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  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by vexlak View Post

    Do not like the vocals in music.
    A song with vocals is a performance of its own of the artist exhibiting his/hers singing ability. Competitively skating to such performance would take away from both the song and the skating program.
    Then why allow it for dance?

    (I understand the argument that the required rhythm makes it more difficult to select music without vocals in many cases. However, if the argument is that vocals take away from a competitive performance- it seems they shouldn't be allowed in any skating competition.

  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post
    Then why allow it for dance?

    (I understand the argument that the required rhythm makes it more difficult to select music without vocals in many cases. However, if the argument is that vocals take away from a competitive performance- it seems they shouldn't be allowed in any skating competition.
    Couldn't agree more! Take away the vocals in both figure skating and dance and while they are added they should come up with a black lists of music.
    I have started to watch figure skating one mute in come instances because I just can't stand another program to yet the same music again

  3. #143
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    NOOO LYRICS Pleaasee nooooo lyrics that would totally ruin the enjoyment i find when i watch this beautiful sport, it's distracting and kinda ruins everything.... and thinking of all the pop music that would be chosen is a total turn off...

    is tis a rule suggestion or have they already accepted this offer?

  4. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUN View Post
    There are a lot of Federations who mostly develop officials. They should redirect their efforts.


    Well actually it's .

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    - Lyrics: NO. BIG NO BIGGEST NO EVER.

    - Junior/Senior rule: Yes. You should not be able to go back. I still think it's criminal that Denis Ten is still at JW after being to the Olympics, FFS. Now let's think about it - what would happen if the Russians next year gave Plushenko the Senior Worlds slot but decided they wanted to give Artur more competition time and sent him off to Junior Worlds? I can guarantee that in some places (like here) there'd be a bloody riot. Why should it be any different because of the country you skate for? And the whole thing would be ridiculous: a Senior Worlds bronze medallist able to skate at Junior Worlds.

  6. #146
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    They've got a point when it comes to lyrics. Lyrics allow skaters to develop iconic programs that get shared on a viral level, which in turn makes people watch skating/go see skating. While this is possible with instrumental, it's seen as boring, and old-fashioned to younger skating fans. Not to offend us, erm, older skating fans, but the younger crowd is where skating needs to branch out. It takes nothing away from the performance of ice dance; I don't understand the outrage Not like we'd even SEE programs with lyrics until after Sochi anyway.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUN View Post
    The solution for these Federations will be is to finally develop skating so that to have more than one.

    There are a lot of Federations who mostly develop officials. They should redirect their efforts.

    If you look at the ISU list of ISU Controllers, specialists, judges, there are countries which have a considerable number of officials here but practically no skaters.
    Speaking as someone who comes from a country with very few skaters and a small/new federation, it's very easy for someone from a country with a large figure skating population, excellent facilities, funding and a powerful federation to come along and say that countries with maybe one or two skaters should develop their skating more. In reality, it's a lot harder to do, especially if you receive no government support and do not want to become another Azerbaijan where you are importing skaters. It's not like you can snap your fingers and overnight you have tons of skaters.

    Not that you don't have a point about certain countries and officials. On the other hand, I spoke to one member of a federation who was told by a member of the ISU that in order for their skaters to get better marks they needed to get judges up to international standard and onto the panels at events.
    To think that fun is simple fun, while earnest things are earnest, proves all too plain that neither one thou truthfully discernest.

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    Speaking as someone who comes from a country with very few skaters and a small/new federation, it's very easy for someone from a country with a large figure skating population, excellent facilities, funding and a powerful federation to come along and say that countries with maybe one or two skaters should develop their skating more. In reality, it's a lot harder to do, especially if you receive no government support and do not want to become another Azerbaijan where you are importing skaters. It's not like you can snap your fingers and overnight you have tons of skaters.

    Not that you don't have a point about certain countries and officials. On the other hand, I spoke to one member of a federation who was told by a member of the ISU that in order for their skaters to get better marks they needed to get judges up to international standard and onto the panels at events.
    Well you are both right.

    Of course it's very hard to develop skating with hardly any funding.

    But regardless of how high or low that funding is, there are some federations which seem mostly focused on the well-being of their officials, who've been hogging their posts for years and are mostly focused on keeping them and not so much on developing skating.

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    In reality, it's a lot harder to do, especially if you receive no government support and do not want to become another Azerbaijan where you are importing skaters. It's not like you can snap your fingers and overnight you have tons of skaters.
    Exactly - just look at how long it took China to develop some world-class talent, and they presumably had a massive amount of government support and one very determined skater-turned-coach.

  10. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    Not that you don't have a point about certain countries and officials. On the other hand, I spoke to one member of a federation who was told by a member of the ISU that in order for their skaters to get better marks they needed to get judges up to international standard and onto the panels at events.
    I could interpret that is a different way: by getting some judges up to standard and on the panel at international events, you will be developing a better understanding of the levels and quality that is expected in international competition, and you can do more locally to reinforce that standard.

    One of the AP teachers at D's school said it was a real eye-opener when she became a grader, and could see the real standard it took to get top marks on the oral language component of one of the foreign language AP tests, as compared to the much drier explanations that are published. Listening to all of the tapes was apparently quite the educational experience that she then incorporated into our school's course development.

    Or it could be evil.

    (I am reminded of the comments in '95 that Kwan needed to become a more "mature" skater -- and how some saw that as referring to makeup and costuming, and others to a need for more depth and maturity in her skating. I guess we got both in '96, but I tend to think it was more about the skating than the makeup.)

  11. #151

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    I'm quite surprised at the vehemence with which some posters oppose the proposal to allow skating to music with lyrics. We've had lyrics in ice dance for 15 years now and I can't say that the lyrics have detracted from my enjoyment one bit (well, other than Hoffman/Zavovin's Pussycat Dolls FD). A&P's Carmina Burana, D&L's At Last, D&W's Samson and Delilah, V&M's Latin (FD version), W&P's Je Suis Malade are all, IMO, fab programs and all include lyrics. I really don't think we're about to see an explosion of Justin Bieber programs, should the rule pass. On the plus side, we may avoid all the godawful muzak versions of pop songs that the skaters already use.

  12. #152

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    It is long long long past time for music lyrics being allowed for ALL disciplines of skating. BRING IT!
    There is nothing more captivating in this world than a woman's form gracing the ice in skating boots. It's simply sensational!

  13. #153
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    Not really understanding the uproar with music.

    Lyrics have been allowed in programs through the Intermediate level in both Singles and Pair for the past few years. I have found that most coaches stick with traditional non-lyric music or just have a section with lyrics.

    I agree- you aren't going to see 8500 Bieber/Britney/GaGa programs out there- Skaters and Coaches are more savvy than that and usually know what type of music attracts the PCS mark!
    Last edited by carriemarie; 05-04-2012 at 01:05 AM.

  14. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenifer View Post
    I'm quite surprised at the vehemence with which some posters oppose the proposal to allow skating to music with lyrics. We've had lyrics in ice dance for 15 years now and I can't say that the lyrics have detracted from my enjoyment one bit (well, other than Hoffman/Zavovin's Pussycat Dolls FD). A&P's Carmina Burana, D&L's At Last, D&W's Samson and Delilah, V&M's Latin (FD version), W&P's Je Suis Malade are all, IMO, fab programs and all include lyrics. I really don't think we're about to see an explosion of Justin Bieber programs, should the rule pass. On the plus side, we may avoid all the godawful muzak versions of pop songs that the skaters already use.
    I agree with you on keeping it for the dancers. However I would still prefer to live without the vocals for rest of the skating categories. There is plenty of creativity out there to find music without lyrics. What should be more promoted is different programs and costumes. Leonova's short was perfect example. Although daring and unusual, it was proven that when executed and performed well it could work. I personally felt it was entertaining and different. No lyrics, yet the story was told with the performance... It would not work the same with lyrics.

  15. #155

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    Interesting, vexlax. What was your impression of W&P's Free Dance this year? I thought they did a great job of expressing a story inspired by the song with out "acting out" the lyrics. Do you not think that pairs/singles skaters would be able to do that as well?

  16. #156
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    Nobody mentioned the GOE values for the choreographed sequence:
    0.5, 1.0, 1.5, 2.0, 2.7, 3.4, 4.1

    Source (go to page 3)

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