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  1. #1
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    Thoughts no US getting only one judge at Worlds

    Jimmie Santee put up a blog post about the news that the US is getting just one judge at Worlds. Wondering everyone's thoughts on this.
    In my spare time, I like to interview figure skating legends.

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    Quote Originally Posted by manleywoman View Post
    Jimmie Santee put up a blog post about the news that the US is getting just one judge at Worlds. Wondering everyone's thoughts on this.
    Canada had no judges at all at Worlds 2010.

    It happens. At least you got one.
    Last edited by flowerpower; 10-24-2011 at 05:05 PM.

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    My thoughts? The US isn't the centre of the universe. (And I live there.)

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    I still am baffled as to why the judges represent countries, and not the ISU (doesn't the technical controller represent the ISU?)

    I guess I don't understand the system at all- how come some countries have no judges, some have 1, other have 4? Why is it not just all countries have 1 or 2? Why is it so uneven.

    I don't care so much that the US has 1 judge, but that it seems completely wacky for any country. (How did Canada have no judges in 2010? And presumably others had 3 or 4?)

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    Is this Jimmie Santee in the photograh the ex-skater and brother of David? Yikes. Gosh, It sucks getting old, LOL.

    I don't think it matter overall anymore that the U.S. only has one judge or even no judge at Worlds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveRocks View Post
    My thoughts? The US isn't the centre of the universe. (And I live there.)
    This. We really need to learn to share the wealth. I also don't care how many spots we have for skaters; other countries are deserving of spots also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by emason View Post
    I also don't care how many spots we have for skaters; other countries are deserving of spots also.
    The only reason I care about spots is it makes me sad when good skaters have to stay home. I realize World's is about representing all the federations, but I feel like it should be a chance for all the best skaters in the world to compete against each other. A third American lady is going to do a lot better than some of the low ranking skaters, but she won't get to go. I feel the same way when the US has 5 amazing ladies, and only 3 get to go. Or Japan. Or any other powerhouse.

    There is no competition where the ALL of the top skaters compete against each other.

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    The fact that this is even a discussion implies that we assume judges will have a national bias. I would hope if the US skaters do their best, it won't matter what country the judges are from.

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    [QUOTE=Skittl1321;3335760]I still am baffled as to why the judges represent countries, and not the ISU (doesn't the technical controller represent the ISU?) ?)[/QUOTE

    Championship (World) Judges do represent the ISU. When promoted to Championship status they are listed as ISU regarless of citizenship.

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    Morry Stillwell

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    Thanks for clarifying. The judges at SA were introduced as representing their country. Only the controllers was announced as representing the ISU. I figured this was the same.

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    There are lots of ISU countries. USA can't expect to have judges in all disciplines at all years.
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    The fact that some countries have 4 judges and the US only 1 does seem old school ISU politics. I don't believe IJS has solved national bias and deal making. It has been going on far too long.
    "awwww....shades of Janet Lynn" - Dick Button on anyone who makes more than one mistake in their program.

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    I think there was only one US judge the year Worlds were in LA also. As others have said, it does happen.

    I think Japan only got one judge selected for the Vancouver Olympics, if I remember correctly.

    But with the new scoring system there is no gaurantee that even if a judge is on the panel this her/his marks will count anyway.
    I meant to take the high road.... but I missed the exit.

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    How are judges selected normally?

    I just want the best judges for the job, if they best doesn't come from the USA; fine by me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post
    Thanks for clarifying. The judges at SA were introduced as representing their country. Only the controllers was announced as representing the ISU. I figured this was the same.

    At Skate America the Judges were International Judges, not Championship judges, and are contoled by their county Federation. When a judge is promoted to Championship Judge, that person is no longer subject to Federation control, other than they must remain eligible under Federation and ISU Rules.
    Morry Stillwell

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    morry: there were ISU Championship judges on the panel at SA. You can have either international or ISU CHAMPIONSHIP judges. Grand prix final and all championship events must have ISU Championship judges. DO federations ask judges to show their personal protocol to the powers that be? Even if random for each skater on the protocol, they could ask to see the personal papers of the judge, thus still intimadating the judge. However, in this system I do believe it is MUCH harder to "cheat", as there are so many marks given, and if really over or under marking to the corriodor set by the judges of the panel, then there could be issues and assessments as a result. The corridor is formed by ALL THE JUDGES on the panel for the puposes of establishing the corridor for which a judge is held to standard, the OAC counts 1 1/2 times for the corridor, the referee 2 times for championship events; other events, the referee 2 times, and since no OAC is on site and the viewing is done off site, there is no adding of the OAC to the corridor for other events. JUDGES set the corridor by adding the marks together for example interpretation, then divided by the number of judges on the panel, adding the referee's marks for 2 times, the OAC for 1 1/2 times, and the result is the allowed corridor for the judge for assessments purposes of which the judge must fall inbetween those numbers. In all other events other than Championship events such as the Grand Prixs of jrs. and srs, the evaluating is done by OAC members at home via the dvd of the events, and on those the referee counts 2 times, but no OAC is counting, they just evaluate. SO truly the judges DO SET the corridor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveRocks View Post
    My thoughts? The US isn't the centre of the universe. (And I live there.)
    LOL, I totally agree! :bow: Though judging by much of what gets posted on these online skating forums, you'd think it was.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveRocks View Post
    My thoughts? The US isn't the centre of the universe. (And I live there.)
    Exactly.

    I've read comments from a few other people suggesting it was all some great injustice; one wonders if they understand how a random draw works? Unless you want to move to a different method of selecting judges, which would likely be much more political, accept that sometimes the draw means a country gets four judges and sometimes it doesn't get any. And every other option in between.

    I am sure D/W will do just fine even without an American judge.
    Last edited by Zemgirl; 10-25-2011 at 09:33 AM.

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    IIRC, it used to be that the judging panels at Worlds and Europeans (and probably the Olympics) were drawn from the federations with the ten highest finishes in the previous year's competition, with one federation randomly selected not to be included on the panel.

    That system was indeed highly political. It's a good thing the ISU replaced it with a system that allows for the random selection of the entire panel and also enables European judges to participate at Four Continents and non-Europeans to judge Europeans.

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    in comparison, Turkey has 2 judges, as does Russia, Japan, Italy, Canada, Austria, Denmark, Czechoslovakia and Israel
    That would certainly be a bigger problem than the US only having one judge!

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