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  1. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by ponta1 View Post
    I have no idea why she didn't move with him, however, by all accounts, I don't think she comes from a particularly wealthy family, so perhaps finances might have had something to do with it? I don't know; probably shouldn't even be making speculations about it.
    If you recall, Mirai's mom went through a bout with thyroid cancer (which for those not in the know, is probably one of the better cancers you can get, between surgery and radioactive iodine therapy, the most common form is usually taken care of). Mirai is very close to her Mom, and I'm guessing that Mom still influences her heavily and didn't want her away from home.

    That said, I wish Mirai had struck out on her own. I think she needs to take responsibility for herself and her skating and the hard work that it requires. I'm not surprised by this breakup either; however, I think Mirai's work ethic (or lack thereof) just wasn't blending with Frank's "my way or the highway" style" and that may have been more of a factor than a long commute. It's sad though when I think of the Mirai that Frank mentored to the 2010 Olympics. They seemed sympatico then and her she really appeared to believe in his regimen of hard work. I'm really wondering if she is willing to work that hard again. This is all conjecture on my part, but thought I'd put in my 2 cents like everyone else.
    "Once you've skated together long enough, and you're really good friends, you can close your eyes, put your hand out and she's right there." Joe Dolkiewicz, 2011 US Novice Pairs Bronze Medalist

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by loulou View Post
    I'll start naming Mishin. Can you guys keep the list going?
    Linda Leaver was Brian Boitano's coach throughout his career.
    "Once you've skated together long enough, and you're really good friends, you can close your eyes, put your hand out and she's right there." Joe Dolkiewicz, 2011 US Novice Pairs Bronze Medalist

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Does Mishin work with kids at a very early stage?
    Doesn't/Didn't him?


    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Carolina Kostner has been with Michael Huth since she was 14 or so - excepting the ill-advised detour to Carroll in the 2009-10 season, which shows he's not necessarily right for everyone (so Gracie Gold can stay where she is).

    Florent Amodio, Brian Joubert and Irina Slutskaya stuck with their childhood coaches well into their senior career - actually, I think Irina never left, Joubert left Guyon only to return later on, and Amodio still works part-time with his first coach. IIRC, Tom Z was pretty much Ryan Bradley's only coach. And wasn't Michelle Kwan quite young when she went to Carroll?

    How long has Hanyu been with his coach?
    Quote Originally Posted by Yazmeen View Post
    Linda Leaver was Brian Boitano's coach throughout his career.
    My question wasn't really what achieving skaters were actually brought up by the coaches they were with when they actually achieved their results, but rather what well reputed coaches, those that skaters go to when they're looking to improve their results, have actually thought kids how to stroke, turn, spin and jump.

    -- Also, what jumps did Carroll teach Kwan and Huth teach Kostner?

    I'm asking all honest questions here, not rhetorical ones.

  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by loulou View Post
    My question wasn't really what achieving skaters were actually brought up by the coaches they were with when they actually achieved their results, but rather what well reputed coaches, those that skaters go to when they're looking to improve their results, have actually thought kids how to stroke, turn, spin and jump.
    Isn't that quite a different specialty, though - working with learn-to-skate kids or lower level skaters vs. training elite skaters? And especially if you're looking at very popular skaters who work with multiple world-class skaters, when would they have the time to work with kids?

    I suppose Tom Z at least at some point worked with young skaters, since Ryan Bradley was with him for so long. And Priscilla Hill coached Johnny Weir from the time he started skating until he went to Galina, so I guess we can add her to the list of coaches who have done developmental work as well as coached top skaters.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by loulou View Post
    ... My question wasn't really what achieving skaters were actually brought up by the coaches they were with when they actually achieved their results, but rather what well reputed coaches, those that skaters go to when they're looking to improve their results, have actually thought kids how to stroke, turn, spin and jump.

    -- Also, what jumps did Carroll teach Kwan ... ?

    I'm asking all honest questions here, not rhetorical ones.
    Since Kwan was 12 or so when she started with Carroll, he may well have taught her the more "advanced" triples (lutz, etc.) ... espcially since (IIRC)financial considerations made her coachless for a while before working with Frank. Carroll sometimes sent Michelle (and other skaters) to Rafael Artourian (sp?) for work on jump technique.

    Some skaters go to Frank to improve their artistry (Tim Goebel, for example).

  6. #66
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    I have no idea where she'll go from here, but it's a good move. If something isn't working, it needs to be fixed. Frank Carroll is one of the best if not THE best coach in the world...BUT it takes a special kind of skater to succeed under his care: motivated, self-starters who want to be the best and put in every effort to be the best (ref. Michelle or Evan). It's obvious the Frank/Mirai combo hasn't been particuarly effective past that first year they worked together. It's time for a change.

    My first choice is to send her to Artunian. Mirai seemed really happy when she described working with him and maybe that's what she needs. Mirai's psyche isn't the strongest (something else she should work on) so maybe she needs a softer approach. Hopefully she'll take it upon herself to put in the work and the more relaxed atmosphere might help to alleviate some of the pressure and she'll be more relaxed in competition.

    With any luck this parting of the ways with Frank means Mirai will break from Lori as well. Kudos to her for putting together a signature program for Mirai (her Pirates SP), but it's obvious they've outgrown each other. Lori hasn't lost her touch (see Carolina and Mao's programs) but she hasn't given Mirai anything decent in the past two years either. Maybe branching out from Frank will inspire her to branch out from Lori as well.

    I'm not surprised for this news but like I said, if something isn't working you need to fix it. I'm optimistic about this. I think a change of personnel/scenery is just what Mirai needs. I mean look at Ashley; she moved, got a new coach and she's the US champ and 4th in the world. It's important to keep growing as a skater and that's what Ashley did last year. Mirai hasn't really grown much since she started working with Frank...it's like she peaked that first year they were together, remained somewhat stagnant the second year, and actually went backwards this past year.

    Mirai's talent is undeniable. She just has to find the person who is going to bring it out of her. Frank tapped into her talent back in 2010; now she's gotta find someone who can bring it out of her completely.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    .

    My first choice is to send her to Artunian. Mirai seemed really happy when she described working with him and maybe that's what she needs. Mirai's psyche isn't the strongest (something else she should work on) so maybe she needs a softer approach.
    I've never gotten the idea that Arutunian has a "soft" approach. In fact, I've heard completely the opposite.

  8. #68

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    There' a new thread somewhere (Trashcan?) that Mirai has a) just learned to drive and b) just started taking art courses (local college, maybe community) and is thrilled. Here's what I think: she's not going to move anywhere, and most definitely not out of California, but probably will still live at home. I didn't know about the Irvine piece, but it makes sense that she is starting with some courses this summer to get in the groove for real college, even if it will be part time. But, I don't think a beginner driver would drive two hours on highways for anything. So, find a coach for her near her home.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev Johnston View Post
    I've never gotten the idea that Arutunian has a "soft" approach. In fact, I've heard completely the opposite.
    When I say "soft" I mean he doesn't seem to be as serious as Frank appears to be:


    Arutunian, who also coached Michelle Kwan and Mao Asada at times during their careers, is known as a technical coach, but Nagasu said his greatest strength is a keen sense of humor.

    "The way he teaches me is just different from all my coaches, and I really enjoy that, and it's a lot of fun for me to work with him because he gets really into my lessons," she said. "I feel that when a coach is trying their best for me, I just try my best as well. It's an automatic reaction. I feel that a lot with Rafael, so I just really enjoy his lessons."
    I don't imagine there's a ton of laughing that goes on with Frank. He's about business and some skaters are all about business as well. But Mirai seems like she functions better when things are a bit lighter and it seems as though she gets that with Arutunian. Maybe a different approach is what she needs and she said that kind of approach makes her want to give it her all...

    The first time I read this back in January I figured if things didn't go well at nationals Mirai and Frank would end up splitting. The results of their pairing were great that first year but somewhat disappointing since then. Given his experience and track record paired with her talent, I expected more. It hasn't worked out that way so it's time for Mirai to set and find what will work.

    It's purely my unimportant opinion, but it seems like RA would be a good fit for her...

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Does Mishin work with kids at a very early stage?
    There was a link to a youtube video posted here not long ago (within past year maybe) of Mishin giving a clinic to a group of young (pretty early stage) skaters that was so charming and very impressive how wonderful he was with them. I don't know what his normal student load is as far as developmental coaching, but one got the impression that he is great teaching at that level and enjoyed it too.

    ETA: Here is a link to the thread where that video link was originally posted, and a direct link to the video. It's really cute:
    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...70#post3360370
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM0f5...eature=related

    Sorry for throwing the thread completely off topic.
    Last edited by AYS; 04-04-2012 at 03:30 PM.
    Disclaimer: The post contained herein represents the opinions of a fan and may or may not bear any relation to reality.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by AYS View Post
    There was a link to a youtube video posted here not long ago (within past year maybe) of Mishin giving a clinic to a group of young (pretty early stage) skaters that was so charming and very impressive how wonderful he was with them. I don't know what his normal student load is as far as developmental coaching, but one got the impression that he is great teaching at that level and enjoyed it too.
    From what I recall, Mishin has always done a lot of work with developmental skaters during summer seminars and camps. If I'm remembering correctly, I believe workshops and seminars like that were the meat & potatoes of his work back in the days of the USSR.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjane45 View Post
    What would be surprising? Relocation is common, right? Would it be the distance from major cities or relatively small (pure speculation) training facility?
    It would be surprising because Frank has been making retirement noises for a while now.

    It wouldn't be surprising if he were even just 10 years younger though.
    Actual bumper sticker series: Jesus is my co-pilot. Satan is my financial advisor. Budha is my therapist. L. Ron Hubbard owes me $50.

  13. #73

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    I worry about Mirai... be strong, be good, be happy and finally show us some of those wise ass cali girl street urchin attitude on ice. Take more control of her own destiny and work on programs she can relate to, hopefully around good POSITIVE people.

    She has the talent, but need to get herself sorted asap. It would be a waste if she ends up squander all that talent as the window of opportunity is getting smaller.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zemgirl View Post
    Isn't that quite a different specialty, though - working with learn-to-skate kids or lower level skaters vs. training elite skaters? And especially if you're looking at very popular skaters who work with multiple world-class skaters, when would they have the time to work with kids?
    I taught writing to high school juniors and seniors. I had not taught them to form their letters in kindergarten. Someone who has the gifts and knowledge to teach that age, level and skill did that.

    Or, for another analogy, you might learn where to place your fingers on an instrument in elementary school band class, but if you're going to be a professional in a nationally renowned symphony, you don't stay with that teacher. You shoot for the teachers at Juilliard who likely spend very little time teaching children where their fingers go. Right?

  15. #75
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    Well, it's obvious the current arrangement wasn't working, so if moving closer wasn't an option, this was the only thing left to do.

    Sounds like she has the right idea though- more balance, and a team of coaches closer to home. At least this is fine now, but if she plans on staying in skating long-term, she might want to narrow it down to a single coach (or pair of coaches).

    She's still relatively young. Now, we have skaters like Kostner and Suzuki hitting their peak in their mid-20s.

  16. #76
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    Mishin has girls and boys around ten years old in his group, I remember he had Tarasenko since that age too, and the girls I dont remember their names but they have just started competing to RN. he got Arthur, Liza, Plu, Yag from early age, I think arthur is the earliest around 9. Before 9-10 I think his wife trains them.

    I hope Mirai competes next season, her 2009-2010 season was

  17. #77
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    It's over for Mirai. If she was truly committed to being the best skater she could be she would have found a way to move closer to Frank.

  18. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by AYS View Post
    There was a link to a youtube video posted here not long ago (within past year maybe) of Mishin giving a clinic to a group of young (pretty early stage) skaters that was so charming and very impressive how wonderful he was with them. I don't know what his normal student load is as far as developmental coaching, but one got the impression that he is great teaching at that level and enjoyed it too.

    Sorry for throwing the thread completely off topic.
    Aw, that's nice. What a great opportunity for the kids!

    I like OT

    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    It's over for Mirai. If she was truly committed to being the best skater she could be she would have found a way to move closer to Frank.
    Frank Carroll may be a very good coach for some people, but this doesn't mean he's right for Mirai at this time. Maybe they'd rather attribute the breakup to the distance than criticize each other.

  19. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    It's over for Mirai. If she was truly committed to being the best skater she could be she would have found a way to move closer to Frank.
    Just like it was over for Carolina and Michelle when they left Frank.
    "If people are looking for guarantees, they should buy appliances at Sears and stay away from human relationships."~Prancer

  20. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by agalisgv View Post
    Supposedly Frank found a family in Palm Springs for Mirai to live with for free, but Mirai's mom said no. So finances weren't the issue iirc.
    That may be a challenging problem.

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