Page 3 of 23 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 443
  1. #41
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    LEAVE EDMUNDS ALONE!!1!
    Posts
    20,095
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by DaiKozOda View Post
    It indirectly sounds a bit rude towards Vanessa.
    It doesn't say anything about Vanessa.

  2. #42
    Hey, Kool-Aid!
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    11,155
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    1504
    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    It doesn't say anything about Vanessa.
    That's why the poster said "indirectly"
    Tessa and Scott: Thank you

  3. #43
    Watch me move
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Gwyneth Paltrow Fan Club headquarters
    Posts
    16,759
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    But I bet there are a lot of female ice dancers who don't have the right height and the right physical attributes to skate with him. If he and Vanessa were so poorly matched for those qualities I doubt they would have been partners for an entire decade.

    I read the statement more as that Gillies had the size and attributes that were the best match out of all the possibilities, not that she was a better match than Vanessa had been.
    Who wants to watch rich people eat pizza? They must have loved that in Bangladesh. - Randy Newman on the 2014 Oscars broadcast

  4. #44

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    2,664
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    162
    Quote Originally Posted by overedge View Post
    I read the statement more as that Gillies had the size and attributes that were the best match out of all the possibilities, not that she was a better match than Vanessa had been.
    Lane may not have intended those statements to be a dig at Vanessa but they most definitely come across that way.

    I don't see how the reader can help but draw an unfavorable comparison to Vanessa.

  5. #45
    Two Pot Screamer
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Keeper of Prancer's Stupidity
    Age
    50
    Posts
    13,099
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    7795
    I didn't read anything negative towards Vanessa in that statement either. Nothing.
    Voidy Swan, Dirty Carmen, Perverted Moonlight Sonata. God I love figure skating!

  6. #46

    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Age
    28
    Posts
    11,834
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by kimkom View Post
    I didn't read anything negative towards Vanessa in that statement either. Nothing.
    Neither did I.

  7. #47
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    451
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    I agree with overedge. To me, it reads like a continuation of the preceding paragraph about tryouts -- that Piper was better-suited, physically, than the other candidates had been. Vanessa's fairly far-removed from the discussion by that point in the piece.

    Which isn't to say that on some level there may not, theoretically, be some subtextual dig at Vanessa there, but the structure of the article itself doesn't support it (and I don't, personally, pick up on it).

  8. #48
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Music City
    Posts
    655
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Paul is cute as puppies with the mop-top curls. And looks much younger. Well, I loved C&P, but I'm very glad that he, at least, has found a promising partner. And can't wait to see what Paul and Piper can accomplish.

    I surely hope Emily and Vanessa are as lucky!

  9. #49

    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Refusing to perform on demand
    Posts
    14,447
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    1779
    Quote Originally Posted by kimkom View Post
    I didn't read anything negative towards Vanessa in that statement either. Nothing.
    I didn't find those statements to be particularly derogatory, but this quote from the article was a bit questionable (in the "don't blame me, I am just telling you what other people think" category):

    Though many in the skating fraternity were of the opinion that Crone was not as good as her partner, her excellent physical condition made up for her lack of elegance.
    But I put the blame entirely on the writer of the article.
    Creating drama!

  10. #50
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    758
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    I blame the writer of the article too..the buck stops there.

    Unless you're writing an opinion piece , unattributed comments or opinions such as those held by the nebulous "many in the skating fraternity " are at best worthless , at worst , an attempt to plant spin. If it's the writer's opinion ,he should have the guts to say so and let the reader decide whether his opinion is worth the paper it's written on.

    If it's not his opinion,but the opinion of someone who doesn't want to be quoted, he should leave it out. I suppose if he wanted to conduct a tough interview he could posit the proposition and ask the interviewee to respond to it...but this was not that kind of piece.

    If someone has said to him " this is off the record but.." and he prints it, he's being used.

    This was supposed to be an article about the forming of the new team of Gilles and Poirier. Vanessa should not have been mentioned except in passing ..something like, "With his former partner, Paul won this or that medal.." That's all.

    But because that blurb about Vanessa was positioned right at the beginning of the piece the rest of the article is seen in light of it, relates back to it ,if only subliminally.

    Carol Lane's quote about Piper would be OK ..on it's own. But because the writer ( or whoever) told us at the outset that Vanessa was a lesser skater than Paul, and that she was inelegant,if physically fit ( a left-handed compliment if there ever was one )... every positive comment made about Piper comes in contrast to the negative comments previously made about Vanessa.

    And then there was the coy reference to Emily..

    I't's at least a shoddy piece of work.And possibly something worse.

  11. #51

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Age
    52
    Posts
    10,245
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    10899
    I understand what you're saying. But since the negative comments about Vanessa earlier were not about her height or her physical attributes, I don't see a connection there.

    And even if she were the wrong height for Paul and that was why the team had split, it wouldn't really be blaming her -- people can't control their height, and no height is negative in and of itself, only when it comes to matching teams.

    Now, if the positive comments about Piper had praised her for exactly the qualities Vanessa had been said to lack, and especially if those were qualities accepted to be under one's conscious control, then mentioning them would have been a dig at Vanessa (by the writer at least).

    If Lane had said something like "Piper is a very strong skater who will have no trouble keeping up with Paul and will push him to improve even further" that would be hard not to read back to the previous insinuations about Vanessa.

    But that's not what she said.

  12. #52
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    758
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    And I understand what you're saying.But I think you're being very kind.

    If someone gave me that piece to proof read, the first thing I would have done was draw a big red line through the comments about Vanessa and tell the person it had nothing to do with the rest of the article. My second correction would have been a question mark next to " tested the waters with Emily Samuelson ", with the comment... Did they try out , or not ? Clarify, or leave it out.

    Without those two things ,the article tells us all we wanted or needed to know about this new partnership. ..Good she'll have her release .. good, they've got their choreographer.. good, they're working toward making a splash at Canadians.

    But intentional or not, if those remarks are left in, the reader is being led , through unkind comments and insinuation. If unintentional, it's pretty poor writing and editing. If intentional , the question is ,what's the point?

  13. #53
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    LEAVE EDMUNDS ALONE!!1!
    Posts
    20,095
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by marbri View Post
    That's why the poster said "indirectly"
    It still doesn't say anything about Vanessa.

    The fact that the partner with whom Paul would be trying out has to have the right physical attributes only means that he's not going to try out with everyone, because obviously he needs to find a good size and weight match.

    And that's all that was said.

    As for Vanessa's lack of elegance, I believe that was the writer's words and of course he was right. You'd have to be blind to notice how shockingly awful her posture was, for a top-level ice dancer. ;P

  14. #54
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    758
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Ziggy ...The point is , this guy is not, like us , just a commenter on a skating forum , gossiping or discussing what we see as the good and bad points about a given skater.
    He's supposed to be a journalist and ought to be held to a professional standard. It would be fair enough if he was writing a a critique of C/P , but he's not. Nor is he writing about the prospects of the 2 skaters together, as opposed to with their former partners... since he mentions nothing about any shortcomings of Piper's previous partners.

  15. #55
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    LEAVE EDMUNDS ALONE!!1!
    Posts
    20,095
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Pratfall View Post
    Ziggy ...The point is , this guy is not, like us , just a commenter on a skating forum , gossiping or discussing what we see as the good and bad points about a given skater.
    He's supposed to be a journalist and ought to be held to a professional standard. It would be fair enough if he was writing a a critique of C/P , but he's not. Nor is he writing about the prospects of the 2 skaters together, as opposed to with their former partners... since he mentions nothing about any shortcomings of Piper's previous partners.
    Yes, but he wrote that in a respectful way, highlighting Crone's positives also, so I don't see that big a problem with that.

    But it is true that it sounds like he's with team Paul all the way.

    Crone had her shortcomings but still, her skating is at a completely different level than Gilles's.

  16. #56
    Hey, Kool-Aid!
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    11,155
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    1504
    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    It still doesn't say anything about Vanessa.

    The fact that the partner with whom Paul would be trying out has to have the right physical attributes only means that he's not going to try out with everyone, because obviously he needs to find a good size and weight match.

    And that's all that was said.

    As for Vanessa's lack of elegance, I believe that was the writer's words and of course he was right. You'd have to be blind to notice how shockingly awful her posture was, for a top-level ice dancer. ;P
    I read the article.
    Tessa and Scott: Thank you

  17. #57
    Argle-Bargle-ist
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Age
    50
    Posts
    8,505
    vCash
    875
    Rep Power
    46950
    From the C/P split up thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    I think she should get permanent residency in Canada under the Investors, Entrepreneurs, and Self-Employed class; one of the two qualifiers under "self-employed" class is "participation at a world-class level in cultural activities or athletics". Since they'll train in Ontario, by the 2018 Olympics, she'll meet the residency requirements for citizenship under normal (non-accelerated) circumstances.
    Does this mean Gilles/Poirier can't compete at the 2014 Olympics (or hopefully I'm not understanding this post correctly!)?
    It's official. I am madly in love with Meryl Davis.

  18. #58
    I <3 Kozuka
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Vancouver/Seattle
    Posts
    18,229
    vCash
    730
    Rep Power
    19676
    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Does this mean Gilles/Poirier can't compete at the 2014 Olympics (or hopefully I'm not understanding this post correctly!)?
    It means without an exception to the residency requirements for citizenship, no. However, after three years of training in Canada and national and international results for Canada with Andrew Poje, according to this article posted up-thread by marbri, Kaitlyn Weaver was granted an exception the June before the Vancouver Olympics:

    The Citizenship Act contains a special provision that allows the Governor in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister, to reward services of an exceptional value to Canada by issuing a grant of citizenship like Ms. Weaver’s.
    If things go well, Gilles/Poirier will have two years of results at the national level, and one year of results at the international level at the end of the season before the Sochi Olympics. It's possible that Gilles would be granted an exception. She already qualifies for permanent residency under the "self-employed" category, and she will have been resident and training in Canada for almost two years before June 2013.
    "'Is this new BMW-designed sled the ultimate sledding machine for Langdon and Holcomb?' Leigh Diffey asked before the pair cruised to victory. I don’t know, but I know that sled is the ultimate Olympic Games product placement.." -- Jen Chaney

  19. #59
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    758
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Oh, Ziggy..I know you love a good discussion, or even debate...Don't we all ? We're here aren't we?

    But I don't think anyone is going to buy that the writer's comments about Vanessa were in any way respectful, or highlighted her positives.

    What member of the skating fraternity would think that excellent physical condition alone made up for inelegance when talking about ice dance ? You can walk into any corner gym and find a dozen people in excellent physical condition. Could you just throw a costume on them and shove them on the ice ?

    In fact this piece gets more suspect on re-reading. It really goes a step further, which I wasn't going to mention..but what the heck... Although it's supposed to be about Paul and Piper the article again asserts that the C/P split had nothing to do with their finish at World's ( ) and goes on to say that neither Paul nor Carol would say what went wrong ( why was he even asking, when the official story has been given ?)... But he already supplied us with a possible reason in his Vanessa comments. So.... He might also be being disrepectful of Carol and Paul , by injecting something that we might possibly think one of them said " off the record " .

  20. #60

    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    The Valley
    Posts
    4,277
    vCash
    9456
    Rep Power
    4330
    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post

    As for Vanessa's lack of elegance, I believe that was the writer's words and of course he was right. You'd have to be blind to notice how shockingly awful her posture was, for a top-level ice dancer. ;P
    Ziggy, Ziggy, Ziggy, one thing I noticed this year in the Worlds coverage was that nobody, including you, made any comments about her posture. Now you bring it up...

    A more valid criticism would be about her toe point and matching lines with Paul - that was something that still needed work. (but not a lot). I hope she finds a new partner, she's too good to just fade away...

Page 3 of 23 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •