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  1. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by fenway2 View Post
    Tara delivered her program well in 95. She was just out skated - like Michelle in 1998.
    Tara didn't skate at Worlds in 1995. But she was 15th at Worlds 1996, when Michelle won and Tonia Kwiatkowski was 8th. Having 14 skaters finish ahead of Tara isn't my definition of a program well-delivered.

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    Tara didn't skate at Worlds in 1995. But she was 15th at Worlds 1996, when Michelle won and Tonia Kwiatkowski was 8th. Having 14 skaters finish ahead of Tara isn't my definition of a program well-delivered.

    Tara had two falls in her SP at the 1996 worlds, but she had a great free skate, with a 3s3r combination. In the 6.0 system it was not easy to move up the way it is in the COP, so her overall placement was still low, but she really delivered a very strong LP.

  3. #63

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    Tara was at Jr Worlds in 1995, AFAIR.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    No, she didn't-but there is no video to say one way or the othern
    Yes she did. I'd say if you call Tara's two performances in 1995 as bombing then anyone who enters a competition with lots of media hype, skates well and doesn't win = bomb. i.e. Kwan in 98 We differ in our opinions and we'll leave it at that.

    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    Your memory is one way of the event, mine the other way. I would have had McConn second.
    That doesn't surprise me. I would love it if someone could upload Tara's short and long to YouTube so everyone else can see these performances where she bombed. It's the first time I've ever heard anyone say that, even her detractors.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    I had heard of Tara before that too, as a junior but I don't recall the kind of hype Gracie is getting right now. For example: Gracie would crush the Russians, Gracie as good as Midori and Tonya, etc. That is overhyping, and it's way too early in her case to do that.
    You do realize the people starting the threads saying "Gracie will CRUSH the Russians..." and such are doing so deliberately to stir the pot? Hardly your everyday skating fan. I haven't seen any "FSU regular" hyping her up.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    So Tara did not deliver on the hype (bombed) and Gracie did deliver.
    There is a big difference between not delivering on the hype and bombing. Tara skated well. She didn't fall apart. She came in 2nd which is good.

    That's only a bomb if you completely change the definition of what a bomb is and you stand on your head while hoping on one foot and it's the 30th of February.

    Now Dornbush's SP at Nationals this year ... THAT was a bomb.

    What Tara delivered wasn't even close.
    Actual bumper sticker series: Jesus is my co-pilot. Satan is my financial advisor. Budha is my therapist. L. Ron Hubbard owes me $50.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    Tara didn't skate at Worlds in 1995. But she was 15th at Worlds 1996, when Michelle won and Tonia Kwiatkowski was 8th. Having 14 skaters finish ahead of Tara isn't my definition of a program well-delivered.
    I'm not sure where you're getting any ideas that I was discussing worlds in any year. If you were following the discussion then you'd know I was talking about 95 nationals.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSfan107 View Post
    You do realize the people starting the threads saying "Gracie will CRUSH the Russians..." and such are doing so deliberately to stir the pot?
    Word. It amazes me how many people actually took the bait on the "Gracie will CRUSH the Russians..." thread.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    The publicist had articles in all the Providence papers, and fluff pieces on the nightly news. For a 12 year old girl just new to juniors. It was so ginormous that it sets my teeth on edge just thinking about it.

    But in those days there was no internet for everyone to see the hype--so the effect nationally was not the same.

    When Tara skated, we were like, "This is the girl who was going to win seniors next year (which is what the publicity had implied)??" She was slow with tiny little jumps. The publicity led you to believe she was going to crush her junior opponents by miles. Instead she was beaten. In both the short and the long. By an Alaskan girl. (And that silver was a bit of a gift. I thought Britney McConn who was 3rd was better at the time. If I saw the performances today, I can't say, but that's what I thought then) To compare, Gracie not only won, she won by 23 points, and she won both the short and the long.

    So Tara did not deliver on the hype (bombed) and Gracie did deliver. At Worlds, Tara was 4th, which was good for her age, but nowhere near what was hyped.
    Caroline Zhang was was jr world champion, and supposed to be the next Michelle Kwan.So in my eyes, if someone lives up to the hype as a Jr it does not really show shades of the future at all. Wasn't Rachel Flatt a jr world champ also?

  10. #70

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    ^ Yes, in 2008.
    My job requires me to be a juggler, but that does not mean that I enjoy working with clowns.

  11. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by UGG View Post
    Caroline Zhang was was jr world champion, and supposed to be the next Michelle Kwan.So in my eyes, if someone lives up to the hype as a Jr it does not really show shades of the future at all. Wasn't Rachel Flatt a jr world champ also?
    Exactly. Not to mention look how old Tara was when she went to Jr Nationals and Jr Worlds. She was a heck of a lot younger than Gracie. In fact by Gracie's age; Tara was already World and (I believe) Olympic Champ too. Gracie didn't even make nationals last year. Considering Gracie did well at Novice nationals; I'm sure expectations were she'd make Jr nationals last year. So she too had trouble dealing a bit with expectations.

    So what if Tara struggled a bit at 12 to handle pressure; she was 12. Most skaters struggle at one time with expectations.

    I think Gracie is really great jumper and seems very talented. But still....

    And as mentioned how many people were Jr World Champs/Jr National champs and didn't succeed. Looking at Polina k; she will never be on a Junior World podium it seems; but she could easily become more successful than some of her counterparts who are.
    Last edited by bek; 02-07-2012 at 03:48 AM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by bek View Post
    Considering Gracie did well at Novice nationals; I'm sure expectations were she'd make Jr nationals last year. So she too had trouble dealing a bit with expectations.
    No, she had trouble dealing with a growth spurt.
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  13. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by MacMadame View Post
    No, she had trouble dealing with a growth spurt.
    And expectations didn't have anything to do with that as well. I think I recall in an article her saying some of it was pressure. I'd have to look it up. Not that there's frankly anything wrong with that. Lots of great athletes go through periods where they struggle with pressure etc. Michael Jordan got cut form a high school basketball team. But to criticize Tara for only taking second at Nationals; vs Gracie I think isn't right. Gracie though might very well have a bigger career than Tara someday. No athlete is perfect and I'm sure its a process to deal with expectations/pressure.

  14. #74

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    Springfield, IL local ABC news feature on Gracie Gold ahead of Junior Worlds that also features her twin skater sister, Carly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZJgwazj_88

  15. #75
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    I like Gracie's mentality. She seems grounded and isn't getting to caught up in the hype.

  16. #76
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    Aside from the hyped attention-grabbing title of the article, the actual content of the article is fairly well balanced, despite a few hyperboles. Also Gracie's and her parents' attitudes and approaches seem realistic. GG seems to be excited, while at the same time tempering that excitement with hard work and with the knowledge that it ain't exactly a given that she will make any Olympic team, since there are still so many unknowns and obstacles/ challenges to overcome.

    I wish Gracie and her family lots of good luck. Mostly I wish Gracie the opportunity to breathe, to develop with grace, to attain the understanding of how to deal with the pressures, and to truly be able to enjoy and grow from all that lies ahead of her, no matter what her future holds. If only the media and overzealous fans could just calm down with some of their rhetoric and the temptation to get ahead of themselves with the cheering for someone who is still right now only a very talented junior skater with the potential for greatness -- but not yet a senior division World champion.

    The article's title might sound a little less hyped if it read: "Chatham figure skater dreaming of Olympic gold," or: "Chatham figure skater on track for Olympic berth," or: "... Olympic competition."

    I think the comparisons to Tonya Harding are actually a bit too much on a number of levels. Sure, I get the fact of their raw jumping talent comparisons and their good jumping technique, but it's not as if Harding's superb athletic qualities and jumping talent were truly appreciated and valued during her prime. In fact, not even Harding truly believed in her abilities. During that period in USFS history, it was more about Kristi's well-rounded talent and charming girl-next-door appeal, and Nancy Kerrigan's athleticism and skating princess-in-waiting, Kate Hepburn look-alike appeal...

    Oops ... Oh Gosh, guess I talked myself into realizing that Gracie seems to have it all: irresistible talent, technique, athleticism, great name, gorgeous looks. I can see George B beaming and saying: "Say Hello, Gracie!"

    Calm down, aftershocks.

  17. #77
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    Speaking of Tara, I remember going to US Nationals in Detroit in 1994 and seeing her skate in the novice ladies event. Though it was won by Cohen Duncan (and Sydne Vogel, who would become the US Junior Champion the next year was 5th), Lipinski was the real stand out. She attempted 3 triple jumps in her free skate which was unheard of at the time. I don't think a smile left her face for the entire program.

    Being compared to Tara at this stage of her career, how exciting for the United States that they have a prospect like Gold on their hands. I look forward to Gracie's continued success and development.
    Last edited by essence_of_soy; 02-21-2012 at 11:44 AM.

  18. #78

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    I enjoyed Gracie at Skate Detroit and Nationals. She has good jumps and some good flow across the ice. What I noticed more at Nationals is that she holds out her moves and doesn't just rush through everything as junior skaters often do. Since she has already had a major growth spurt, maybe that won't be such a big issue when she moves up to seniors.

    The ice is slippery, though, so who knows how she will do in the future. I wish her well and look forward to seeing her in the future.

  19. #79
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    Gracie really doesn't look or skate like a Junior skater even though at 16 she's really not old for a Junior. Of course some of these girls haven't grown much yet and still look like little girls but Gracie looked like she should have been skating against Ashley, Alissa etc etc.

  20. #80
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    I dunno, I thought it was clear that she still needs to take that extra step presentation-wise to really match up with them. But that's something that *may* come with time.

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