Lady Gaga on Ice declaim against ISU:they make figure skating losing its beauty

[luCN]

It's from the ArOI press conference,but I think many people will intersted in it,so I open a new thread for it,hope it's ok.
（rough translate for the main part）

Lady Gaga on Ice declaim against ISU:they make figure skating losing its beauty
http://sports.sina.com.cn/o/2011-07-...95669208.shtml
……
Weir haven't compete for two years,he said,"In this two years,I write a book,attend fashion shows,take photoshot for magazines,very very busy.I know there are many rising stars these days,for example Patrich Chan,it's a good thing."but after said that,he twitst to another thread,"But,because ot ISU's new mark system,today's competition can't see the real figure skating.Now watching a match like look a ancient curio,all the skaters just know to add difficulty,get high marks,but ignore its beauty."

about whether he'll comeback,and when he'll be back,Weir said,"If ond day,figure skating mark in the way I like,I may consider (coming back).Although I'm a little old,but I'll be just 30 when 2014 Sochi Olympics.My single jump is pretty good,and I'm very beautiful,and I have a lot of competions experience,if I don't attend Sochi Olympics,it's a pity." but,even if he really come back,"I will not fight like a dog as Plushenko,(he) only want the Gold medal.For me,the 1st place or the 20th place is equal,the most important thing is enjoy the competition."Weir said.

another artical about it:
http://roll.sohu.com/20110722/n314201283.shtml

“He(Patrick Chan) did good in this year's Worlds,but ISU's marking system is like "ancient curio" as always.There are many good skaters in china,hope they can challenge and make a change,don't consider just the points.Now many young people skate for a long time,but don't know what they are doing." he became more directly today compare last year,"Then let me make the rules,I can make a rule,and can represent Art and Fashion at the same time."

[Justathoughtabl]

I have to agree that beauty should be given more attention in skating.

[marbri]

Beauty is subjective.

[luCN]

well,actually I don't agree to the whole thing he said.But I always agree about his criticism about Plushenko.As he said before,Plushenko and Lysacek are the same kind of people,they concern about medals too much,they always concern about landing jumps successfully,about getting points,but always neglect the artisty and beauty...

I really hope when Lysacek and Plushenko come back this season,they can enjoy the competition and bring some beauty,not just points and medals...

[edonice]

Sure, there are more restrictions now. But they can be seen as an opportunity for creativity.

Virtue and Moir's free dance at the Olympics was transcendent, even with the incredibly high level of difficulty in their performance. Their movements had meaning. They made it work for them. I'd even argue that the high number of required elements forced them to be more creative, and made the performance better.

Same with Yuna Kim.

It's not that gorgeous performances can't still exist. It's that it's harder to do.

[BittyBug]

I don't think it's an issue of lack of artistry, because there were plenty of 6.0 programs that were less than artistic (possibly a majority). But what COP has done, at least from my viewpoint, is vastly reduced the variety that we used to see in skating. For example, back in the day we usually only saw Bielmann spins from people who could do them well. Now just about every lady is including them, even if it's an obvious struggle, because it's a way to get more points.

Or consider footwork - to get the higher levels skaters need to use the full dimension of space or some b.s. like that, so we see skaters bobbing up and down with no relation to the music in an effort to get to a higher level, whereas before, that type of motion would usually have only been seen if it was inspired by the music. So today it seems very whereas before it would have stood out.

The rules in and of themselves, by defining specific features that differentiate one level from another, have to some extent encouraged a "skate by numbers" approach to choreography. The end result is that there's really very little that's "free" about the free skate anymore, and that's what bothers me a bit. It's definitely still possible to have a wonderful, artistic program to COP (see Jeff Buttle's Ararat as an example ), but in between those highlights we're subjected to what seems like an awful lot of monotonous contortions and code-whoring.

[MacMadame]

So who are "Lady Gaga on Ice" ??

[VALuvsMKwan]

So who are "Lady Gaga on Ice" ??

I was stumped by that as well, until I saw "Weir" attributions to quotes within the extract from the article that was posted.

So one assumes that JW is LGOI.

[Skittl1321]

So Johnny is just being described as Lady Gaga on Ice?

That's sad. I thought this would mean he is going to get his dream ice show produced.

[overedge]

For me,the 1st place or the 20th place is equal

That certainly wasn't the attitude he was expressing in the post-Olympic interviews, where he complained he never had a shot at a medal because the North American "spot" on the podium was already "taken" by the time he skated

[marbri]

So Johnny is just being described as Lady Gaga on Ice?

That's sad. I thought this would mean he is going to get his dream ice show produced.

And ironic considering he is talking about beauty on ice

[BittyBug]

That certainly wasn't the attitude he was expressing in the post-Olympic interviews.....

Maybe he has evolved? Or are we to expect that no one can grow / change / adapt over the course of a year and a half?

[flowerpower]

I do understand the frustrations many people feel with the constraints of the new system, but under 6.0 we saw a few transcendent programs and a huge number of mediocre ones. Most 6.0 programs would be considered "fridge breaks" today.

Today there are still just a few truly transcendent programs, but overall skating quality is higher and I'm enjoying many more skaters.

Under the new system we're seeing much better quality step sequences and spins across the board, and cheating of jumps/poor flow out is no longer considered acceptable. It used to be that even world medalists could get away with crappy spins and simple stroking between elements. When I go back and watch older videos now, I'm usually disappointed in what I see. (And the videos that made it to onto Youtube are generally of the better performances.) There was a lot of posing, especially in the slow part in the middle (which was generally designed for skaters to catch their breath), unrelated musical selections were spliced together with no unifying concept, poor skating skills, etc. Our expectations are much higher today.

The freedom to be creative did not lead, overall, to great creativity and high standards back in the day, because people could win without it. We should probably find a way to liberalize COP, but IMO we shouldn't romanticize the reality of how people used (or in fact didn't use) the freedom that 6.0 gave them. In other words, I feel that as we tweak the new system, we should make sure to retain the benefits that COP has brought.

[AYS]

I don't think it's an issue of lack of artistry, because there were plenty of 6.0 programs that were less than artistic (possibly a majority). But what COP has done, at least from my viewpoint, is vastly reduced the variety that we used to see in skating. For example, back in the day we usually only saw Bielmann spins from people who could do them well. Now just about every lady is including them, even if it's an obvious struggle, because it's a way to get more points.

.......but in between those highlights we're subjected to what seems like an awful lot of monotonous contortions and code-whoring.

I agree with everything you said. I was noticing at Liberty how much COP has just plain ruined my enjoyment of certain things like spinning, because the focus is on doing the few things that are sure to get levels. As a result, very few people were doing high quality spins. And generally, the skating was a bit boring to me, for the reasons you've outlined.

[orbitz]

I agree with everything you said. I was noticing at Liberty how much COP has just plain ruined my enjoyment of certain things like spinning, because the focus is on doing the few things that are sure to get levels. As a result, very few people were doing high quality spins. And generally, the skating was a bit boring to me, for the reasons you've outlined.

I thought spin was one of the thing that has gotten better with the new judging system. Initially under IJS the spins were painfully slow because of all the various pretzel positions skaters were doing and they weren't used to it. But now, eventhough most of the skaters are hitting the same sort of positions, the spins are faster, more centered, and better position on the camels and sits.

[Skittl1321]

And ironic considering he is talking about beauty on ice

Oh, I wasn't saying that it is sad he is being described that way. Just that it's sad that is all the article is about, because I thought it meant there would be a Lady Gaga on Ice, as Johnny keeps talking about wanting.

[overedge]

Maybe he has evolved? Or are we to expect that no one can grow / change / adapt over the course of a year and a half?

My was about his explanation why he didn't receive a medal in Vancouver, not about the possibility that he might have changed his attitudes since then.

[mia joy]

I agree with him in terms of ice dancing. It has really lost a lot under the new system. It's more skating from one element to another than dancing. It's hardly as dramatic, elegant and romantic as it used to be. There are actually only a few dance teams whose performances I find exciting or just purely beautiful. Many of them are just boring.

And I would also say CoP does pay too much attention to unnoticeable details sometimes. It doesn't really leave any space for the skater to show his/her personality. Free programs are hardly free anymore. I know 6.0 was terrible, unjust and hurting badly many wonderful skaters, cause it was basically giving people medals for reputation, but it is also true that Yagudin or Kwan would never happen under CoP.

But then again, I agree that the quality of skating has improved dramatically. CoP has definitely given us better spins, steps and more complex programs. I just think it could give the skaters a bit more space to be themselves, otherwise in a couple of years we'll be left with an army of styleless but technically amazing Chans.

[Ziggy]

Please move this to the trash can!

[l'etoile]

oh boy I don't prefer Weir's kind of beauty that's for sure. that guy was given with wonderful programs, full of interesting trasitions at the olympic season. and What did we see? If he does attend at Sochi olympics, it'll be a pity.