Why second jump in combination?

[julianaqtpi]

As a skater, I can say that its better to have your combinations in the beginning, so you can have a chance to make them up. I fell on the 2S of a 2S-2Lo, and it was my 1st jump, so I added the 2Lo onto the end of my 2F (I was going to do it after a 2Lz, but I two footed that and didnt have speed for the 2Lo.). It annoys me when skaters plan combinations without a chance to make it up. The exception is short programs, where you only have 3 jumps (axel, 2 jump combo, jump out of footwork), but even that, my coaches set me up so both jumps are out of footwork so if I fall on the first jump of the combo it can just be my solo jump, and then add the combo onto the intended solo jump. Again, it annoys me when these international competitors don't do that, there are quite a few times when that could have changed the placements.

[Polymer Bob]

If a skater can jump both clockwise and counter-clockwise, he/she can make the 2nd jump of a combo something other than a loop or toe loop. As far as I know, this has not actually been done.

[tkaug]

I fell on the 2S of a 2S-2Lo, and it was my 1st jump, so I added the 2Lo onto the end of my 2F.

It's only the case when it is triples or quads that the repeated jump turns into a +SEQ by not making either of them in combination. In double jumps, it doesn't matter which jumps you make in combination.

[gkelly]

It's only the case when it is triples or quads that the repeated jump turns into a +SEQ by not making either of them in combination. In double jumps, it doesn't matter which jumps you make in combination.

That's true for juniors and seniors, but in the US there are limits on repeats of double jumps at the lower IJS levels, and on repeats of single jumps at the nonqualifying levels.

[julianaqtpi]

That's true for juniors and seniors, but in the US there are limits on repeats of double jumps at the lower IJS levels, and on repeats of single jumps at the nonqualifying levels.

That instance where I added the double loop to the end of another jump was in Pre-Juvenile, so 6.0 scoring system. I don't know if they would have penalized that in IJS or not, but I don't plan on doing that because the Planned Program Content Sheet gives it away, and my coaches told me not to do that with IJS.

Also, in regards to the overall topic, sometimes the skater wants to start off stronger with a really good jump, and then later have the jump in combination. My freeskate program starts off with just a plain double salchow now, and then a bit later I have a double salchow-double toeloop-double loop sequence, because I don't want to fall on my first jump.

[seabm7]

If a skater can jump both clockwise and counter-clockwise, he/she can make the 2nd jump of a combo something other than a loop or toe loop. As far as I know, this has not actually been done.

If the skater is still landing on an outside edge, the choice is still limited. Here is the only scenario I can think of,

A skater does the first jump clock-wise, landing on the outside edge of her left foot. Then she does a lutz as the second jump, rotating counter-clockwise.

It's possible, but given the difficulty of lutz, they would not like this path. Besides you can try a salchow or flip as the last jump when you insert a half-loop in between as a 3-jump combination.

[Extranjera]

A skater does the first jump clock-wise, landing on the outside edge of her left foot. Then she does a lutz as the second jump, rotating counter-clockwise.

It's possible, but given the difficulty of lutz, they would not like this path. .

Armin would do it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6I9ILJacVkw

[Skittl1321]

I've seen a former elite skater do 1Z-1Z combo, based on how difficult it looked to get the second jump off (this person can normally do a great 2Z and a decent 3Z), even someone who can do both triples would probably not bother with it in an elite competition. It isn't worth the risk. (You'd think Rohene Ward could have pulled it off, at least a 3Z-2Z. He put all kinds of unique stuff in his programs.)

Also: LOVE Armin's video!

ETA: Here is a video on youtube of a 1Z-1Z. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5A6f-956Ug

[Katarzyna]

I think one reason for skaters to do the combo as a 2nd jump might just be that they feel the first one is not good enough to go for a combo, e.g. if the landing is slightly wobbly. So the skater will hope that the 2nd jump is better and that he can add the combo-jump more secure then.