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  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    Gilles/Poirier FD (94.66) to "Pure Imagination" / "Sweet Dreams": http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/18887560
    I thoroughly enjoyed this. He lacked chemistry with Crone and has some here. Very nice, plus they seem to really enjoy doing this excellent Dean choreo. Even the strange music edit works for me...I just like it all around.
    Disclaimer: The post contained herein represents the opinions of a fan and may or may not bear any relation to reality.

  2. #182

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    It's a fun program. I enjoyed it.
    Addicted to FSU

  3. #183

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    And in the first twizzle that requirement wasn't fulfilled. It was all three-turns.



    It's pretty much impossible to perform twizzles with the free leg raised and extended to the side.
    Now that I've watched the twizzles from the short dance, I have to disagree that they were 3-turns. Paul's motion in particular flows consistently from beginning to end from both of them with no break or interruption, and there is definitely no rise-and-fall in the knee or checking going on. Piper's isn't *quite* as seamless looking, but on the spectrum of "definitely three-turn" to "definitely twizzle" I would rate it much closer to "definitely twizzle." It is definitely a judgment call sometimes, but I would rate her first twizzle as acceptable and his as particularly good. They aren't as quick as most twizzles due to the free leg position, and to be fair, a twizzle does have to have a certain degree of quickness to it by definition, but these ones I felt were certainly quick enough. Believe me, I've seen plenty of twizzles that have truly turned into 3-turns, and will try to find an example.

    ETA: U.S. Figure Skating's definition of a "twizzle"

    Twizzle (Twz): A traveling turn on one foot with one or more rotations,
    which is quickly rotated with a continuous (uninterrupted) action. The weight
    remains on the skating foot with the free foot in any position during the turn,
    and then placed beside the skating foot to skate the next step. A series of checked
    three-turns is not acceptable, as this does not constitute a continuous action. If
    the traveling action stops during the execution, the twizzle becomes a solo spin
    (pirouette). The four different types of entry edges for twizzles are: (1) forward
    inside (FI); (2) forward outside (FO); (3) backward inside (BI); (4) backward
    outside (BO).

    Some guidelines given in judge's training to look for in twizzles:

    Standards/expectations (this is on the Intermediate Moves in the Field test in the U.S.): static skating leg/knee (either bent or straight) during twizzle, skated with continuous flow, strong core and body alignment. Errors include lack of flow, double three-turn action, and scraped or skidded turns.
    Last edited by RFOS; 12-03-2011 at 04:18 AM.

  4. #184
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    The side leg position has been accepted by the tech panels for several years now.

    Accepting lots of things as twizzles seems to be a caregiver from 6.0 -- I remember Rosaleen explaining the difference to me at Dortmund Worlds in 2004 -- where the system addresses it in theory, like flutzing, but doesn't address it without a crackdown of sorts. Usually that's meant giving it to the tech panel, but here it's the panel accepting the element and assigning feature levels, since a more difficult position than passe.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  5. #185

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    Right now they look to me like he's taking his talented little sister through the tests.
    Yes, that’s my feeling too. And totally not what I was expecting, which is my fault, not Piper’s. Carol and Yuris are terrific coaches who work their skaters hard. Piper couldn’t be in better hands. I’m sure she’ll come along in no time. Their FD is extremely innovative and will definitely set them apart from the other teams. A bit tough for me to enjoy at it at this point though because I’m used to Paul skating with a partner who is very close to his equal. Despite her cosmetic flaws, when it came to blade to the ice, Vanessa was among the best out there, IMHO.
    images on ice - Figure Skating Photography

  6. #186
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    They're good. There's no question. They seem to have come together really well, and Poirier already has more connection with Gilles than he ever had with Crone. It's the programs that don't really do it for me. The SD was fine, but nothing special. And the FD really bothered me, especially because I was expecting to really like it. I liked the elements, and thought the lifts positions were really nice. The transitional movements seemed really disjointed to me though. It looked like they were doing a set of quirky movements one after the other just for the sake of being quirky. They didn't really flow together, nor match the music as well as I would have hoped. It almost seemed that they were trying too hard to be different. Also, if you're going to go quirky, you have to go all out with the facial expressions, which I didn't think they did. That's totally understandable, though, given how new they are. Hopefully they can grow on me, because they certainly have potential.

  7. #187
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    Disjointed is Dean's style. The lady doing wavy arm movements is another thing he beats to death.

    Gilles & Poirier said this is a circus theme. Dean's liked circus themes for years. And mechanical toy-type movement. Circus was a group number theme he did for SOI fifteen years ago in the 1990s.

    Dean a great figure skater along with Jayne Torvill but he's no choreographic genius. His choreography career is built on Bolero which is almost 30 years ago, charisma, his maestro image and legendary name. I liked his program for A&P but that's kind of rare. He's not more original than anyone else doing skating choreography.

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subway View Post
    Gilles & Poirier said this is a circus theme. Dean's liked circus themes for years. And mechanical toy-type movement. Circus was a group number theme he did for SOI fifteen years ago in the 1990s.
    His 1983 FD too http://youtu.be/ydN5Glf9KI0

  9. #189
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    G/P's FD to a certain extent reminded me of the number La Valz Dean choreographed for Lipinski and Browning some years ago, funny and adorable the Dean way. For what it's worth, I liked Imagination. That there is room for improvement...yes, there is, but I think the program suits Gilles and Poirier well.

  10. #190

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    Quote Originally Posted by shutterbug View Post
    Despite her cosmetic flaws, when it came to blade to the ice, Vanessa was among the best out there, IMHO.
    Vanessa was was excellent technically, but had no connection with Paul - found her boring as hell!

    Piper Gilles and Paul have a spark and excitement that makes watching them a pleasure. As Piper grows technically this team will become a force to be reckoned within Ice Dancing.
    There is nothing more captivating in this world than a woman's form gracing the ice in skating boots. It's simply sensational!

  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subway View Post

    Dean a great figure skater along with Jayne Torvill but he's no choreographic genius. His choreography career is built on Bolero which is almost 30 years ago, charisma, his maestro image and legendary name. I liked his program for A&P but that's kind of rare. He's not more original than anyone else doing skating choreography.


    I'm chuckling at this. I guess it does take all kinds. Maybe you had to be there watching in the 1980s, seeing what everyone else was skating to and comparing what T&D did.

    I believe Mack & Mabel stands up to the passage of time; also Barnum, 1984 Paso Original Set Pattern, 1994 Olympic Rumba, OSP Blues to Summertime, Encounters, Oscar Tango, and Take Five, are just a few examples of really effective, original choreography.

    And this rock and roll OSP is THE great rock and roll program:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEHsR679g1M

    As a choreographer for others, his Funny Girl short dance for Gilles & Summersett--actually, several of their dances, Missing for the Duschenays and I liked Eleanor Rigby for Paul and Vanessa. At the beginning of the season it was very effective. This dance for Paul and Piper shows their charming personalities and is something to keep building on.

  12. #192

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    Quote Originally Posted by Visaliakid View Post
    Vanessa was was excellent technically, but had no connection with Paul .

    Actually, I found that it was Paul who had no connection. I found her to be expressive, not in an over the top way but with interest. It seemed to me, that she tried to draw Paul in and he would not look at her regardless of how close they were to one another. In many cases, he looked like he was skating by himself.

    And unlike what some posters are saying, I do not think the lack of connection was always the case. They did not get as far as they did without something between them.

  13. #193

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    shutterbug originally posted this Gilles/Poirier article in the Challenge thread in Kiss and Cry Canadian, American team up for gold

  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by nashvilledancer View Post
    I believe Mack & Mabel stands up to the passage of time; also Barnum, 1984 Paso Original Set Pattern, 1994 Olympic Rumba, OSP Blues to Summertime, Encounters, Oscar Tango, and Take Five, are just a few examples of really effective, original choreography.
    What Dean did from within the constraints of OSP was phenomenal, IMO. But then, OSP has always been my favorite Ice Dance program.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  15. #195
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    WOW, I am really impressed with Piper and Paul! Already, I find Gilles/Poirier more interesting than any other Canadian ice dance team. For being together only a short period of time, they have wonderful chemistry and terrific speed. They really attack their elements and they are gelling so well. I'm so happy for them! Wishing them the best for Nationals!

  16. #196
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    I found them quite promising , and their strengths are their strengths....but they were egregiously overmarked at this event.

    There's no use getting ready for some kind of anointing..international judges would never have given them that score. It will be much easier to assess them a year from now.

  17. #197

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    Quote Originally Posted by mirage View Post
    Actually, I found that it was Paul who had no connection. I found her to be expressive, not in an over the top way but with interest. It seemed to me, that she tried to draw Paul in and he would not look at her regardless of how close they were to one another. In many cases, he looked like he was skating by himself.

    And unlike what some posters are saying, I do not think the lack of connection was always the case. They did not get as far as they did without something between them.
    We met them at Skate Canada and to some degree, they seemed disconnected.

  18. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pratfall View Post
    I found them quite promising , and their strengths are their strengths....but they were egregiously overmarked at this event.

    There's no use getting ready for some kind of anointing..international judges would never have given them that score. It will be much easier to assess them a year from now.
    Exactly right on. They definitely have promise, but we will not be able to see the real story until they have programs with more skating skills (not just tricks, or a serious of elements), which likely won't happen until they have skated together for a longer period of time. Next year will be a good gauge. And then we will see what the international judges think of them. I seem to recall that the ISU is looking for more dancing in ice dance. The top teams in the world are all moving down that road. I don't think a program like this will earn the huge marks internationally. And at this point in time, it is ridiculous how overmarked they have been in their first few competitions. This season is for fun and development, since they can't compete internationally yet. I'm not going to get too excited until I see what they can do next season with different programs.

  19. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by mirage View Post
    Actually, I found that it was Paul who had no connection. I found her to be expressive, not in an over the top way but with interest. It seemed to me, that she tried to draw Paul in and he would not look at her regardless of how close they were to one another. In many cases, he looked like he was skating by himself.

    And unlike what some posters are saying, I do not think the lack of connection was always the case. They did not get as far as they did without something between them.
    I always found Paul to be the most expressive and enthusiastic of the two. I found him to be the most artistic and the best in terms of posture, line and extension.

    I don't know whether they had a good 'connection' or not, but they appeared to work very well together for a long time (over a decade) and they used to describe each other as being like brother and sister.

  20. #200
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    Just saw the fd and I adored it, and I also found myself smiling throughout it. Plus the music really does it for me.

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