View Poll Results: Should there be more "choreographed elements"

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  • Yes

    24 88.89%
  • No

    3 11.11%
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  1. #1
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    Choreographed Elements

    After watching Salle and Pelltier's FS from SLC that was posted in another thread, it got me to thinking; there should be more choreographed elements.

    Specifically I watched their lifts and they were so aesthetically pleasing. Feature wise there was hardly anything to it, no he didn't do three turns in one hand, but i don't think there is any question that he could have easily done it.

    I'd love to see one Choreographed lift in the Senior Pairs FS and one choreographed spin in the singles FS... doesn't that sound nice? Where GOE is the only thing that affects it, and creativity is encouraged. I feel like a lot of the lifts and spins you see are so similar, and that a change like this could change things up a bit.

  2. #2
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    YES. I hate that a layback only gets a lot of points when the skater does a catch foot, twists to the side and does a Biellmann.

    To me, a great spin is one that achieves a correct position, spins on the same spot, maintains good speed and a decent number of revolutions - the way Nikodinov, Hughes or Cohen used to do it back in 2001.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    YES. I hate that a layback only gets a lot of points when the skater does a catch foot, twists to the side and does a Biellmann.

    To me, a great spin is one that achieves a correct position, spins on the same spot, maintains good speed and a decent number of revolutions - the way Nikodinov, Hughes or Cohen used to do it back in 2001.
    Agreed, especially because I think a true layback is one of the most beautiful elements a skater can include in a program.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    YES. I hate that a layback only gets a lot of points when the skater does a catch foot, twists to the side and does a Biellmann.

    To me, a great spin is one that achieves a correct position, spins on the same spot, maintains good speed and a decent number of revolutions - the way Nikodinov, Hughes or Cohen used to do it back in 2001.
    I too agree. Dorothy Hamill had some of the best spins, with the criteria you mentioned. Angela had a beautiful layback position that is hard to achieve. The catchfoot often hides the inability of a skater to hit that lovely layback position. What if they required a skater to have both in a program- the classic position and the catchfoot (to show the flexibility)?

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    I too agree. Dorothy Hamill had some of the best spins, with the criteria you mentioned. Angela had a beautiful layback position that is hard to achieve. The catchfoot often hides the inability of a skater to hit that lovely layback position. What if they required a skater to have both in a program- the classic position and the catchfoot (to show the flexibility)?
    Well, I don't think they should be required to have the flexibility, because

    And there isn't time to do two completely separate layback spins with only three spins per program.

    I wonder if there's a way to define the best execution of the classic position in such a way that it counts for a feature in itself (or two features if held for at least 8 revolutions).

    As far as the question in this poll, I'd be happy to see a "choreographed" spin as the fourth spin in a free program. As the rules work now, if you do four spins the last one will not get any points, so you could do whatever you want and it would contribute only to the component scores.

    But many skaters want to save a fast combo spin, layback spin, etc., for the end of the program so they won't have to keep skating and jumping while dizzy.

    So how could the rules allow a choreo spin in the middle of a program?

    If there are four spins allowed with one flying spin, one combo spin, and one spin in one basic position required . . . after any of those slots is filled, a second spin that meets the same definition would count as the choreo spin. But because any flying spin is also going to be either a spin in one position or a combination spin, the callers won't know for sure until the end of the program which spin is supposed to fill which slot.

    However, they can just call each spin by its relevant code as it is performed, and if at the end of the performance there are two spins that fill the same requirement then the second one gets changed to Choreo Spin.

    A spin that doesn't include any basic position (i.e., just an "intermediate" position or two) would automatically count as the choreo spin whenever it occurs.

  6. #6
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    I think a required combo spin and a required flying spin with the third spin being a choreographed spin of the skater's choice would be best. In ladies you'd likely see a lot of beautiful laybacks because of the GOE such a spin could render; in men you'd probably see a lot of fast sit change sits.

    In pairs you'd see some creativity as the teams try everything they can to come up with a beautiful position that will garner positive GOE rather than attempt to get levels.

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