Fixing the Canadian Ladies Program

[algonquin]

I am interested to know what FSU posters would do to fix the Canadian Ladies program. Let’s not just focus on the seniors here, what would you do to fix the whole program from the bottom up?

[professordeb]

Ship them all to a province other than Quebec once they hit puberty -- maybe even send them out of country to train

[Marco]

They should ask the Canadian audience to stop giving out standing ovations for crap skating.

And having Stojko and Robinson as multiple National Champions can't be good for inspiration.

[bek]

I think they should look at what other successful programs are doing and copying what they can. What are the Japanese/Russians doing? What has the US done in the past (although the US could use some updating too).

This being said I suspect that the Russians/Japanese success has something to do with how popular figure skating is in their perspective countries. However Canada has had no problem being competitive in the other disciplines. Perhaps more competition at the lower levels would be good.

Also at the national level they can emphasis certain things that they feel needs to be emphasized. For example I know a couple of years ago the Russians introduced more points for 3/3s etc. The Canadians could institute bonuses for attempting all the jumps etc. This being said they obviously want to encourage quality.

But I definetly think making the coaches should look at how other countries are developing their girls and see about making some changes there. Joannie Rochette's coach though who obviously did a terrific job; should perhaps help as well.

[manhn]

Bear more children (esp. girls). Recruit more people from outside Canada (Get Paulina Whovever--any of the Paulinas!). Bribe Joannie to return to competitive skating.

Canada's population is A LOT smaller than Japan, Russia and the US. Canada won't have the same depth in one discipline (although dance is strong at the moment) or across all disciplines (although Japan's pairs and ice dance programs are weak).

I have no idea what Robinson and esp. 3-time World Champion Stokjo has to do with it. Both are skaters who did the best they did with what they had. To me, if I saw that with Canadian ladies and we got the same results, I'd be okay with it.

[Canadask8er]

What was with that comment about Stojko and Robinson hahaha Having a role model who won mutliple Olympic medals, World titles, World medals, etc etc etc Yah... thats bad for a youngsters coming up.... And Robinson, going from has-been to top 7 at the Olympics?? Yah that's also bad motivation and no source of inspiration at all.... Seriously ?? LOL

Skate Canada announced a new competitve skating format for the upcoming years to help with the puberty monster. Apparently the structure for competitve skating is more geared towards success for men... because puberty makes them stronger. And then they also go into dance and pairs because of that fact too. The new format is to help skaters continue throughout the competitve years, so that we don't lose young talent. There are some very talented female skaters in the younger ranks.... however, some of them don't make it to Senior's because of the puberty-monster. Our Junior champ did quite well this year at Nationals. But like has been mentioned above, we don't have as big of a population as other countries, so we have fewer resources to choose from.

[ltnskater]

More focus on jumps! MUCH more focus on jumps! This is the one thing that is holding Canadian ladies back, and it needs to be consistent jumping as well. Anything that will reward difficult jumps should be implemented, e.g. triple triple combo bonuses, bonuses for two triple lutzes/flips programs, etc.

The double axel requirement for novice free programs this season is a good start, but there needs to be more.

I think quality is important, but looking at the state of the Canadian ladies, difficulty and consistency in jumps is what we don't have, and what the Japanese and Russian skaters do have. Quality at this point, should definitely be second to difficulty, because a very nice clean high quality triple lutz double toe is simply not going to cut it internationally when up against a mediocre triple lutz triple toe.

The other thing that is unfortunate is that even before puberty, we don't have any good Canadian ladies, I don't think we have ever had a "jumping bean" like in the US, Japan, or Russia. So for Canadian ladies, it much less to do with puberty and girls losing jumps, because they simply did not really have any jumps in the first place!

I remember attending a competition once (summer) a few years back, pre juvenile level, skaters from internationals were able to compete, and Japanese skaters went 1 - 2 finish, doing double axels, and yes this was pre-juvenile.

[Alixana]

And having Stojko and Robinson as multiple National Champions can't be good for inspiration.

Jump-wise, Stojko would be a good model .. he actually rotated and landed his jumps!!

[made_in_canada]

More focus on jumps! MUCH more focus on jumps! This is the one thing that is holding Canadian ladies back, and it needs to be consistent jumping as well. Anything that will reward difficult jumps should be implemented, e.g. triple triple combo bonuses, bonuses for two triple lutzes/flips programs, etc.

The double axel requirement for novice free programs this season is a good start, but there needs to be more.

At the pre-novice/novice level there are bonuses for putting in more difficult jumps. I think looking at the Novice and Junior competition from nationals things are looking a lot more positive on the ladies front. Puberty will always take out some girls it's just the way it goes. If you want a successful model, look at what Karen & Jason Mongrain are doing in Kelowna. It's amazing what they've produced/are producing there.

[Vagabond]

You just have to persuade the young girls up there in Canada that they don't have to play ice hockey be tough and strong.

[Subway]

I am interested to know what FSU posters would do to fix the Canadian Ladies program. Let’s not just focus on the seniors here, what would you do to fix the whole program from the bottom up?

I agree with the province other than Quebec idea. How can the men's program reliably produce international podium-finishers and the women's program be what it is. I can't believe Phaneuf waited this long to leave Quebec.

ETA yes, Canada's population is smaller than other major figure skating countries, but then how is it they have such strong men when fewer men pursue figure skating. In Canada many more women figure skate and look. I also agree it's the jumps.

[Subway]

double post

[victoriaheidi]

Who wound up getting the Worlds spot? I'm guessing 4CCs wasn't quite as effective as they'd hoped.

[elle123]

It is looking pretty grim for Canadian ladies right now. I only hope Brian is able to work his magic on Cynthia like he did on Javier - but that will obviously take time.

[Marco]

LOL I guess Skate Canada's attempt to brush off Canadian Nationals short program as a fluke for Phaneuf didn't work.

And if Phaneuf could do even a 1toe after one of the jumps she landed, she would have beaten Lacoste. Oh well.

[euterpe]

It is looking pretty grim for Canadian ladies right now. I only hope Brian is able to work his magic on Cynthia like he did on Javier - but that will obviously take time.

Javier wasn't yet 20 and was in the early stages of his Senior career when Brian took him on. Cynthia is 24 and has been skating as a senior since 2004, and her skating habits have been engrained in her for a long, long time. Most elite skaters' careers start to wane as they approach 25, and IMO Cynthia's already entered that phase. I doubt Orser can help her.

As for Lacoste vs Phaneuf, it doesn't matter which one goes to Worlds 2012, as the result will pretty much be the same. Neither one is likely to crack top 10. Since Amelie beat Cynthia at both Nationals and 4CC, Amelie should get the nod.

[Sylvia]

Who wound up getting the Worlds spot? I'm guessing 4CCs wasn't quite as effective as they'd hoped.

Lacoste was named to the World team today: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/figureskati...ste-skate.html

[Marco]

Maybe leaving Phaneuf home is a good thing. Her only one good competition since recovery from injury was 2010 Worlds. Now she can have more time to rework things with Brian (darn that lutz). I suspect most of the work is with her head, not her blade.

Congrats on Lacoste for making Worlds. If Phaneuf comes back strong next season, Lacoste will pretty much be fighting for her own spot by placing top ten at Worlds.

[fan]

in practise, phaneuf lands maybe 1/10 lutzes. not all of her issues are mental - brian will probably rework the lutz technique.

[vmfan89]

You just have to persuade the young girls up there in Canada that they don't have to play ice hockey be tough and strong.

This. A lot of canadian girls, especially in my community will prefer to play hockey or ringette than to figure skate. This could be problematic in the future is the number of girls entering skating is reduced.