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  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock2 View Post
    Blues for Klook is a great piece of music and I don't think judges hate it. My problem with that music is that it is so dense in terms of content and phrasing it's hard to interpret it perfectly without exhausting yourself in the program. As a result, I feel that Dai didn't use half the notes and phrases and skated through a lot of it without acknowledging many of the musical nuances...or not interpreting them well enough. To me that's why IN is a bit back. He was emotionally invested but didn't interpret all that the music brought to the table.

    Rodrigo on the other hand, while being slightly overused now is very even paced and allowed Lori and Patrick to use pretty much every note and phrase, thus the higher marks IMHO.
    So in other words Dai was punished for using more challenging music and he should stick to grossly overused warhorses like Aranjuez? That sucks.

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheylana View Post
    So in other words Dai was punished for using more challenging music and he should stick to grossly overused warhorses like Aranjuez? That sucks.
    No, he's being punished for stripping out much of the choreography which we saw in Mississauga, wherein he seemed to become the music. The version of his program we saw at Worlds was a pale shadow the program he debuted in Mississauga.

  3. #43

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    Dai needs only to skate to music he feels and to the best of his ability. If he skates clean and still does not get the color medal that he deserves, it is not because he is doing anything wrong. The performances he skates are his legacy and those are what illustrate his greatness. Daisuke's Blues for Klook is a masterpiece.

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Excuse me while I vomit.
    Yes me too!!!

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by arakwafan2006 View Post
    Takahashi in competition cuts the natural rideout of his jumps short. In practice his jumps are nice and clean looking but in competition he rushes his landings and they look stiff and stilted.
    I think this is a very important point. A lot of the difference between Chan and Takahashi is coming from within GOE.

  6. #46

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    He needs to skate for Canada and change his name to Patrick Chan. Otherwise he has no chance. Not because he woudn't have the skills, but because the judges are only humans and have their favourites. And that's sad!

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    Eh, besides QUADS, he needs better SPEED, better SKATING SKILL, better EDGES, better TRANSITIONS, better CHOREOGRAPHY, better PROGRAM to show off his skill and body line, better STYLE, more COMPLEX FOOTWORK...
    How is that even possible? Do you want the ISU to add a level 5 for step sequences?

    You're extreme even for an uber, so I won't dignify the rest of it with a response. Past a certain point any attempt at a discussion becomes ridiculous.

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Louis View Post
    I think this is a very important point. A lot of the difference between Chan and Takahashi is coming from within GOE.
    While I applaud his music choices, is there a way to tone down how frenetic he looks during programs? He always appears to be firing on all cylinders all the time which can leave elements looking unfinished and sloppy.
    "Once you've skated together long enough, and you're really good friends, you can close your eyes, put your hand out and she's right there." Joe Dolkiewicz, 2011 US Novice Pairs Bronze Medalist

  9. #49
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    As I mentioned in the Worlds FS thread, Hanyu picked up more GOE points than Takahashi in the long program (13 to 8). Unfortunately, his 3 loop usually gets 0 to negative GOE (as it did in Nice), and the judges have been calling his 3 flip a lip on occasion as well.

    I would like to think that if he cleans up some of his elements (better, longer landing edges as well), he will get higher component scores (one can only hope).

    Interestingly Blues for Klook has been used in programs for close to 20 years, so while not overused, it's still been used in skating (and gymnastics) programs to an extent.

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by snoopysnake View Post
    Dai needs only to skate to music he feels and to the best of his ability. If he skates clean and still does not get the color medal that he deserves, it is not because he is doing anything wrong. The performances he skates are his legacy and those are what illustrate his greatness. Daisuke's Blues for Klook is a masterpiece.
    I have to agree with your assessment. Dai put his heart and soul into his programs this season, I saw brilliance from him this season, and still Patrick came out ahead, it may always be like that. I am still scratcng my head about the sloppy comments.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seerek View Post
    I would like to think that if he cleans up some of his elements (better, longer landing edges as well), he will get higher component scores (one can only hope).
    Asada also has that problem.

    In contrast, Suzuki holds her landings beautifully this season.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Asada also has that problem.

    In contrast, Suzuki holds her landings beautifully this season.
    thanks for that. I've always hated her landings. Worst moment she has.

    Back to the topic at hand...

  13. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by kittyjake5 View Post
    I have to agree with your assessment. Dai put his heart and soul into his programs this season, I saw brilliance from him this season, and still Patrick came out ahead, it may always be like that. I am still scratcng my head about the sloppy comments.
    He may have earlier in the season, but I was disappointed with the Worlds version of the LP. I thought the version I saw in Mississauga was one of the his best programs ever, second only to his 2010 Olympic programs (my all-time favourites).

    He performed it brilliantly but it was not the program I fell in love with.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Excuse me while I vomit.
    I'll meet you in the vomitorium.

  15. #55

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    I guess the question is whether Takahashi's goal is to outpoint Chan (and Hanyu) at all costs, or go down trying, or to skate the best possible programs that he is capable of skating and to take whatever medals that might earn him.

    With the first approach, I think losing big is more likely than winning big, which is why I'd rather see the latter.

  16. #56
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    I feel it comes down to jumps. Period.

    Chans jumps tend to carry over the ice farther while Takahashi's jumps have an "straight up and down" technique.
    Chan has a bit more speed into, but more importantly OUT OF his jumps: better running edge.

    Also think that Chan has shown a fairly consistent quad for 2 years now and Takahashi seems to be still working his consistency back. That plays in the judges minds...

    I am not a Chan fan btw- I do hope and believe that Takahashi will defeat him soon...

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanette View Post
    I'll meet you in the vomitorium.
    LOL- Love it!

  18. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanette View Post
    I'll meet you in the vomitorium.
    Is there room for one more.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by carriemarie View Post
    I feel it comes down to jumps. Period.

    Chans jumps tend to carry over the ice farther while Takahashi's jumps have an "straight up and down" technique.
    Chan has a bit more speed into, but more importantly OUT OF his jumps: better running edge.

    Also think that Chan has shown a fairly consistent quad for 2 years now and Takahashi seems to be still working his consistency back. That plays in the judges minds...

    I am not a Chan fan btw- I do hope and believe that Takahashi will defeat him soon...
    Takahashi is 26 years old. His jumps are not going to get any better.

  20. #60
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    Chan has such amazing glide over the ice that it's like catnip to judges. That's extremely hard to compete with, and it's also hard to acquire. With that in mind, I think the only way Takahashi can successfully compete with Chan is to continue to play to his own strengths (charisma, characterization and exciting choreography) while skating clean programs that include a clean quad in the short and a clean quad and quad-triple in the long. Only a clean Takahashi with the same technical content as Chan can beat Chan, who typically makes a mistake or two. The fact that Takahashi is finally landing quads again this year is very encouraging.
    I also agree that Takahashi needs to work on holding his jump landings in his programs, especially in the second half when he's a little tired. It won't be easy, but it will be a lot easier than acquiring Patrick's incredible glide.

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