn't that quite a different specialty, though - working with learn-to-skate kids or lower level skaters vs. training elite skaters? And especially if you're looking at very popular skaters who work with multiple world-class skaters, when would they have the time to work with kids?
    Is it?

    Tons of skaters need to fix edge issues, rotation issues, basic skating skills, and sometimes get triple axels and quads or lutzes consistent. Top notch coaches would seem to need to be to be good technichal coaches. They need to be able to teach basics. Hell, I guess learning good basics is more important to the skater's career than any future packaging will ever be in case their basics were screwed. And I don't get why they wouldn't choose a few kids to bring up on their own, so that they don't have to deal with fixing flaws later on, which is hard to do.

    Are those big names mostly taking up fully formed kids and just pack them up with better choreographies, better costumes, better music choices, and of course their well known name and reputation?


    Quote Originally Posted by attyfan View Post
    Since Kwan was 12 or so when she started with Carroll, he may well have taught her the more "advanced" triples (lutz, etc.) ... espcially since (IIRC)financial considerations made her coachless for a while before working with Frank. Carroll sometimes sent Michelle (and other skaters) to Rafael Artourian (sp?) for work on jump technique.
    He might have, or he did do?


    Quote Originally Posted by PDilemma View Post
    I taught writing to high school juniors and seniors. I had not taught them to form their letters in kindergarten. Someone who has the gifts and knowledge to teach that age, level and skill did that.
    But if teaching how to stroke, turn, spin and jump is not a skill the most well known coaches have, why are skaters with technical issues going to them? And who should they be going to? And do such well reputed coaches deserve their reputation for being good at wrapping up the package? Is that the hard part?

  16. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by IceAlisa View Post
    Her mother seems to be in the way of a lot of things.
    Yeah, hmmmm. . . could it just be a cultural difference?

    I really, really hope she can get her act together. She's amazingly talented and it's been NO fun at all seeing her languish.

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubletoe View Post
    I must admit I wondered about his facts when he said, "Nagasu apparently will work with several coaches at Pickwick - close to home - including Weldy Olson, Jere Michael, Craig Heath, Alex Chang," since not all of those coaches actually coach at Pickwick. . . Well, if Alex isn't going to be working with her, good for him! He seems like a very nice guy and I wouldn't wish that kind of headache on him.
    Well, it could be a headache, or it could be an opportunity. Since you seem to have some knowledge of so. California rinks and coaches. could you fill us in on these rumored coaches? Do any of them coach out of Pickwich? I read the bio of this Craig Heath coach. He does show skating and works out of Sun Valley and Hong Kong??? What would he possibly bring that could help Mirai? I know in the past Hersh has gotten some info on the Carrol/Nagasu relationship directly from Carrol, so that may be the source for his current Twitter message.

  18. #98
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    I would have preferred to see Nagasu with John Nicks. John would have made her either work her butt off and leave the excuses OR he would have just told her to go somewhere else. Also, he's not letting any rink moms boss him around. he was enjoying retirement just fine.

  19. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by b-man View Post
    I know in the past Hersh has gotten some info on the Carrol/Nagasu relationship directly from Carrol, so that may be the source for his current Twitter message.
    I'm sure he got all the names of the coaches from Frank...otherwise why would he know about them? But maybe it's possible that he misunderstood Frank...

    It's possible that Frank could have told him that Mirai would be "trying out" with those coaches, not "working" with them....just sayin'

  20. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChibiChibi View Post
    I'm sure he got all the names of the coaches from Frank...otherwise why would he know about them? But maybe it's possible that he misunderstood Frank...

    It's possible that Frank could have told him that Mirai would be "trying out" with those coaches, not "working" with them....just sayin'
    Agree, makes sense.

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