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  1. #1

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    Anti-Lysacek revisions to COP = Lysacek doing quads?

    Universal Sports has an article about Lysacek training quads. So glad the anti-Lysacek revisions to the COP making quads worth doing has the anti-quad activist doing quads. Chan can do three a competition so there is a way to go. Kind of sad though how some people are acting like an Olympic Champion doing a quad is newsworthy. That is really kind of sad. What is it the 1980's or something? It's like a video of Jason Brown trying a 3A. So dumb of the judges to give someone quadless the gold medal over PLushenko who did two quad triples. Well if it wasn't for Plushenko and the anti-Lysacek COP revisions to prevent quadless gold medalists this wouldn't be happening.

    http://www.universalsports.com/news-...id=550378.html

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    I enjoy the feeling when you accomplish something which is hard,
    Knowing that you pushed yourself to the limit. Some people think I'm crazy but maybe what drives me is to see what my limits are and how far I can go.
    The jump looks amazing. Maybe this tweet of his was coming from his quad practices? I knew he was doing something incredible when I read it! GO EVAN He did quads pre-olympic seasons which was sadly inconsistent, right? Wow, this season's mens' field would be jam-packed with quads!

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    It's gonna be really interesting.
    Which one will be the next Champion, Lysacek or Chan.

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    It's amazing how it looks like he doesn't even need much speed before the jump.

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    Good for Evan. He looks well trained and ready to go.

    Whats up with the thread title a little snarky huh. If you are so anti Evan why did you post the video in the first place along with your snide comments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kittyjake5 View Post
    Good for Evan. He looks well trained and ready to go.

    Whats up with the thread title a little snarky huh. If you are so anti Evan why did you post the video in the first place along with your snide comments.
    ^ I agree with these comments on both accounts.

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    I'm surprised Lysacek has time to train anything what with his busy schedule of petition drives, public protests, poster making, PSAs, grass roots organizing and other anti-quad activism....

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    Nice video, thanks for posting it. He did that jump with little effort - very nice to see.
    Bravo Evan! Now I'm actually interested in the men's skating this season.

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    It's funny how guys who used to defend their quadlessness so much, like Lysacek and Chan, decide to train and do quads eventually. Seems that the quad defenders were right after all.
    Anyway, it's good to see them realize the importance of the jump.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mia joy View Post
    It's funny how guys who used to defend their quadlessness so much, like Lysacek and Chan, decide to train and do quads eventually. Seems that the quad defenders were right after all.
    Anyway, it's good to see them realize the importance of the jump.
    Especially funny is that Chan turned out to be one of the best quad jumpers since Plushenko. It's rare that a skater successfully lands its 1st quad at the beginning of a season and lands 3 quads in one competion at the end of the same season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfan26 View Post
    Especially funny is that Chan turned out to be one of the best quad jumpers since Plushenko. It's rare that a skater successfully lands its 1st quad at the beginning of a season and lands 3 quads in one competion at the end of the same season.
    Yes, it's true.

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    I'd like to jump in and just say ...

    Chan didn't say he would never have a quad in his skating. What he did say basically, was that he was getting marks for what he did according to the rules of COP.

    IIRC, I think he did mention that he would add the quad at some time but I don't *think* he put any timeline on when it would take place. And then voila! he goes out and trains hard to get one landed often under his belt in practice, then shows us the result of that hard work - from single to multiple quads in one season.

    mia joy - the only problem I had with the quad defenders is that some of them felt that landing a quad = winning the gold medal. COP isn't just about the jumps but I will say that I'm glad to see that landing a quad gets a higher mark than it used to. I like the jumps but that's not the only thing I want to see in a program. Good and intricate footwork thrills me just as much as a cleanly landed quad or triple axel in combo.
    Crazy about sports!

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    well if all the cool kids are doing it...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mia joy View Post
    It's funny how guys who used to defend their quadlessness so much, like Lysacek and Chan, decide to train and do quads eventually. Seems that the quad defenders were right after all.
    No they weren't. Lysacek won the Olympics and worlds without one. He was right . The quad was not the defining factor at the Olympics, a complete program was.

    Now he comes back and there is more incentive to do the quad. Hence, he's practicing the quad again.

    Props to Evan, what a beautiful quad he was able to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by professordeb View Post
    Chan didn't say he would never have a quad in his skating. What he did say basically, was that he was getting marks for what he did according to the rules of COP.

    IIRC, I think he did mention that he would add the quad at some time but I don't *think* he put any timeline on when it would take place. And then voila! he goes out and trains hard to get one landed often under his belt in practice, then shows us the result of that hard work - from single to multiple quads in one season.
    The timeline for Chan and the quad, as far as I know it: he was definitely training a 4T in 2009, and tried it at Liberty that summer (he fell). For various reasons, it was never included in his Olympic season programs. At 2010 Worlds, the subject came up in a press conference (post-LP, IIRC) and Chan said he would try it on the GP circuit, but that he would start out only with an attempt in the LP - I believe he referred to the jump as "intimidating" at the time. Clearly, with the quad going well in training and the various rule changes, it became worth his while to try more than one, and since 3A won't ever be his strongest suit, doing two 4Ts in the LP became even more attractive. Basically, I think the outcome was a result of Chan's career trajectory, the rule changes, and strategy related to his own strengths and weaknesses as a skater. The rule changes were probably not the primary consideration, since it seems to have been part of the plan for some time before, but they likely made it more attractive to attempt more than one.

    Re Lysacek, it seems clear that the trend in skating is toward more difficult jumps. Barring major mistakes from several skaters, he's non-competitive with triples only - and he must know it. Since the various rule changes did play a large part in encouraging skaters to try more quads, I feel comfortable in attributing his change of heart to this.

    Yes, yes, I know, poor Evan had a stress fracture in 2009 and it affected his training and the quad. Plushenko had serious knee issues, Joubert was returning from a nasty foot injury in which he severed tendons and a ligament, Takahashi was a little over a year removed from major ACL surgery, and Lambiel had his issues. And yet they all at least attempted quads at the Olympics. If Evan Lysacek really wanted to try a quad, I don't believe the stress fracture would have stopped him. He made a strategic decision then (which paid off by a very narrow margin), and he's making a strategic decision now.

    BTW, nobody should get overexcited about a decent training quad. If he lands a good one in actual competition, then it might be more interesting (I argued the exact same thing re Chan and the quad back in 2009).

    All that having been said, I doubt the rule changes were specifically "anti-Lysacek". The ISU is forever tinkering and trying to find the right balance between the various aspects of skating. I'd say it's still a work in progress.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dots View Post
    The quad was not the defining factor at the Olympics, a complete program was.

    Exactly, and that's what the quad squad does not seem to understand. Two seconds and four revolutions do not make a complete program.
    'Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.'--John Wayne

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDilemma View Post
    I'm surprised Lysacek has time to train anything what with his busy schedule of petition drives, public protests, poster making, PSAs, grass roots organizing and other anti-quad activism....
    Team Peeps!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dots View Post
    No they weren't. Lysacek won the Olympics and worlds without one. He was right . The quad was not the defining factor at the Olympics, a complete program was.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChelleC View Post
    Exactly, and that's what the quad squad does not seem to understand. Two seconds and four revolutions do not make a complete program.
    Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by caseyedwards View Post
    Universal Sports has an article about Lysacek training quads. So glad the anti-Lysacek revisions to the COP making quads worth doing has the anti-quad activist doing quads. Chan can do three a competition so there is a way to go. Kind of sad though how some people are acting like an Olympic Champion doing a quad is newsworthy. That is really kind of sad. What is it the 1980's or something? It's like a video of Jason Brown trying a 3A. So dumb of the judges to give someone quadless the gold medal over PLushenko who did two quad triples. Well if it wasn't for Plushenko and the anti-Lysacek COP revisions to prevent quadless gold medalists this wouldn't be happening.

    http://www.universalsports.com/news-...id=550378.html
    Why so extreme in your statements? Why rehash Vancouver? 'Anti-Lysacek revisions'? And if he is going full bore on Quads now, wouldn't that make you happier? IMO, you seem a little obsessed with him

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