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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maofan7 View Post
    Coming in as a late replacement for Sarah Meier, Elizaveta Tuktamysheva has just won the Japan Open on her senior debut. She beat quite an impressive line up. The result was as follows:-

    1. Elizaveta Tuktamysheva RUS – 118.59
    2. Joannie Rochette CAN – 112.74
    3. Akiko Suzuki JPN – 112.46
    4. Alena Leonova RUS – 108.39
    5. Alissa Czisny USA – 107.64
    6. Miki Ando JPN – 88.11

    No videos available yet, but apparently she successfully landed six triples, including two triple-triple combinations - a triple lutz-triple toe, and a triple salchow-triple toe late on in the program. Her short program this season is Adios Nonino (a tango by Ástor Piazzolla) and her free skate is Besame Mucho (by Consuelo Velázquez). Here are some video's of her performing both programs earlier in the season.

    Short Program & Free Skate

    Short Program

    As for Adelina Sotnikova, news from the Russian Test Skates is that she produced a near perfect performance of her new short program (hence, if there is a leg problem still, it obviously isn't causing her any major problems). Accordingly, looks like both Russian newbies will be entering the senior grand prix in very good form.

    Evidently, Sotnikova's late withdrawal from the Ondrej Nepela Memorial event was to enable her to properly prepare for the Russian Test Skates.
    Thank's for the refresher vids! I've always liked the arm overhead double axel!

    Congrats to Tuktamysheva on winning her first Senior international right out of the box! The young guns are going to keep the vets on their toe picks!
    Sounds like Elizaveta did an awesome job, can't wait to see actual footage of the competition! I of course can't wait to see Joannie's and Alissa's efforts.
    Last edited by Sasha'sSpins; 10-03-2011 at 06:39 AM.

  2. #22
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hK3W_tzkvCs

    Here's her skate from the Japan Open. She is 14, not 13. Her birthday is in December, so she'll be (only) 15 for worlds, so she will go to junior worlds instead, unless something drastic happens.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by doubleflutz View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hK3W_tzkvCs

    Here's her skate from the Japan Open. She is 14, not 13. Her birthday is in December, so she'll be (only) 15 for worlds, so she will go to junior worlds instead, unless something drastic happens.
    Many thanks for the video link doubleflutz! That was an awesome skate and in no way could that be described as a "juniorish" performance (indeed, it would be an insult to Joannie Rochette, Alissa Czisny, and the other seniors to tell them that they had been beaten by a "juniorish" performance!) The two triple-triple combinations were superb (with 6 triples in total). When I began this thread, I included links to Liza's performances from earlier in the season. Given her skate at the Japan Open, she has certainly moved on since then and stepped up several levels. I think that by the time she hits the senior Grand Prix in November, she will be very tough to beat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    I of course can't wait to see Joannie's and Alissa's efforts.
    Here is the video for Alissa's performance:-

    Alissa Czisny

  5. #25
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    Wonderful senior debut

    I've watched this program several times now, and Tuktamysheva really has her own style, and an understated elegance very much like Sarah Meier.

  6. #26

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    Liza T. and Akiko S. fantastic! As for Alyssa...well, a program skated to funeral music doesn't help. Where's the energy and brio? Liza and others may also be skating to slow music but they sparkle and show energy. Alyssa must have been ill in Japan this past weekend.
    Dick Button Historical Quote of the Month: "Good for you, Lucinda Ruh!"

  7. #27
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    I'm not a fan of Liza T's style but I wouldn't call her juniorish either. She doesn't have the ease, flow or polish that some of the more established skaters have, but all of that will come with time. What she does have is confidence, fire and killer jumps with great technique. I would like to see her challenged with some real choreography as well--something to really push her. Again, that will come with time. Her jumps were solid, she looked like she was having fun and it was a good performance. Liza T's spins are a weakness though. There was nothing good about that "layback" (IDK if you can even call it that) and her other spins needed better positioning and speed...but that's something she can work on.

    Point is, she has a fabulous base and has plenty of room to build up her skating, style, presentation, etc. I really see this season as a continuation of last year's JGP season: it'll probably be Elizaveta versus Adelina...I don't think these senior ladies know what's about to hit them. They got a taste of Liza T, but wait until Adelina comes along...they won't know what hit them...

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    I'm not a fan of Liza T's style but I wouldn't call her juniorish either. She doesn't have the ease, flow or polish that some of the more established skaters have, but all of that will come with time. What she does have is confidence, fire and killer jumps with great technique. I would like to see her challenged with some real choreography as well--something to really push her. Again, that will come with time. Her jumps were solid, she looked like she was having fun and it was a good performance. Liza T's spins are a weakness though. There was nothing good about that "layback" (IDK if you can even call it that) and her other spins needed better positioning and speed...but that's something she can work on.

    Point is, she has a fabulous base and has plenty of room to build up her skating, style, presentation, etc. I really see this season as a continuation of last year's JGP season: it'll probably be Elizaveta versus Adelina...I don't think these senior ladies know what's about to hit them. They got a taste of Liza T, but wait until Adelina comes along...they won't know what hit them...
    I think these young girls might also push senior ladies to increase the difficulty and skate better. And I really hope they will, I'm tired of splatfests when one can land the jumps but can't fully rotate them and the other can rotate but can't land... Especially now, with Kim and Ando out and Mao's problems, Grand Prix events really need a breath of fresh air like Adelina and Liza

  9. #29
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    Do we have protocals from the event?

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenna View Post
    I see great improvement over last year in presentation. Jumps are gorgeous, though the flip seems to give her the most trouble.

    Her only weak point would be the spins. The positions could be improved, especially the layback.
    Mishins skaters are typically not good with spins. That goes back to Urmanov even. I wonder if he teaches his skaters to rest during spins because they are never a highlight of his skaters programs. Yagudins were OK, Plushenko is a slow spinner...

  11. #31

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    This girl is amazing and for a 14 year old she skated way above her years. Uses the music, showed personality and character and the jump technique is fabulous. Particularly the expression is something you cannot teach, it has to come from the skater and she showed lots of that.

    However this girl, regardless of what she showed, is still a developing skater. For the complaints about the spins, I daresay the long term plan for this skater was to get the jump technique right (which is pretty damn near perfect) and then time will be spent on the spins. But if by what she showed and how she won this event is a sign of the future, the future is really bright.

    I do find it amazing on this forum, even in the JGP threads, how some people expect these junior skaters to be on par with senior level skaters. However the expectations are unrealistic and I think people need to understand that these skaters are pretty much all developing and are far from where they will be in 3-4 years time (that is if they stay in the sport).
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    I do find it amazing on this forum, even in the JGP threads, how some people expect these junior skaters to be on par with senior level skaters. However the expectations are unrealistic and I think people need to understand that these skaters are pretty much all developing and are far from where they will be in 3-4 years time (that is if they stay in the sport).
    I definitely get where you're coming from in terms of the expectation on younger skaters. As I said I expect her style, flow and overall presentation to iron itself out over the next year or so...that's something that comes with experience and maturity--and those two things only come with time, so I have no problem with that.

    Liza's spins on the other hand can't be included in the "she's only 14" argument. You can point to a number of junior skaters on the JGP who have better spins than Liza. She still has time to work on it but at this stage, I don't see her layback getting to Mirai/Alissa territory at anytime in the future and that's fine...every skater can't be excellent at everything. She'll get by with what she can do and hopefully she'll continue to work on it...but for now, her layback is a bit of an eyesore IMO...

  13. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    I definitely get where you're coming from in terms of the expectation on younger skaters. As I said I expect her style, flow and overall presentation to iron itself out over the next year or so...that's something that comes with experience and maturity--and those two things only come with time, so I have no problem with that.

    Liza's spins on the other hand can't be included in the "she's only 14" argument. You can point to a number of junior skaters on the JGP who have better spins than Liza. She still has time to work on it but at this stage, I don't see her layback getting to Mirai/Alissa territory at anytime in the future and that's fine...every skater can't be excellent at everything. She'll get by with what she can do and hopefully she'll continue to work on it...but for now, her layback is a bit of an eyesore IMO...
    Yes you can have that argument. Many coaching and skater teams will focus on certain aspects of the skating, whether it be jumps or spins. I think the spins have probably been sacrificed for the jumps. I don't blame the skater but rather the coaching team.

    With regards laybacks, poor laybacks with skating these days are the norm and not the exception. Very few ladies I have seen, even at senior level, can do a really good layback. Unfortunately quite a few are limited by their flexibility. So that is why they now have the sideways spin as an option. So why we expect a Alissa type layback from this girl I don't get when everything else, including for myself the musicality and presentation, actually exceeds those other skaters. She actually looks like she enjoys herself which is something that can't be said for a lot skaters as well There are so many aspects of this girl's skating that are totally in the right direction, I can forgive her for the spins not being totally up to the standard we expect of a senior skater.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  14. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post

    I do find it amazing on this forum, even in the JGP threads, how some people expect these junior skaters to be on par with senior level skaters. However the expectations are unrealistic and I think people need to understand that these skaters are pretty much all developing and are far from where they will be in 3-4 years time (that is if they stay in the sport).
    Considering how snarky we can get, I think the comments on her skating have been pretty tame and constructive in nature. I don't think there was anything unrealistic suggested for things that she can improve and work on. She is a now a senior lady about to make her debut on the senior GP and the comments IMO are totally in line with where she is at with her skating. YMMV

  15. #35

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    Liza need better art direction and better programs. For me this Bésame Mucho FS program is an artistic failure, not to say it is not capable of winning. I think she is a musical skater with excellent interpretative skills as shown in her exhibitions programs, but were not fully utilized in her LP.

    The success of her entire performance rest on the fact she has the strongest technical content, a natural charisma of a little Russian Diva. She's the ingénue that still has the innocence of self believe with nothing to loose and the good will from the judges to commend her for putting out a challenging content. I think she will be a big star one day, but this is not a program for the ages in which she will be remembered by, unless you are one of those who get impressed by 2x 3:3s only.

    I find the music edit strangely disjointed in 3 parts with no correlation between the performance, the choreography, and the music and what is trying to communicate.

    Bésame Mucho is a Latin/Spanish love song about 'kiss me, being kissed', but where is the desire, where is the charm? Where is the seduction to allure love, the very first kiss? Where is the tension, the Latin spirit?

    It is used merely used as a background music for a little girl playing make pretend doing fun movements that has no meaning but to deliver the routine elements. Liza did well because she is blessed with a natural charisma and she has good innate presentation skills. But when it all comes down to it, she might as well skate to any other music, it wouldn't make much of a difference with what was put on ice that day.

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    Liza is so fantastic that everyone can fall in love with her. However, there is one thing we need to remember. This girl is really small at present.
    Last edited by galaxy; 10-04-2011 at 02:36 AM.

  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayra View Post
    Considering how snarky we can get, I think the comments on her skating have been pretty tame and constructive in nature. I don't think there was anything unrealistic suggested for things that she can improve and work on. She is a now a senior lady about to make her debut on the senior GP and the comments IMO are totally in line with where she is at with her skating. YMMV
    I was making a general comment about how some posters comment on junior skaters (this includes discussions on the JGP event threads) and that they don't seem to take into account that they are developing skaters.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    Liza's spins on the other hand can't be included in the "she's only 14" argument. You can point to a number of junior skaters on the JGP who have better spins than Liza.
    How many of them can skate as fast as she can, have all five female triples with perfect technique, and have the stamina to do a six triple program with two different 3-3 combinations, including one almost four minutes in? I mean, Yuna had completely terrible spin positions at a much later age, if we're pretending to put this in perspective. I believe Liza still goes to school full-time as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doubleflutz View Post
    How many of them can skate as fast as she can, have all five female triples with perfect technique, and have the stamina to do a six triple program with two different 3-3 combinations, including one almost four minutes in? I mean, Yuna had completely terrible spin positions at a much later age, if we're pretending to put this in perspective. I believe Liza still goes to school full-time as well.
    What spin of hers do you mean? I mean, she's got gorgeous lay-over camel yuna spin, beautiful layback positions, perfectly paralleled-with-ice sit position, fine-but-probably-not-the-best-for-flexibility-nuts biellman shape and etc.

    You think not pointing her toes in layback spin or bending her neck way over to her back in biellmann position is "completely terrible positions"?

  20. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    ....it'll probably be Elizaveta versus Adelina...I don't think these senior ladies know what's about to hit them. They got a taste of Liza T, but wait until Adelina comes along...they won't know what hit them...
    I agree. Adelina and Liza could be this season's version of Mao & Yu-Na in 2005/06. In both cases, the 'seniors' are overwhelmed by two mini-wonders who are too young for the senior ISU events but make their marks during their first senior GP season. Let's see if history repeats itself...if the too-young-for-Worlds kids mow over the seniors in the G-P circuit. Maybe yes, maybe no. Can't wait to see it play out.
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