Fixing the Canadian Ladies Program

[pat c]

I think a big part of the problem is that parents want their kids to try everything.........

I agree with this. It seems we use a scatter gun approach to sports/arts for instance instead of listening to the kid who might say, no I don't want to play y, I'd rather do x instead. In theory letting your kids try everything is great. In practice, it burns the kid out and the parents.

I don't see ice time as a major factor.

It depends on where you are. Where I'm from, a lot of volunteer hours are spent keeping rinks going. So 6:00 a.m. practices don't happen, so you fight for the hours from 3:00 to 11:00, and if you have a canskate program, you want early hours ie right after school or early evening. Of course minor hockey wants the same hours, as well as public skating and weekends are out in small town Canada because of hockey tournaments which are big money makers and public skating. Everyone tries their best, but there is only so many hours available.

Skate Canada is doing a major overhaul on most of it's programs and it'll be interesting to see if it makes a difference. In BC, there has been a major effort to make talent ID more effective and prevent kids from falling through the cracks. This effort especially is trying to reach the kids from smaller regions. Again, it remains to be seen if it works but I think it's definitely a step in the right direction. For a long time it seemed like the section didn't care about you unless you were willing to skate at 8 rinks. Now they really are trying to provide the resources and expertise to keep kids where they are and still have them be successful.

Good, there have been kids who have fallen through the cracks because they live too far away from a major centre. But it makes me wonder what Kurt Browning and his parents did, because Caroline/Rocky Mtn, Alberta isn't a mecca for high level figure skating.

[Cant Skate]

She had the minimum score from the JGP last year. Her bigger problem is she doesn't have the triple lutz.

Uh....while creeping my daughters Facebook page today, Kaetlyn posted a video of a triple lutz triple toe combo. Just sayin' ..... for enquiring minds who want to know!

[4rkidz]

Uh....while creeping my daughters Facebook page today, Kaetlyn posted a video of a triple lutz triple toe combo. Just sayin' ..... for enquiring minds who want to know!

Lots of Canadian girls actually have triple lutz from 14 year olds and up.. but that's when they are practicing.. the bigger issue is helping our kids get what they do in practice into the competition - it's not about the talent

[Dave of the North]

Uh....while creeping my daughters Facebook page today, Kaetlyn posted a video of a triple lutz triple toe combo. Just sayin' ..... for enquiring minds who want to know!

That's good news! Was it on the correct edge and not cheated? Maybe it will be ready to try at Junior worlds...

[Cant Skate]

That's good news! Was it on the correct edge and not cheated? Maybe it will be ready to try at Junior worlds...

You saw my user name right? Lol.....I have no idea, I'm just a fan She was on her feet and it was landed strong but it all looks good to me if they are not on their butts! My daughter said it was the first time she'd landed the combo so I wouldn't count on it being ready for worlds but apparently she's been doing the triple lutz in her short (its so handy to have a little spy in the house!)

[Spazactaz]

Her triple lutz is great! Her 3lz+3t is clean too.

[Sylvia]

Gabrielle Daleman is on the initial entry list for Challenge Cup (March 8-11 in The Hague), so that's good news!

[mag]

Lots of Canadian girls actually have triple lutz from 14 year olds and up.. but that's when they are practicing.. the bigger issue is helping our kids get what they do in practice into the competition - it's not about the talent

This. I think part of the problem is the focus on winning in the early stages. Girls are held back, or hold themselves back, so they can win. They do this because the rewards of winning at a lower level far outweigh the rewards of being in the bottom half of a higher level. I remember a few years back the mom of a really talented girl saying that her daughter was going to stay pre juv for another year rather than moving up to juv a year early. The coach decided this because she would have a better chance of making the select team if she was on the podium in pre juv rather than off the podium in juv. She also didn't do her harder combos in competition because they wanted her to skate clean. Talk about backward thinking! Boys, IMHO, don't have this problem because there are so few in the early levels that when they move up they still have a good shot at the podium.

[JanetB]

Uh....while creeping my daughters Facebook page today, Kaetlyn posted a video of a triple lutz triple toe combo. Just sayin' ..... for enquiring minds who want to know!

Could you post a link please

[minx]

The Cost. $$$$$$$$ Seriously.

I see lots of talented little kids. Sometimes the kids LOVE it so much that the parents can't help but to fund the obsession. But there is a point, there is always a point where the parent has to look at their kid, and their bank balance and decide whether they can continue well before outside funding is ever available.

[made_in_canada]

The Cost. $$$$$$$$ Seriously.

I see lots of talented little kids. Sometimes the kids LOVE it so much that the parents can't help but to fund the obsession. But there is a point, there is always a point where the parent has to look at their kid, and their bank balance and decide whether they can continue well before outside funding is ever available.

This argument can be made for lots of different sports and activities. Anything pursued at a high level (sport, music, dance, etc...) is expensive. Though it is a barrier, I don't think that has anything to do with why Canadian women don't have depth.

[Subway]

The Cost. $$$$$$$$ Seriously.

I see lots of talented little kids. Sometimes the kids LOVE it so much that the parents can't help but to fund the obsession. But there is a point, there is always a point where the parent has to look at their kid, and their bank balance and decide whether they can continue well before outside funding is ever available.

That doesn't explain why Canadian men are World champions much more frequently than Canadian women, especially when fewer men are in the sport to begin with, decreasing the probability of a guy with the talent and funding to reach the highest level. But they do, more frequently than the women.

[euterpe]

That doesn't explain why Canadian men are World champions much more frequently than Canadian women, especially when fewer men are in the sport to begin with, decreasing the probability of a guy with the talent and funding to reach the highest level. But they do, more frequently than the women.

Maybe it's because so few Canadian ladies DO go on to become champions. It's become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[DarrellH]

That doesn't explain why Canadian men are World champions much more frequently than Canadian women, especially when fewer men are in the sport to begin with, decreasing the probability of a guy with the talent and funding to reach the highest level. But they do, more frequently than the women.

Perhaps the better women go into pairs and dance, more than the better men do? In the U.S. it seems to be that you go into pairs if you can't cut it in singles.

[Jot the Dot Dot]

Judge them by how much bacon they eat, and how often their sentances end with "Eh?"

[Rafter]

Her triple lutz is great! Her 3lz+3t is clean too.

Why did she not do a 3lutz at Canadians if it is so great?

[Sylvia]

ShawTVEdmonton uploaded this news piece on Kaetlyn Osmond on Feb 17: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skMI9IcDFG4

Osmond: "In both programs we added a new jump that I haven't actually done in competition yet - it's my triple Lutz - so... really looking forward to trying that. And then we also added a triple-triple into my long."

[JanetB]

Why did she not do a 3lutz at Canadians if it is so great?

It could be that the 3t/3t and the 3 lutz started to gel at the same time and they didn't want to put 2 new to competition elements in her programs at one time.

[mag]

There was an interesting segment last night on the CBC coverage of Junior Worlds. It was called something like, searching for the next Canadian sweetheart. Tracy Wilson made some interesting comments about why we aren't as successful with the women as with the men. One of the things she stressed was that we need to support girls as they go through puberty. We need to not jump all over them and call them head cases when they have a bad season. The changes in their bodies take time to adjust to and they need confidence building not tearing down while they are trying to adjust. The other comment she made was that in some other countries they are fine with taking forty girls and working them hard, and seeing who comes out the other end. They don't worry about the ones that fall off during the process. She said that as a society, Canadians want to support and encourage all skaters to get reach their potential. This could mean that resources are spread more thinly than in a system where only the top few get support.
It was an interesting segment and is probably available to watch on CBC.ca

[Sylvia]

It was an interesting segment and is probably available to watch on CBC.ca

Here's the direct link to the 10-minute segment titled "The Big Picture: Legacy of Ladies Skating: Examining the next generation of Canadian female figure skaters" (not geoblocked): http://www.cbc.ca/sports/figureskati...#id=2205235358
Doug Leigh, Jennifer Robinson, and Josée Chouinard are among those interviewed and Tracy Wilson and Pj Kwong contribute commentary afterwards.