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  1. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    I saw a few pictures of the skates they wore in the late 19th or early 20th century. I don't know how they were able to achieve precision in them. Impressive!

    More recently whenever I complained (and I am not a competition skater at all) about the ice being bad, my coach always told me that he had skated on much worse ice. :lol
    Not to mention that skaters of earlier eras had to compete outdoors! Brrrh!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mafke View Post
    I basically agree, but there were real lacks in Baiul's skating (like anyone one foot turn besides a three) that she would never have been able to get away with in CoP. Great basic stroking (light years ahead of Bonaly) but, again, some real technical holes. Part of why she was able to get away with it (beyond being very cute) was that the judges just assumed she had skills that she didn't (or why else was she there).

    Bonaly decided to reinvent skating as a kind of running. From her point of view she was operating within the rules (and if the ISU really cared about technique why get rid of figures?) and probably didn't understand a lot of the criticism.
    As Vash stated neither Baiul (nor Bonaly) skated under COP. Surely Baiul's coach would have trained her geared towards her strengths in COP. Cohen was never a great jumper but managed to medal at worlds and an Olympics under COP. I'm sure with her strong basics and artistic skills Baiul would have too. I'm not sure how Bonaly would have fared with her questionable technique, poor edges, lack of flow, and sometimes jarring landings.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    I always wondered how Oksana would have fared if she had been born in a country with much better facilities and coaches then the Ukraine had. She certainly didn't have the advantages that someone like Nancy Kerrigan had for instance. The Ukraine was not exactly a rich country even when they were a part of the old Soviet Union as a republic of the old USSR. I think she had the potential to be great.
    I had never even considered this! ITA!

    Quote Originally Posted by Louise View Post
    Baiul had wonderful flow and skills. She was a skater foremost, but also a dancer in the kindest sense. She could have picked up a bracket, choctaw, whatever in a few minutes, please.
    Bonaly was always a WTF to me. Okay, so she didn't have innate musicality, well, FAKE IT like every other junior princess does. I blame it on the French Fed, Didier Gailhaguet in particular who was either her coach or spokesperson or pimp, whatevs. But what disappointed me the most, was that she was an athlete, had full body awareness and was really world class no matter what sport she chose. I only wish she had used that OCD that landed her soooo many 3toes and 3sals to have learned how to use her edges. If she had edges and flow on her blade, she would have won numerous world titles, I'm sure. I'm not sure why the French Fed cannot see the lack of skating skills in their program. They seem to reward the awful 'skaters' but the weird ass performers. But then again, the international judges were smoking crack or just cowtowed to Didier when they always favored Phil Candeloro over a true skater like Eric Millot.
    Can anyone watch 1995 Birmingham and believe Phil was better than Eric? Well, the judges did. Total politik. It's just inherent in the corrupt system.
    Last edited by Sasha'sSpins; 09-18-2011 at 10:00 AM.
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  2. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    I always wondered how Oksana would have fared if she had been born in a country with much better facilities and coaches then the Ukraine had. She certainly didn't have the advantages that someone like Nancy Kerrigan had for instance. The Ukraine was not exactly a rich country even when they were a part of the old Soviet Union as a republic of the old USSR. I think she had the potential to be great.
    It's true that Ukraine did not have money to invest in their athletes/skaters. Viktor Petrenko was an exception. Even when he skated for the USSR in 1988, he trained in Odessa, not in Moscow or St.Petersburg. He won the Olympic bronze at age 18, and world silvers in 90 & 91 before skating for the unified team in 1992, and winning the Olympic gold and world title. Oksana had other disadvantages, however. She was essentially an orphan at age 13. It's amazing how much she accomplished in a short time, due to her natural talent (and help from Galina and Viktor).

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Emdee View Post
    Virtue & Moir have the best chance.
    Dance is starting to get very physical as well. All of those lifts and tricks. Plus dancers have to spend more hours on the ice than free skaters.

    You don't see as many 30 -something couples as you did 10 years ago.

  4. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Louise View Post
    But BB wasn't that consistent the season he came back. Plus he omitted his loop, and his program wasn't much choreographically. It's been about 18 years ago, but what still stands out was how much time he spent doing spread eagles, almost to the point of parody. Cross-overs and spread eagles is all I can remember about the program.

    Viktor was my fave going into the Olympics. He won both Skate America and Nation's Cup. I still would have had him first in the LP.
    I don't think Brian was much without his jumps. He was so big and jumped so high and slowly went into rotation at the peak of the jump, it was amazing to watch. Not like the quick spinny don't-blink-or-you'll-miss-it jumps of the small skaters. But I agree with those who say as an artist he was pretty one dimensional. If you'd seen one of his programs you'd seen them all.

  5. #85
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    Boitano as a pro seemed to settle into big Tenor Aria + Spread Eagle programs. I think he was much more diverse when he was an eligible skater. But then so was Caryn Kadavy: Floaty Dress + Celine Dion (or Other Sappy Female Soloist) + Look of Mild Angst. When the audiences are the judges, pros tend to give the audience what it wants, which is usually more of the same of anything they like.

    While I understood and appreciated the construction of his 1988 FS -- head over heels better than the "shuffle" approach to many programs before it, including Cousins' 1980 music, -- I especially loved his "Les Patineurs" SP. Someone was paying attention to Ashton.
    "'Is this new BMW-designed sled the ultimate sledding machine for Langdon and Holcomb?' Leigh Diffey asked before the pair cruised to victory. I don’t know, but I know that sled is the ultimate Olympic Games product placement.." -- Jen Chaney

  6. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    Boitano as a pro seemed to settle into big Tenor Aria + Spread Eagle programs. I think he was much more diverse when he was an eligible skater. But then so was Caryn Kadavy: Floaty Dress + Celine Dion (or Other Sappy Female Soloist) + Look of Mild Angst. When the audiences are the judges, pros tend to give the audience what it wants, which is usually more of the same of anything they like.

    While I understood and appreciated the construction of his 1988 FS -- head over heels better than the "shuffle" approach to many programs before it, including Cousins' 1980 music, -- I especially loved his "Les Patineurs" SP. Someone was paying attention to Ashton.

    I have to completely disagree here. Boitano experimented with a lot of different music and different styles as a pro. He even tried humor at one point, though I don't remember the music. At another time his 'Hernando's hideway' program was very entertaining. It wasn't always aria/spread eagles. Actually he skated less of those types of music as a pro. He had nothing to lose at that point. As an amateur (i did not watch a lot of his programs then) the types of music he was using was not working for him. Sandra Bezic found the right music for him and the rest was history. However, after winning the OGM he tried other styles too.

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