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  1. #21
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    Keep being as cool! I think the choice of music prevented him of getting better PcS....feel the judges didn't buy into that music, although I feel Dai is the only one that can do it justice. Aranjuez is much more judge pleasing in comparison, though IMO hate that violin version ad nauseum
    About transitions, Dai has more than enough! Every jump except the 2 3A and the quad had transitions going in and out and his footwork is out of this world
    What happens right now, is that Patrick Chan atm is at his peak and he clearly has qualities above the rest of the field that make him almost unbeatable. just compare Takahashi from last season to this one, the advance in his ss and everything else is superb. I don't know what he has to do to have Chan glide, but I still enjoy him the most out of everyone and he's one heck of a skater!

  2. #22

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    Kevin van der Perren mentioned in his IN interview that it's easy to see which skaters started out in the 6.0 system and which one grew up with the IJS, and I think it's pretty obvious that he's right; the emphasis in the training would have been very different and it's so difficult to change some things at an older age. But Dai is among the few skaters remaining who made the transition to senior even before the current system came in, and it's harder to see those 6.0 origins in his case. It's a credit to him that he has been able to adjust to the IJS so well.

    I'm not sure what more he can do. His quad may never be as consistent as those of some of the other guys, probably due in large part to the injury he sustained back in 2008, so adding it to the SP or putting in a 4-3 will remain a risk. He's improved his spins. His programs this year have been fantastic and at times should probably have gotten him better marks than they did. Some things are just out of his hands.

  3. #23

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    In FS, Chan was clearly behind the music, and even he admitted that in an interview and said probably that was why he fell and missed the 2A. He got one point of deduction for time violation because he couldn't finish his performance with the music. Yet, he received more points in IN than Takahashi, who was in perfect tune with the music from the first to the last note.

    So, what does Takahashi need to do?

  4. #24
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    He needs to wear a Patrick Chan mask so the judges think he is Patrick Chan, and thus score him how they would score Patrick Chan for skating that particular performance, which in many cases this season would have been higher than what they scored the real Patrick Chan. However since they know he is not Patrick Chan, outskating the real one still gives no chance whatsoever of victory.

  5. #25
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    Actually, just the mask wont do it his feet will let him down as an imposter. What he has to do is get Patrick's feet.

    Once he does he will get Patrick's marks.

  6. #26
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    He would also have to fall and stumble several times and be sure to keep a zombie expression on his masked face to convince it is Chan. A clean performance or any feel or passion for the performance or music would immediately give away that it is not Chan.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeko View Post
    In FS, Chan was clearly behind the music, and even he admitted that in an interview and said probably that was why he fell and missed the 2A. He got one point of deduction for time violation because he couldn't finish his performance with the music. Yet, he received more points in IN than Takahashi, who was in perfect tune with the music from the first to the last note.

    So, what does Takahashi need to do?
    But there is more to IN than being in perfect tune with the music.

  8. #28

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    Daisuke need to develop those Patrick Chan psychedelic eyes capable to hypnotize the judges into submission.

    Or

    ask ISU to enforce the new rule: skater must wear boxes on their head to hide their true identity while doing their bits and pieces, so anonymous judging can meet anonymous skaters!!!

    ...but

    even that won't work! Because you know the ever resourceful Patrick Chan will manage a way to boost those PCS somehow, after all what does PCS stand for except for Patrick Chan Score? It was a destiny made in heaven.

    Takahashi can not fight destiny, so he must over throw it by revolution! 4 revolutions TWICE in the same program infact!! It would be the battle of all ages, but I suspect a young obiwan may soon sneak past them with his own Pooh bear force.

    It would be awesome to watch... so Epsiode 1 - The Phantom Menace has already began. Will we start to experience the Attack of the Patrick clones? Or will we be seeing the Revenge of the Seethe [aka skating forum eyeballs]? Personally I am leaning on A New Hope in Hanyu who will hopefully lead the Empire Strike Back until finally we have Return of the Jedi to defend the figure skating universe again, maybe Plushy or Evan or Lambiel?
    Last edited by os168; 04-03-2012 at 08:08 PM.

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by A judge View Post
    But there is more to IN than being in perfect tune with the music.
    Your definition of interpretation does not seem to align with that of the ISU:
    • Effortless movement in time to the music (timing)
    • Expression of the music’s style, character and rhythm
    • Use of finesse to reflect the nuances of the music

    Perhaps you can explain how a skater who is behind the music can possibly be doing any of those things?

    The other bullet points are for pairs/dance. There is a longer explanation of the criteria here.

  10. #30
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    agreed

    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    Eh, besides QUADS, he needs better SPEED, better SKATING SKILL, better EDGES, better TRANSITIONS, better CHOREOGRAPHY, better PROGRAM to show off his skill and body line, better STYLE, more COMPLEX FOOTWORK...
    Takahashi in competition cuts the natural rideout of his jumps short. In practice his jumps are nice and clean looking but in competition he rushes his landings and they look stiff and stilted.

    He does need reliable quads in every outing as well. I'm glad he's not playing around with that quad flip in big events anymore. The toe gives him enough trouble. That goes to show how hard those jumps are. Clearly Dai has been doing them for about a decade but they are tough. The improvement in his axel over the past couple years is superb.

  11. #31

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    It is clear to me that what Dai needs is legs that have never been injured .

    Love Dai but don't really think he can put a 4/3 in SP or even the FS. No matter what he does he will always have to overcome the serious injury/surgery/season out.

    Patrick is amazing and I enjoy watching him but I simply don't feel the emotion from him like I do from Dai. This doesn't mean that others don't feel the passion in Patrick's performance, just that I don't.

  12. #32
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    I think if Chan becomes better in the emotion department he will be unbeatable, even by Takahashi or Hanyu. This year I would have liked to see Takahashi win, but Chan is improving each year and if in 2013 he comes across as more genuine as far as what he tries to portray on the ice, I don't think anyone will be able to beat him.

    At this moment I mostly enjoy watching Takahashi more, be it competition or exhibition. It's amazing how he recovered from surgeries and injuries and whatnot, perhaps that's why there is so much joy and emotion shining through him when he skates, just realising how lucky he is to be back in form on the ice.

    I'm alreadly looking forward to next season's competitions.

  13. #33
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    Skate better and jump higher than Chan, pure and simple.

  14. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I was just watching Chan's and Takahashi's exhibition skates last night and thought to myself: Takahashi is the better performer / artist but Chan is definitely the better skater. Takahashi is effortless in his expressions and Chan is effortless in his glides..
    Very well said. And I would add that judges value skating skills more than artistry/performance. No one is going to beat Chan or Kostner with comparable technical content. Both Chan and Kostner also have excellent in-betweens to show off their superior skating skills. A skater is going to have to signficantly exceed them technically to beat them. With Kostner , that's quite doable, but Chan controls his own destiny.

  15. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by sadya View Post
    I think if Chan becomes better in the emotion department he will be unbeatable, even by Takahashi or Hanyu. This year I would have liked to see Takahashi win, but Chan is improving each year and if in 2013 he comes across as more genuine as far as what he tries to portray on the ice, I don't think anyone will be able to beat him.

    At this moment I mostly enjoy watching Takahashi more, be it competition or exhibition. It's amazing how he recovered from surgeries and injuries and whatnot, perhaps that's why there is so much joy and emotion shining through him when he skates, just realising how lucky he is to be back in form on the ice.

    I'm alreadly looking forward to next season's competitions.
    I think its hard to know who will or won't be untouchable. Hanyu is reportedly talking about adding a quad sal to both programs, if he does that very well could be a game changer. He'll be 19 in Sochi probably at the peak of his jumping abilities.

  16. #36

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    Skating-wise, he just needs to skate as beautifully as he does now. Politiks-wise, he needs to take some advise from Piseev on how those sekret Alfa Bank wire transfers to the ISU tech panels work (although Piseev's own transfers didn't work as planned after 2012 Euros).
    Dick Button Historical Quote of the Month: "Good for you, Lucinda Ruh!"

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jettasian View Post
    Eh, besides QUADS, he needs better SPEED, better SKATING SKILL, better EDGES, better TRANSITIONS, better CHOREOGRAPHY, better PROGRAM to show off his skill and body line, better STYLE, more COMPLEX FOOTWORK...
    YES. YES. MAYBE. MAYBE. HELL NO. ARE U KIDDING??

    If anything, Takahashi should be rewarded for taking risk and showing complex program and choreography. Name how many skaters has diverse programs throughout their skating career as much as Dai??? same old same old stuffs for other skater(s). What next for PChan? Carmen??

  18. #38
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    Maybe Dai should sent a boat load of sushi to the Chan's minions for life. After all, Japan doesn't produce maple syrup to sugar load the judges!! LOL

    The thing is figure skating is still old school and judges still want to see same old same old programs done to death by skaters. If skater try to push the boundary, they are no properly rewarded as they should. Only real weakness Dai has is not having consistent quad. But given his past injury and his age, you got give him a break.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeko View Post
    In FS, Chan was clearly behind the music, and even he admitted that in an interview and said probably that was why he fell and missed the 2A. He got one point of deduction for time violation because he couldn't finish his performance with the music. Yet, he received more points in IN than Takahashi, who was in perfect tune with the music from the first to the last note.

    So, what does Takahashi need to do?
    He's not far off. If he has 1-2 consistent quads in short and long that's most of it. He does two 3As so that helps.

    Blues for Klook is a great piece of music and I don't think judges hate it. My problem with that music is that it is so dense in terms of content and phrasing it's hard to interpret it perfectly without exhausting yourself in the program. As a result, I feel that Dai didn't use half the notes and phrases and skated through a lot of it without acknowledging many of the musical nuances...or not interpreting them well enough. To me that's why IN is a bit back. He was emotionally invested but didn't interpret all that the music brought to the table.

    Rodrigo on the other hand, while being slightly overused now is very even paced and allowed Lori and Patrick to use pretty much every note and phrase, thus the higher marks IMHO.

    No one can rightfully touch Patrick right now in SS but Dai can get close. He has to make it up in other areas.

  20. #40
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    Takahashi needs to be the clear Japan's #1 and the legitimate rival of Patrick Chan in the judges' eyes. That never happens as long as Hanyu is there. Takahashi's best effort can't beat Hanyu with a fall. Probably Hanyu is the only man who can beat Chan with two errors now. The margin of error will be reduced to one in next season. He is 9 years youger than Takahashi. The age difference is almost same with Arakawa and Asada. I think Takahashi should retire IF he cares about winning. A world silver is good enough for a glorious closing. Jeffrey Buttle had made a wise choice.

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