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  1. #41
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    I feel badly for both Rachel and Mirai in this situation.
    I meant to take the high road.... but I missed the exit.

  2. #42

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    Basically a warning letter. Still, I wonder how much the fine was, and why they chose not to disclose it (is it an unusually small or large amount?)
    Thanks, Visaliakid and RD!

    Well, I think it'd be too harsh if it costs her eligibility.
    So this is more like a statement that USFSA wants to make it clear
    for this case and for the future.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by CantALoop View Post
    Not surprised USFS finally addressed this, but I'm a bit shocked they threw Rachael under the bus before Tom Z (assuming that happens at all), especially after how the USFS has looked kindly toward Rachael in the past.
    Well, considering she hasn't brought in the results USFS were expecting, I can't say I'm surprised.

  4. #44
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    I cannot feel bad for Rachel for a decision that SHE made, or had a part in making (even if her coach signed off on it). The ONLY exception is if she was coerced into competing by her coach and/or her parents, and so far, that does not appear to be the case.

    Team Flatt fully deserves what's hopefully coming to them.

  5. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by stjeaskategym View Post
    At this level, a lot of athletes are competing with injuries, some more serious than others. If Rachael was still doing all of her jumps up until she arrived at Worlds (and in the SP, it seemed she was still expecting to do her regularly planned jumps aside from the 3-3), then I don't see much of problem with her trying to gut it out. That's what athletes do, and it would be crazy, in my opinion, to fine her for that.

    Now, if Rachael was aware that she was required to notify USFS that she had an injury/received a diagnosis, but didn't bother doing that, then that's a completely different story. It wasn't right to leave the alternate completely in the dark about this injury situation.
    If I recall correctly, Rachael was struggling with both jumps (the flip and the lutz) in practice that were effected by the stress fracture. She just did one of those jumps (the flip in SP) successfully.

    Regardless of the official reason, I'm glad the USFS took this action as it encourages other skaters to be honest with the federation. I'm also in agreement with others that Tom Z. deserves to be reprimanded more strictly than Rachael. I view him as the the person most responsible for this incident happening.

  6. #46
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    I hope the USFSA also takes some responsibility. They should look at the Nationals judging that put Rachael on the team in the first place. Rachael's Nationals FS had some overall deficiencies. Her components marks in Greensboro were out of line with what she was receiving internationally. Had she been scored more in line with the assessments made by ISU panels, she might not have even beated Mirai. For the components scores, USFSA judges need to reflect international standards and cultural preferences in order to select competitive World teams.

    .............................................
    Last edited by TheIronLady; 06-16-2011 at 03:33 PM.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheIronLady View Post
    I hope the USFSA also takes some responsibility by looking at the judging at Nationals that put Rachael on the team in the first place. Rachael's free program at Nationals had some overall deficiencies. Her components marks at Nationals were out of line with what she had received internationally. USFSA judges should try to reflect international standards and cultural preferences in the components if they want to help select the most competitive World teams.
    I agree, but then they would also have to retract Ryan Bradley's scores too.

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by FSfan107 View Post
    . I'm also in agreement with others that Tom Z. deserves to be reprimanded more strictly than Rachael. I view him as the the person most responsible for this incident happening.
    I agree. As her head coach I would think the responsibility of notifying the federation of the injury fell on his shoulders. Here's hoping that Hersh follows up any punishment given to Tom Z.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheIronLady View Post
    How embarrassing for her, but there are consequences for not thinking these things through.
    I very much doubt Rachael made this decision on her own.

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    WOW. Definitely wasn't expecting this.

  11. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by olifaunt View Post
    I very much doubt Rachael made this decision on her own.
    Probably not, but unfortunately, it's her signature on the Team USA agreement. I think coaches sign something as well, so maybe USFS will hand down some judgement against her coach.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenna View Post
    Yes, but it obviously didn't affect his performance ability as he won his first and only world title that year.
    Evan had a toe fracture while Rachael had a tibia fracture. Anyone with a basic knowledge of human anatomy will appreciate the difference.
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

  13. #53

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    I do wonder if all of this would have played out differently if by some miracle Rachael skated well enough to ensure three spots (8th or higher) and still discussed the injury she did not disclose to the USFS after Worlds.
    "Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce

  14. #54
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    I have felt from the first time I posted on FSU about this and poked at Phil to do something about it, that the entire situation should be treated by USFS as a breach of contract by both Flatt and Tom. Both of them benefited by USFS moneys provided to promote the US and our skating program. I think Flatt is a wonderful girl that most likely learned a life lesson, and all I can say is Tom as an adult that should have known better.

    And it doesn't really matter what the fine is, the point is that USFS took a stand with not participating as a team. I must say, they have turned me around. I think they have sent a message here with regard to the skater, and others are going to think twice before skating hurt on moneys provided by the US. I also believe that a very strong message needs to be sent to Tom, and USFS needs to communicate to all coaches that they will not tolerate this again, and will no longer coverup for someones reputation over the associations principles.

  15. #55

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    It's sad that reporters are now making a big deal about things and then that's what action is taken. USFS should be making decisions based on the rules and their own investigations, not based on interviews and reports by Phil Hersh, or anyone else..

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angelskates View Post
    It's sad that reporters are now making a big deal about things and then that's what action is taken. USFS should be making decisions based on the rules and their own investigations, not based on interviews and reports by Phil Hersh, or anyone else..
    Perhaps that was what USFS did; but Phil wanted to claim credit.

  17. #57

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    On another forum, someone said that now no skater will ever admit to an injury for fear of this reprimand. Do you think this will just teach skaters to never admit to an injury after a competition?
    "Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce

  18. #58
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    Wow! Might be one of the many reasons why so many of Tom's skaters are flying the coup.

    I agree that what Flatt did was wrong but Tom Z should have helped her make the right call. If she still thought she could compete then fine but the injury should have been reported.

    As far as Frank Carroll goes...he has not been one of my favorite people the last couple of seasons so I will just leave it at that. I for one would not have put major money on Mirai to win the third sport. She could have easily melted down and placed low enough to cost us the spot. She is awesome when she is on but can be a disaster when she's off.

    Some action needs to be taken against Tom Z...I am assuming he knew about the injury. If Rachael hid it from him then that would be one thing but I doubt very highly that he did not know.

  19. #59
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    Congratulations to the Flatt haters.

  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by VIETgrlTerifa View Post
    On another forum, someone said that now no skater will ever admit to an injury for fear of this reprimand. Do you think this will just teach skaters to never admit to an injury after a competition?
    I was thinking that it might cause skaters not to get pain and other symptoms checked out before a competition, but instead to compete through undiagnosed pain. No diagnosis --> no disclosure requirement (I assume).

    Having said that, I think USFS made the right call (and I do like Rachael).
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

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