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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Debbie S View Post

    I imagine that the root of Frank's ire has nothing to do with Rachael. I'm willing to bet this is about some feud between Frank and Tom Z.
    Frank Carroll coach of OGM Evan Lysacek, OSM's Michelle Kwan, Linda Fratianne, OBM Timothy Goebel, Christopher Bowman, Tiffany Chin etc ?

    A feud based on what because it certainly isn't professional jealousy.

    On the other hand, there is something wrong when the PSA is nominating Tom Z for coach of the year and here we have Rachael Flatt being reprimanded and fined by the USFS. I realize they are not one and the same, but it's just off.

  2. #22
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    Tom Z had two athletes competing with bad injuries at major competitions this season. I'm surprised they didn't start the investigation by looking at him.

  3. #23
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    I was NOT expecting this. I feel bad for Rachael, but I think it was wrong on many different levels of her and Tom decided not to back out of worlds.

  4. #24
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    I will be extremely shocked if Flatt continues to compete after this. USFSA is pretty much telling her "don't let the door hit you on the way out".

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by centerpt1 View Post
    I think Caroll has a legit gripe that when Rachael had a significant injury, Tom Z didn't do the same.
    I forgot about that. That's a good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by RFOS View Post
    It appears she was reprimanded not for competing with the injury but for failing to disclose the injury prior to compete according to the wording. Obviously, other skaters have competed with injuries, but they may have been known and/or reported to U.S. Figure Skating beforehand (in which case, what do they say?)
    Exactly. She may have still competed, and the result may have been the same, and frank would still be talking about it. I don't think Frank's response has to do with a (blanket) opinion that injured athletes shouldn't compete (b/c then Evan wouldn't have competed at '09 Worlds). This seems more personal than that, and it may be the issue Centerpt1 noted above.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayra View Post
    A feud based on what because it certainly isn't professional jealousy.
    These coaches travel on teams together and spend a lot of time together. Coaching is kind of like a fraternity/sorority anyway. There are plenty of things for coaches to feud/dislike each other about that have nothing to do with the medals their students have earned.

  6. #26

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    I believe that Rachael and her coach share responsibility.
    They both knew that she was not fit/physically ready for competition; and concealed it,

    I'm glad that Hersh persisted with follow-up, or we might never have known about this action.
    I hope that there will be clearly defined policies and procedures in place to prevent similar situations in the future.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by newbatgirl View Post
    I hope we hear about what the "separate action" against Tom Z turns out to be.
    Whatever it is, it should definitely be harsher than the action taken against Flatt. Honestly, I think the whole situation falls on Tom Z. HE was the one who made the decision to send her- and the one who is ultimately responsible for his skater.

  8. #28

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    Ok, what does "reprimand" here mean exactly?
    She will be banned from competing for the next season?

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Debbie S View Post
    Exactly. She may have still competed, and the result may have been the same, and frank would still be talking about it.
    How do you know Frank would still be talking about it if Rachael's camp had reported her injury?
    Q: Why can't I read the competition threads?
    A: Competition forums on the board are available to those with a Season Pass or a premium membership How to View Kiss & Cry

  10. #30

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    USFS not releasing how much they are fining Rachael is a bit odd. It could be something totally ceremonial like $100. It's not like Rachael is rolling in endorsement money or anything like that. This might have just been a gentle token gesture by USFS to get Phil off their backs.

    Either way, I think it's an important step. This sends a huge message to other skaters down the road who might be in her position. She has every right to skate injured at Nationals, where she's only skating for herself, but with so much more than her own result at stake, her Worlds behavior was inexcusable.

  11. #31
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    I tend to agree with RD.
    Tom Z has a great ethical responsibility in this and he failed miserably. And we haven't touched on JF skate at Nationals which was another poor decision. I have to imagine now that the cat is out of the bag re: a reprimand/fine for Rachael that we will certainly hear something regarding Tom Z's "punishment"--aside from losing multiple skaters for the coming season!!!!

  12. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by YukiNieve View Post
    Ok, what does "reprimand" here mean exactly?
    She will be banned from competing for the next season?
    The answer is NO! The article went on to report...USFS would have no further comment on the action. It will not affect her eligibility. The federation is addressing separately what if any action to take against Tom Zakrajsek, who was her coach at worlds.
    There is nothing more captivating in this world than a woman's form gracing the ice in skating boots. It's simply sensational!

  13. #33
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    Not surprised USFS finally addressed this, but I'm a bit shocked they threw Rachael under the bus before Tom Z (assuming that happens at all), especially after how the USFS has looked kindly toward Rachael in the past.

  14. #34

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    I'm kind of stunned, but agree with the decision and hope Tom Z. is called on the carpet too, in fact, even more than Rachael.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by YukiNieve View Post
    Ok, what does "reprimand" here mean exactly?
    She will be banned from competing for the next season?
    Basically a warning letter. Still, I wonder how much the fine was, and why they chose not to disclose it (is it an unusually small or large amount?)

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSfan107 View Post
    I think the root of Frank's ire is that he believes that injured athletes should not be competing. I agree with him.
    At this level, a lot of athletes are competing with injuries, some more serious than others. If Rachael was still doing all of her jumps up until she arrived at Worlds (and in the SP, it seemed she was still expecting to do her regularly planned jumps aside from the 3-3), then I don't see much of problem with her trying to gut it out. That's what athletes do, and it would be crazy, in my opinion, to fine her for that.

    Now, if Rachael was aware that she was required to notify USFS that she had an injury/received a diagnosis, but didn't bother doing that, then that's a completely different story. It wasn't right to leave the alternate completely in the dark about this injury situation.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by RD View Post
    Basically a warning letter. Still, I wonder how much the fine was, and why they chose not to disclose it (is it an unusually small or large amount?)
    Well, I hope it doesn't break the bank but I want it to be meaningful. Something like $50 is just a waste of time.

  18. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenna View Post
    Well, I hope it doesn't break the bank but I want it to be meaningful. Something like $50 is just a waste of time.
    I think the reprimand and fine is more symbolic than anything else and does more harm in the long run. I mean when was the last time the USFS reprimanded and fined a skater?

  19. #39
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    WOW, just when you thought this off-season couldn't get more bizarre or be filled with more drama. Like everyone else, I am wondering where is Tom's long overdue fine for coaching negligence?

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by stjeaskategym View Post
    Now, if Rachael was aware that she was required to notify USFS that she had an injury/received a diagnosis, but didn't bother doing that, then that's a completely different story. It wasn't right to leave the alternate completely in the dark about this injury situation.
    Yes, I personally believe this is what prompted the action (reprimand and fine) by USFS.

    This is what I posted in the earlier Flatt injury thread on May 3:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    All the U.S. coaches and skaters are fully aware of the importance and necessity of notifying specific people at USFS if/when they are injured (there is a clear process in place), especially before an international competition. Of course it becomes a judgement call when a skater really wants to compete through/despite an injury (I would assume that most skaters would elect to do this if they could -- many have an extremely high tolerance for pain) and the coach feels they can still compete effectively enough (as Zakrajsek told Hersh). USFS cannot step in unless they are notified and, in this case, it appears they were unaware of Flatt's injury until she was actually at Worlds (too late for Nagasu to be summoned).

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