Page 35 of 35 FirstFirst ... 25333435
Results 681 to 693 of 693

Thread: 2011 Japan Open

  1. #681
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,340
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    As for Amodio at Japan Open: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVbHq6e93nU

    RyanB did a much better job in 2007: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVbHq6e93nU


    Sorry to mention anything to do with Chan again, but I came across this on youtube, and I wasn't even looking.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN_aMxpD85U

    I never saw this at the time. Funny how CBC broadcasters were casting Worlds that year as being between Joubert and Chan mostly, with Lysacek an afterthought. Also hilarious that the U.S. press is credited with making a big deal out of the sparks/ comments that flew between Joubert and Chan. I found Joubert more endearing in this presser than Patrick. Not very endearing of me, but I've become more and more turned off re Patrick chiefly b/c true or not, he comes off as very full of himself, with the big bad powerful Canadian fed, journalists and public solidly behind him. All of that is fine, but on top of it, he has to be painted as unbeatable too. He has mad skills, sure, but he's not the second coming.
    Last edited by aftershocks; 10-09-2011 at 11:06 PM.

  2. #682
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia, USA
    Age
    30
    Posts
    303
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post

    Question: Why do people keep posting things about the 2011 Japan Open in this thread?
    love it!

  3. #683
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia, USA
    Age
    30
    Posts
    303
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    Interesting discussion which should probably be in Trash Can under U.S. Men circa 2004-2006.

    No worries, aemeraldrainc – you asked a question, and offered a lament re Matt. These debates are definitely not new ... However, I do understand your instinct to and Primorskaya's suggestion to I agree with your take on Matt and "the scheme of things...[affecting] outcomes."
    ..................
    Matt definitely achieved his goals and gave skating fans lasting beauty along the way[/B]. Matt was 7th at the Olympics and 11th at 2006 Worlds. Sure, he rarely fared well with the judges and didn't have a great deal of consistent int’l experience, but he reached his goal of skating at the Olympics, and shined there in the lp. Is Matt necessarily even thinking about fs these days? He appears to be moving forward quite fantastically with his life.

    http://www.choate.com/people.php?PeopleID=354
    Thanks. I feel better now.

    This would definitely look nicer in its own thread. Maybe a mod can transfer and title? Or not.
    Whatever.

    I loved getting everyone's perspective on this. It's something that always bugged me. And, of course, people here are so much more knowledgeable, articulate and can explain things so much better than I ever will. Thanks for all the youtube links as well. I didn't follow figure skating for some years there and am barely getting back into the swing of things. You guys rock!


    I agree with mostly everything posted here and I'm happy to see that MS has definitely moved on and appears to be happy doing what he wants to do. Nice profile there.
    I just hope he knows how much we loved and appreciated him and how much we feel he deserved. Bridge under the water, I know, but it would still be nice for him to know and for me to know that he knows.
    Maybe I should write a letter?

    Either way, I'm sure he's aware on some level.

  4. #684

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    29,558
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    41646
    Sorry to interrupt this discussion by posting this link to Japan Open backstage photos taken by Cathy Reed : http://web.icenetwork.com/gen/photog...f25415434.html

  5. #685
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Phila., PA
    Posts
    3,700
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    ^ Nice!!!! Thanks!

  6. #686
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    276
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    Seriously. After all, he didn't fall, and that's the marker here, right? What does it matter if he had no choreography, poor interpretation, lesser skating skills, fewer clean triples and lesser footwork and spins. He didn't fall.

    If you believe that Chan should be ahead of Amodio, than yes, a three fall skate can and should beat a no-fall skate. It just depends on the circumstances. Using bek's suggestion that each fall remove 10% of the total score would put Chan approximately 25 points behind Amodio, fwiw.
    Well said! I'm just to sick of reading all those bitching and whinning about "Chan shouldn't have won because he fell 3 times blah blah blah" Well, someone asked a good question, where are those whiners? I really want to see them pick and justify their choice.

    No matter what Chan did, some haters will find any lame crap to bash about him. Hater's gonna hate.

  7. #687

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    4,315
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post


    Any statement re the likelihood of Weir having any kind of influence on his contemporaries results in an overstatement against that notion. Who exactly said Weir should be “credited” with Buttle’s and Lambiel’s “success.” Of course, they should each be “credited” with their own success. Factually, Buttle and Lambiel came on the senior international scene at Worlds in 2002 (2 years before Weir). Buttle placed 8th, 15th, missed a year, then jumped to 2nd in 2005 with two falls. He later landed in 6th twice, then worked on his 3-axel (possibly using Weir’s textbook perfect 3-axel as a model) and became World champion in 2008. His sp in competition with Weir at ’08 Worlds arguably could have had either in first place – they were both excellent, but Buttle was definitely more popular with the judges and had a strong supportive fed behind him. Lambiel at senior Worlds placed 18th, 10th, and then came in 4th in ’04 just ahead of a cleaner Weir in Weir’s first trip to Worlds. The following year, Lambiel was World champion, Buttle was second, Weir skated well with an injury (and had arguably two of the most compelling and GP-winning programs that season), but for some reason placed out of the medals again at Worlds just behind his still juniorish-looking teammate.
    Nice recap, but I think I am missing the point here....

    Love Matt Savoie. Loved his 2005 LP. I miss his skating so much. He's one of the most musical and subtle skaters I've ever seen. And since this thread has gone completely OT, here's another gem from Matt at 2002 Worlds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w872zjNfzY It's a travesty that he was only 11th. Besides skating programs full of transitions, his crazy triple axel entries required so much athleticism yet that was so overlooked. Did judges have conscience back then? If only COP had been in place back then.....!!
    Last edited by shine; 10-21-2011 at 02:54 PM.

  8. #688
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,340
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Nice recap, but I think I am missing the point here....

    Love Matt Savoie. ... here's another gem from Matt at 2002 Worlds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w872zjNfzY ...
    Very much way OT --however, since you asked, shine -- my "recap" was in response to dinakt's #675 post, which misinterpreted a previous post of mine in this "mistitled" or rather "misadventurous," wandering thread. Earlier, I had pointed out my belief that Johnny influenced his generation of skaters, and that despite Johnny not receiving a great deal of respect from the judges, Johnny's skating surely made a difference through his showing the aesthetic beauty and grace that men can achieve (artistry and athleticism, which departed from the macho, jump-focused era of Elvis and Plushy). In that new atmosphere, Buttle and Lambiel began to be appreciated more, which contrary to dinakt's interpretation, does not mean Johnny should be "credited with their success."

    Thanks for the additional Matt Savoie link!

  9. #689
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Havering-atte-Bower
    Posts
    3,482
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    here's another gem from Matt at 2002 Worlds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w872zjNfzY It's a travesty that he was only 11th. Besides skating programs full of transitions, his crazy triple axel entries required so much athleticism yet that was so overlooked. Did judges have conscience back then? If only COP had been in place back then.....!!
    For comparison, here is Michael Weiss's sixth-placed free skate from the same competition.

    Weiss's scores:

    6 Michael WEISS USA 6.0
    5.4 5.3 5.2 5.3 5.4 5.5 5.3 5.4 5.3 #23
    5.7 5.5 5.5 5.7 5.6 5.7 5.6 5.7 5.4
    11.1 10.8 10.7 11.0 11.0 11.2 10.9 11.1 10.7
    4 5 6 6 6 5 6 6 7

    Savoie's scores:

    11 Matthew SAVOIE USA 11.0
    5.2 5.0 5.1 5.3 5.2 5.4 5.3 5.3 5.1 #10
    5.2 5.2 5.2 5.3 5.3 5.4 5.5 5.4 5.3
    10.4 10.2 10.3 10.6 10.5 10.8 10.8 10.7 10.4
    11 12 11 11 11 11 9 11 10

    http://www.icecalc.com/events/wc2002/results/SEG064.HTM

    Even applying 6.0 standards, it's hard to see how the judges could have justified placing Weiss ahead of Savoie, let alone by such a significant margin. Yes, Weiss did attempt a quadruple lutz, but he two-footed it and then fell. (It may also have been underrotated.) And other than maybe having more power in his stroking than Savoie did, it's hard to see anything Weiss did that was clearly better.

  10. #690
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia, USA
    Age
    30
    Posts
    303
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    For comparison, here is Michael Weiss's sixth-placed free skate from the same competition.

    Weiss's scores:

    6 Michael WEISS USA 6.0
    5.4 5.3 5.2 5.3 5.4 5.5 5.3 5.4 5.3 #23
    5.7 5.5 5.5 5.7 5.6 5.7 5.6 5.7 5.4
    11.1 10.8 10.7 11.0 11.0 11.2 10.9 11.1 10.7
    4 5 6 6 6 5 6 6 7

    Savoie's scores:

    11 Matthew SAVOIE USA 11.0
    5.2 5.0 5.1 5.3 5.2 5.4 5.3 5.3 5.1 #10
    5.2 5.2 5.2 5.3 5.3 5.4 5.5 5.4 5.3
    10.4 10.2 10.3 10.6 10.5 10.8 10.8 10.7 10.4
    11 12 11 11 11 11 9 11 10

    http://www.icecalc.com/events/wc2002/results/SEG064.HTM

    Even applying 6.0 standards, it's hard to see how the judges could have justified placing Weiss ahead of Savoie, let alone by such a significant margin. Yes, Weiss did attempt a quadruple lutz, but he two-footed it and then fell. (It may also have been underrotated.) And other than maybe having more power in his stroking than Savoie did, it's hard to see anything Weiss did that was clearly better.

    Yes! How dare he? How can Weiss live with himself??
    Being , but I totally agree.
    Besides, as it's been said before...
    Don't blame the skaters, blame the judges!

  11. #691
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,340
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Thanks for that additional link, shine!

    I guess Weiss lives with himself, aemeralrainc, by giving back through his foundation.

    Posters, even on youtube, keep saying that Matt would have scored better under CoP, but he did skate under CoP in some comps, and still was not fairly rewarded. He apparently had already been given up on/ written off by both his fed and the international judges. I'm so glad Matt continued to work hard and delivered many performances that will continue to be watched and revered by skating fans.

    All of the posts on Matt here need to be transferred to a thread of his own in Trash Can.

  12. #692
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia, USA
    Age
    30
    Posts
    303
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post

    I guess Weiss lives with himself, aemeralrainc, by giving back through his foundation.
    .....All of the posts on Matt here need to be transferred to a thread of his own in Thrash Can.
    Touché.
    Funny, I was reading over his Wiki the other day. Whatever happened to his Tornado move? Anyone know if he still does it?
    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micha...(figure_skater)

    You're right. Matt needs his own thread. I think I'm gonna have to message a mod. Who takes care of things like that?

  13. #693
    Banned Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    State of frustration
    Posts
    560
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    Thanks for that additional link, shine!

    Posters, even on youtube, keep saying that Matt would have scored better under CoP, but he did skate under CoP in some comps, and still was not fairly rewarded. He apparently had already been given up on/ written off by both his fed and the international judges. I'm so glad Matt continued to work hard and delivered many performances that will continue to be watched and revered by skating fans..
    I think Matt and Ryan Jahnke were a few years too early in COP. Both were sublime skaters, had diffiicult transitions, yet NO QUAD. Then Buttle won without even attempting one. Those two were definite casualties of the new judging system. It's hard to even watch them without getting angry at the scores. It makes NO sense.

    Anyway, Matt got his Olympics, and that's what counts. He was never going to be a medal threat, so he achieved the maximum he was ever going to.

Page 35 of 35 FirstFirst ... 25333435

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •