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  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Willowway View Post
    As far as I know, we have no reason to buy the rumor (and it was qualified as a rumor by the poster) that the USFSA is doing a money grab here. There is simply no solid evidence of that right now. If a % of endorsements is part of the USFSA customary deal and it's applied across the board, well, then Evan knew all about it from the get-go and is trying to negotiate an exception to it. Ok, one can try - but we don't know if that's what's happening.
    ^^^This.

    Quote Originally Posted by n*ice mom View Post
    From US Figure Skating website:

    ... The special agreement is called an Eligible Skater’s Compensation Agreement or ESCA.
    Here's the link: United States Figure Skating Association Eligible Skater’s Compensation Agreement Program (ESCA)

    I had always heard 10%, not "10% or $150 whichever is less."
    My hearsay info is that it's "10% or $150 whichever is less."

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by aliceanne View Post
    My impression of Stars on Ice is that it is on it's last legs, not drawing much of a crowd. Even if he is getting paid well, it isn't very gratifying to perform to an almost empty house after all those years of training.
    If Stars on Ice goes under the last remaining piece of professional skating is gone in the U.S. Who would have thought this 15 years ago. Maybe he would join the Canadian version, unless that is going under too.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonlady View Post
    That's how it was done years ago, but for the past several years, you add the placements of the top 2 skaters for your country together and if that total is 13 or less, you get three spots.

    For example, if your skaters finish 6 and 7, you get three spots next year. If they're 1st and 20th, as with Canadian Men last year, you get 2.
    Yes, if there are 3 skaters, the top 2 are counted. If there are 2, both are counted. If there is 1, only that one can be counted.

  4. #44

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    Has USFS been expecting skaters to tolerate "indentured servitude"?
    If so, shame on them!

  5. #45
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    I think it is more likely that the US men will lose a spot than gain one. Hopefully they will be able to keep 2 spots though.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaana View Post
    I think it is more likely that the US men will lose a spot than gain one. Hopefully they will be able to keep 2 spots though.
    I disagree. It is highly unlikely the US will lose a spot. Even our untested young team last year held two spots. The scores Rippon and Abbott have been putting up so far would easily hold two spots, with plenty of cushion.

    Take a look at the scores from last year's worlds and you'll see what it takes to have two who land with one around 10 and the other around 16. Based on their scores so far this season, any combination of Abbott or Rippon with Miner, Dornbush, Aaron, or Carriere would hold two spots. What other team has so many men who can score over 200 even on a bad day?

  7. #47

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    For the record, here are the scores from last year's worlds:

    1 Patrick Chan Canada 280.98
    2 Takahiko Kozuka Japan 258.41
    3 Artur Gachinski Russia 241.86
    4 Michal Březina Czech Republic 233.61
    5 Daisuke Takahashi Japan 232.97
    6 Nobunari Oda Japan 232.50
    7 Florent Amodio France 229.68
    8 Brian Joubert France 227.67
    9 Richard Dornbush United States 222.42
    10 Javier Fernández Spain 218.26
    11 Ross Miner United States 217.93
    12 Tomáš Verner Czech Republic 216.87
    13 Ryan Bradley United States 212.71
    14 Denis Ten Kazakhstan 209.99
    15 Peter Liebers Germany 205.59 4
    16 Anton Kovalevski Ukraine 201.64
    17 Kevin van der Perren Belgium 197.10
    18 Samuel Contesti Italy 196.40
    19 Jorik Hendrickx Belgium 188.24
    20 Kevin Reynolds Canada 187.23
    21 Paolo Bacchini Italy 183.13
    22 Song Nan China 176.09
    23 Kim Lucine Monaco 171.93
    24 Joey Russell Canada 168.73

    Abbott and Rippon's scores so far this season would land them in 8th and 12th. Miner, Dornbush, Aaron or Carriere would all land in the top 16 based on current scores. All six of these men, even when not skating their best, have skated consistantly so far this season within these ranges.

  8. #48
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    Skaters scores always rise as the season goes. If Abbott and Rippons current best scores would have them in 8th or 12th, then that just menas they will likely do alot better than that (if those are the 2 who make it).

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    Skaters scores always rise as the season goes. If Abbott and Rippons current best scores would have them in 8th or 12th, then that just menas they will likely do alot better than that (if those are the 2 who make it).
    Exactly. Gachinski, for example, scored in the 202-205 range on the Grand Prix last season.

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    Skaters scores always rise as the season goes. If Abbott and Rippons current best scores would have them in 8th or 12th, then that just menas they will likely do alot better than that (if those are the 2 who make it).
    Agreed. Which is why it is even more unlikely the US will lose a spot. At their worst they will probably at least achieve these early-season scores.

    Even with a mere 10% improvement by the end of the season, Abbott and Rippon would end up in 3rd and 7th and secure 3 spots for the US.

    I believe it is much more likely that they will gain a third spot than that they will lose a spot.

  11. #51
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    ^We'll see what happens. The top US Men, while not skating lights out, are overcoming some of their chief obstacles early on in the season - Rippon went 3 for 3 on the 3x at TEB. Abbott is back in the good graces of Intl. Judging Panels and actually won a GP event. Dornbush is finally doing a 3x and 4t in the same program. Miner is mostly clean and medalling on the GP circuit. Carriere is coming back fairly strong and even did a 4t in Austria. I'd say they are in significantly better shape now than at this time last year. I've always noted that US competitors seem to finish much stronger than they begin the season, even more so than competitors from other countries - closers.

    Back OT - I'm not surprised by Evan, frankly. I always considered myself a fan [not an uber, just a fan] but I'm skeptical - Couldn't he look at the situation as a chance to play the hero and give some money back to a sport that is in desperate need in the US, and in need of a champion? Couldn't some sort of understanding be reached?

  12. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    Back OT - I'm not surprised by Evan, frankly. I always considered myself a fan [not an uber, just a fan] but I'm skeptical - Couldn't he look at the situation as a chance to play the hero and give some money back to a sport that is in desperate need in the US, and in need of a champion? Couldn't some sort of understanding be reached?
    Without any knowledge of what the dispute is actually about......skaters are asked to "give back" all the time, especially well-known skaters. Not always $$$$, but also with time, donations of memorabilia, statements of support/endorsement, etc. Maybe Evan feels he has "given back" enough.
    We live in an ageist society where everything is based on youth, but I hated being 18. I don't like teenagers any more now than I did then. I'm 49 now and there is no way that I'd go back to my teens and 20s - even if I knew what I know now, I don't want to go through all that again. I found it a very difficult time. - Buzz Osborne of the Melvins

  13. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by overedge View Post
    Without any knowledge of what the dispute is actually about......skaters are asked to "give back" all the time, especially well-known skaters. Not always $$$$, but also with time, donations of memorabilia, statements of support/endorsement, etc. Maybe Evan feels he has "given back" enough.
    Agreed - they are asked to give back all the time, and it shouldn't be via their money when figure skating endorsements are so limited & their careers generally so short.

    Also, the Eligible Skater Compensation Agreement is for EVENTS, it doesn't speak to endorsements at all. It's purpose is supposed to be protecting eligibility of skaters, use of Olympic logos, etc. The "processing fee" is 10% or $150, whichever is less. I don't know if there's some standard contract that does when a skater actually gets an endorsement.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2sk8 View Post
    Also, the Eligible Skater Compensation Agreement is for EVENTS, it doesn't speak to endorsements at all. It's purpose is supposed to be protecting eligibility of skaters, use of Olympic logos, etc.
    Here is the first line from the post on the previous page.

    "When compensation has been offered to a skater for an appearance, endorsement or exhibition performance, the skater cannot accept the compensation or perform in the activity without first receiving special permission from the USFS."

    So yes, endorsements are included.

  15. #55

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    IceNetwork article: http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news
    Evan Lysacek, the 2010 Olympic champion and 2009 world champion, will not skate at the 2012 U.S. Figure Skating Championships, his agency, Creative Artists Agency (CAA), confirmed to icenetwork.com.

    In an email to icenetwork.com, CAA wrote: "Evan will not be at the 2012 U.S. Figure Skating Championships due to prior contractual obligations."

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Polymer Bob View Post
    Here is the first line from the post on the previous page.

    "When compensation has been offered to a skater for an appearance, endorsement or exhibition performance, the skater cannot accept the compensation or perform in the activity without first receiving special permission from the USFS."

    So yes, endorsements are included.
    Oops - must read more slowly in the future. But, that would mean $150 only...this doesn't seem like it could be the source of any dispute.

  17. #57

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    In an email to icenetwork.com, CAA wrote: "Evan will not be at the 2012 U.S. Figure Skating Championships due to prior contractual obligations."
    Admittedly, this is PR-speak that could mean a million different things in real life. But I don't think Evan is getting very good career guidance if he is being booked for "prior contractual obligations" at the same time as the major national competition in his sport. I know he has done other things besides skating (e.g. Dancing with the Stars), but it's skating he's best known for, and to pass on that for unspecified other "obligations" doesn't seem particularly wise to me - at least not until he has built more of a name outside of skating.
    We live in an ageist society where everything is based on youth, but I hated being 18. I don't like teenagers any more now than I did then. I'm 49 now and there is no way that I'd go back to my teens and 20s - even if I knew what I know now, I don't want to go through all that again. I found it a very difficult time. - Buzz Osborne of the Melvins

  18. #58

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    Abbott will be the frontrunner again then. Carroll says Lyscaceks got two blockbuster programs so maybe next season will be their debut.

  19. #59

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    One wonders whether he should find a different agent. . . If he REALLY wants to skate and his agent is playing hardball, well?

  20. #60
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    I thought I ve heard federation asking a part of shows money from skaters from Piseev too during his fight with Plushenko before Vancouver season. I remember him refering to it in an interview that they should have asked Evgeni's percentage of his shows but at the end they didnt.

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