Team competition at Sochi

[Cherub721]

Japan still advances to the LP (same score as Germany, above France, and Canada and the US would have an extra point each)

That begs the question... what's the tiebreaker if two countries have the same overall points? Total scores?

[Celine82]

The document says

When forming the result after the Short Program/Short Dance as well as the final result, in case of a tie between Teams, the tie breaking procedure will be used taking into consideration the 2 best places of the concerned Teams in different disciplines. The highest total points from the 2 best places will prevail and the respective placements recorded accordingly.

If ties persist the 3 best places in different disciplines will be considered and the highest total points from the 3 best places will prevail and the respective placements recorded accordingly.

ETA: Thinking about it, it doesn't seem fair at all given the differences in scores from one category to the other. If a team has a pair third, a lady 5th, a man 6th and a dance team 8th, the way I understand it is that they'd take the pair + lady scores ("2 best places"), even though the man could actually have a higher score... Yuck. They need to change that to "taking into consideration the 2 highest scores of the concerned Teams".

[kwanfan1818]

Sorry, I was taking best three of four, which isn't the way it will work.

[That Don Guy]

I hate hate hate that this takes place before the individual events.

Just wait for some favorite, or favorites, to skate brilliantly in the team event but then blow it when it comes time for the solo OGM.

Where did you see that the team event is before the individual events?

There will be a similar team event at the 2012 Youth Winter Olympics in Innsbruck in a few weeks, and the schedule says that the team event takes place after the individual events (where the exhibition would normally take place).

Then again, there doesn't appear to be time to hold both rounds of the team event after the individual events. The Sochi 2014 site has a list of the dates on which figure skating will take place, and while they don't specify which events take place on what days, it looks like the first (SP) round of the team competition takes place the day between the Ice Dance LP and the Ladies SP.
(It looks like: Pairs SP, off, Pairs LP, Men SP, off, Men LP, Dance SP, off, Dance LP, Team SP, Ladies SP, off, Ladies LP, Team LP - note the arena is not available on off days as it is also used for short track speed skating.)

Remember, they still have two years to work out the details. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up deciding to use the individual events' short program results to determine the five teams that compete in the long program round (which would be held after the rest of the competition, in place of the exhibition).

[algonquin]

Are the federations on board with this idea or this being imposed on them by the ISU?

[johndockley92]

So, the 4th ranked Russian pair or the 4th ranked Japanese male would be in the team event? So, the 4th ranked Russian pair can win a gold medal, but not Kavaguti/Smirnov? Fantastic! What a fun event!

Precisely!

SO based on last year's results, the US would have sent Jeremy, Mirai, Denney and Barret, and Hubbell & Hubbell to this event (Wow we would have done well LOL).

[barbk]

Then again, there doesn't appear to be time to hold both rounds of the team event after the individual events. The Sochi 2014 site has a list of the dates on which figure skating will take place, and while they don't specify which events take place on what days, it looks like the first (SP) round of the team competition takes place the day between the Ice Dance LP and the Ladies SP.
(It looks like: Pairs SP, off, Pairs LP, Men SP, off, Men LP, Dance SP, off, Dance LP, Team SP, Ladies SP, off, Ladies LP, Team LP - note the arena is not available on off days as it is also used for short track speed skating.)

Remember, they still have two years to work out the details. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up deciding to use the individual events' short program results to determine the five teams that compete in the long program round (which would be held after the rest of the competition, in place of the exhibition).

They could do that, but I believe that they can not then use the SP scores according to the rules that apply for all Olympic sports.

[bek]

I'm actually looking forward to the team competition; I think it could be a great addition to the sport, if its done right.

[Visaliakid]

Are the federations on board with this idea or this being imposed on them by the ISU?

The IOC will do the imposing of it's wishes on the ISU as to the scheduling of this new team event. President Cinquanta stated at the last meeting of the ISU Full Council that it was decided that the Team event would be held before any of the four individual disciplines. One can only assume that the IOC highly suggested the Team comp go first.

[aka_gerbil]

Maybe it's just me, but I'm predicting there will be some sort of Level 4, +3 GOE drama to come out of this, perhaps with a few 10's for PCS.

Someone is going to get ill when they beat someone in the team competetion but don't in the individual events. Someone who gets beat in both the team competition and individual event will claim that the judging of the team event affected the individual event... So on and so forth.

[Jenna]

I'm actually looking forward to the team competition; I think it could be a great addition to the sport, if its done right.

Yes! ITA. The team comp. of gymnastics is always enjoyable, and it seems as though this will be similar.

[Domshabfan]

My understanding is that the team event takes place before the other disciplines.
You are right about the venue of Short track and FIGS being close to full ( I believe there is only 1 dark day).
They may have to resort to skating the team event before the opening ceremonies..like some of the team events in the Summer Olympics.

Even schedule from the Wikipedia page does not match the result from Sochi games committee website. Even this will be updated since this was the initial schedule submitted by Sochi when bidding for the games, so close to games they will make these changes. One important aspect of the schedule is that ice-dancing back then was allotted 3 days, with CD fused with OD to form SD, the organisers have gained a day for team competition. For an additional day of team competition the organisers may have to use the closing ceremony day or forced to put 2 figure skating event on the same day, say Men's SP and Pairs FS. I don't think ISU will cancel Gala, it is one of the most enjoyable casual performance of the winter competition along with opening and closing ceremonies. As for competition starting before the opening ceremonies, I don't think ISU and IOC really likes the idea. It is only Men's football with 16 teams as opposed to other team sports with 12 teams that starts before the opening ceremony.

[Japanfan]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this event - expecting to hear at any time that it won't be held after all.

Skaters will be doing their same programs for individual events and the team event, right? I would feel more positive about it if the programs were different. The idea of individual skaters or pair/dance teams having to skate the program they may have dreamed would earn them Olympic gold in a team event (or even just a good Olympic FP) just doesn't seem right. Skaters would have to hold back I would think - couldn't give their all in the team event, because what would be left? For example, imagine if Yagudin had skated MITIM in the team event the same way he day when he won Gold in Men's. Seems to me it would really water down the excitement of the Men's FP for the audience and be hard for the skater to recreate the moment.

[Domshabfan]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this event - expecting to hear at any time that it won't be held after all.

Skaters will be doing their same programs for individual events and the team event, right? I would feel more positive about it if the programs were different. The idea of individual skaters or pair/dance teams having to skate the program they may have dreamed would earn them Olympic gold in a team event (or even just a good Olympic FP) just doesn't seem right. Skaters would have to hold back I would think - couldn't give their all in the team event, because what would be left? For example, imagine if Yagudin had skated MITIM in the team event the same way he day when he won Gold in Men's. Seems to me it would really water down the excitement of the Men's FP for the audience and be hard for the skater to recreate the moment.

Well, same argument can be made in all sports with team event. So according to your argument a sport like artistic gymnastic an athlete will not be able to do more than one great performance in the competition. Yet, at times they perform the same routine 4 times. The floor performance still looks beautiful and exciting even though the athlete is performing for the 4th time in the same competition... and then again they have been competing with the same program whole season, so if they don't del it is important they can think of it as a small performance like say world cup B event and perform.Even then they don't like to compete in the team event they can forfeit their spot in the team and concentrate on individual performance. I don't think it is compulsory for them to perform.

I am happy about the team events being held but i am really concerned about the implementation of the event. Athletes will learn to compete in team and individual events very quickly, i don't think we are giving them enough credit for their will power to do well.

[carriecmu0503]

Even then they don't like to compete in the team event they can forfeit their spot in the team and concentrate on individual performance. I don't think it is compulsory for them to perform.

The above statement is totally incorrect, unfirtunately. Athletes qualify for individual events based on the results of the team event. No team event would mean no individual events for the athlete. Additionally, in the US, gymnasts are chosen based on what they can contribute to the team. For example, in 2004, the reigning bars world champion was left off the Olympic team because it was thought she would not contribute as much to the team competition as some of the other available athletes.

[Domshabfan]

Even then they don't like to compete in the team event they can forfeit their spot in the team and concentrate on individual performance. I don't think it is compulsory for them to perform.

The above statement is totally incorrect, unfirtunately. Athletes qualify for individual events based on the results of the team event. No team event would mean no individual events for the athlete. Additionally, in the US, gymnasts are chosen based on what they can contribute to the team. For example, in 2004, the reigning bars world champion was left off the Olympic team because it was thought she would not contribute as much to the team competition as some of the other available athletes.

True in artistic gymnastics but not in Figure skating.

[julieann]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this event - expecting to hear at any time that it won't be held after all.

I seriously doubt they will cancel the event but it looks at though it won't look anything like the World Team Trophy. They really should have waited until 2018 or 2022 to roll it out. I envision many confused spectators.

[alchemy void]

Only figure skating fans could find reasons to bitch about adding an additional event to the Olympics.

These are Olympic athletes, not fragile paper dolls. Give them an additional chance yo medal and they will savor it. Heck, it might take a little pressure off in the single events. At the very least I think it will help to raise the level of performance.

As for the suggestion of skating different programs, it was tried at the Grand Prix Final 10 years ago. It was a boring shitshow and was quickly dropped.

[Celine82]

I agree, it seems very different from the previous World Team Trophy. Do we know if the ISU/Japanese Federation plan to run the one in April according to this new Team Event format? Or hold another such Team Event in 2012-2013?

[Coco]

Well I hope they try this out before they foist it on the Olympics with the world watching.