I was very impressed by P&I at this year's Nats. Already, they have excellent posture and lines, skate close together and match beautifully - these are attributes that many teams struggle with for years and never achieve. Alex's positions in lifts are fantastic. Chemistry is coming along decently.
IMO it's easier to start with these characteristics, then add power and speed, than it is to clean up skating that is speedy but lacks refinement.
They've had enough people tell them and their coaches that they resemble a younger V/M to get the message, I'm sure. Whether it was intentional or not, with any sense they'll avoid comparisons in packaging next season. They definitely need to grow into a "sense of themselves" as a team.
I do think that they can challenge for the podium at Nats next year, if they work really hard and listen to feedback.
I couldn't agree more. I do think they've got great chemistry for a newer team, but I think the real test of that will come with the Rhumba SD. Based on how good their chemistry was in their tango SD this season at Thornhill, though, I doubt they'll have to much trouble in that area.
Originally Posted by flowerpower
As for the V/M comparison thing, I really don't see it as much of a problem. Honestly, for me, the comparison was more in Alexandra's look and carriage than it was in their style. Paul & Islam have only had one romantic program to date, which I guess is what many people consider to be Virtue & Moir's signature style (although they're so versatile I honestly don't see why), and its not as if Virtue and Moir invented that style. The stylistic similarities really came from great lines, excellent unision and a natural ease across the ice. While I think that exploring new styles is exactly what Paul & Islam. or any new team for that matter, should be doing, I really hope that they don't take this Virtue & Moir comparison too seriously. I would hate to see them try and sacrifice the traits that make them such a beautiful team to watch because they're afraid of looking too much like another team. If the things that make Paul & Islam look like Virtue and Moir are all of the qualities of a world class team, then its crazy to expect them to change anything.
Agreed very much with this. I think the qualities in which P/I naturally show the greatest promise overlap to a degree with certain of the qualities which make V/M as great as they are; the newer team shouldn't feel pressured not to emphasize those strengths simply because of the "they're ripping off V/M!!!" outcries from some, especially when it's those same strengths that have allowed them the success they've had thus far. And to be honest, their FD this season reminded me more in some respects of D/L than V/M -- not totally surprising, given the choreographers, but something worth noting. The romantic, lyrical style doesn't belong exclusively to V/M, nor would they or should their fans want that to be taken as a given.
Originally Posted by skatingfan04
I'm very excited to see what they do next season, and I do believe they have a shot at making the world team even assuming that V/M compete in 2011-12. One of their greatest assets is their connection, which is something that, combined with continued technical progress, could give them an edge over a team like C/P. C/P started off strong this season with a more abstract, technically challenging FD, but I think their lack of connection really hurts them in the end -- with them there's always eventually a sense of watching two skaters skating at the same time, more than of two performing as one. It will be interesting to see how each Canadian team responds to this year's results in their plans for next season's programs.
I think P/I's team may not have tried to create a V/M vibe so much as just not go out of their way to avoid it. The main thing that they could have done to lessen the effect would have been to go with a different choice of FD costume for her. Intentional or not , I agree they should avoid any such similarities in future.
Actually, Alexandra has even more balletic lines than Tessa, which is an asset they'd be foolish not to take advantage of occasionally, so I do expect to see more soft , romantic programs from them in the future ( but I hope not exclusively ).
So far, Alexandra always seems to have well designed, beautifully executed costumes, she should just try to avoid the same palette as Tessa. If her last year's FD costume had not come so close to the colour of Tessa's Mahler costume , I don't think there would have been as much talk of them trying to emulate V/M .( In fact, it couldn't hurt for Mitch to adopt a more Scott-like silhouette in his costumes. I think his pants are too baggy ,which makes you think he's too skinny..especially when combined with suspenders. He's not ever really going to look like Scott , he's a totally different build. )
So, apart from the one costume , and the fact that both girls have had a lot of ballet training and have generally similar colouring , I don't see any great likeness between the two couples and I think the V/M lite thing has been a bit overplayed. I certainly wouldn't want Alexandra to lose her beautiful carriage , floaty arms , stretch , or pointed toes just so she won't be compared to Tessa. ( Let's face it , probably every female Canadian Ice Dancer is going to be compared to Tessa from here on out. )
I admit to feeling a bit ambivalent about the Z/S choreo tease , because even though I think Zueva , in particular , is a genius at designing programs that enhance the skaters' skills and talents, if she choreographed for P/I , it might invite even more of this V/M wannabe business....OTOH , it could help them to establish their own persona as a couple.
ETA: Hear, hear flowerpower , skatingfan and lavenderblue.. I obviously agree !( I was stuck in mid-post limbo while you were posting )
Last edited by Pratfall; 05-11-2011 at 08:46 PM.
Reason: Adding on
- Rep Power
i think p/i should do whatever they want to do and not worry about, oh gosh, what if somebody thinks we're imitating? so what? if you're good at *whatever it is you do*, you will put your own stamp on it. no style belongs exclusively to any one couple.
a bit off topic but come on, what did grinkov say when oleg protopopov grumbled about G&G skating to moonlight sonata? the music belongs to beethoven, not oleg protopopov, or something like that?
i like both v/m and p/i. given tessa's health concerns, the possibility that she may not be able to continue as long as fans would like--heck, even if she were perfectly healthy and hasn't had to endure multiple operations, i'd still love to see as many v/m clones as possible. v/m can't possibly skate long enough for me to see them skate to all the wonderful music and rhythm that exists in the world. i like that 'look', that sappy young in love... thing...
come on, you think if grinkov were still around, and G&G were the undisputed master of the 'in love' style, people would be bashing every russian newcomer pair who tries to skate to romeo and juliet?
Couldn't agree more with everyones comments. Its nice to see that I'm not the only one who thinks some have taken the V/M lite thing way overboard.
BTW, lavenderblue, I totally agree with your comments on C/P. You were able to put into words what I've been trying to get at in my earlier posts.
Actually, thanks to everyone for their great comments. I was hoping for this type of livelyt discussion when I opened the thread.
According to the Skate Canada Central Onatrio website, Paul & Islam were in a show a few days ago, along with Patrich Chan, Crone & Poirier and Andrei Rogozine. I belive it was called the Margaret Garrison Memorial Gala. Now, this event was broadcast on Skatebuzz (Skate Canada's other official site), but I saw no promo for it this time around. Did anyone attend the show, take any pictures or find video from the event? I'd love to hear a review. Thanks!!
Aw, it was broadcast on Skatebuzz? I'd seen the notice on the Athletes Appearances page but didn't realize it was going to be streamed anywhere (er, assuming it wouldn't have been geoblocked for someone in the US...).
I'd love to hear something as well!
I checked skatebuzz, but the most recent vids are of the recent Adult championships. So I don't know if they streamed it ( events usually stay up for a while ) maybe they will post it after the fact?
For future reference ,they don't geoblock. And when they have commentary..it's really fun.
Oh, excellent. I've caught a few things on there with no trouble, but I was unsure as to whether that would apply for all or if some things might be blocked.
Originally Posted by Pratfall
Hoping they post it, then!
Jeesh. I wish I'd known. I really like this team.....they've got all the goods so far with lots of potential and a great connection to each other.
Addicted to FSU
Sorry for the confustion What I meant was that this event was broadcast through Skatebuzz LAST year. There was no indication that this years' version, which took place a few weeks ago, would be broadcast.
Not video, but Justine Chiu has posted some lovely photos from the event on her website. Looks like Alex and Mitch performed their FD.
Thanks for the link, lavenderblue. Those are lovely shots!
Originally Posted by lavenderblue
- Rep Power
I saw the COS gala show and it was great. Patrick Chan was awesome as usual, and the whole show flowed wonderfully. Unfortunately Alex and Mitch did not have their best skate with a few stumbles and I believe a missed lift but they are a great team none the less. The rest of the dance teams skated flawlessly. A highlight for me was the icemen. If you haven't had a chance to see them live, try to, they were great fun.
Originally Posted by sadie
I found some really cute practice videos from before the COS show on Youtube. There is very little Paul/Islam, but a lot of Patrick Chan, Bryce Davison and Dylan Moscovitch.
There was also a clip of the final bows from the show...
... and a couple of different clips of The Ice Men performing.
There was also a short photo gallery posted on Flikr.
Last edited by skatingfan04; 05-29-2011 at 11:15 PM.
Crone & Poirier have officially split up. This is definately going to shake things up nationally this year, although I think its now safe to assume that the world team for 2012 will be Vritue/Moir, Weaver/Poje and Paul/Islam, barring any injuries or unforseen major improvements from other teams.
Yep. It's unfortunate on C/P's end -- though I thought they were great at Skate Canada, but stagnated past that point -- but certainly a boon for P/I. I wonder what this will mean for GP assignments?
Well obviously not much. They've only been assigned to NHK.
Originally Posted by lavenderblue
I am very surprised that they weren't assigned to Skate Canada. I wonder who Skate Canada is saving that third "TBA" spot for? Harvey & Gagnon? Arnold & Trjoek? Ralph & Hill?
It's sad that they are really losing momentum and reputation vs. their world junior contemporaries like I&K and the Shibutanis.