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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by manleywoman View Post
    Ummm, did you not read the quote you just quoted?
    It does NOT say he took things out of people's rooms. He could just as easily have taken things from a supply closet. Why doesn't he just not tell these stories about himself so we can all believe a false idea that he's a saint? Would that be better? Look, the guy isn't perfect, but he's not the devil's spawn. Why don't we all write books about questionable things we've done and look and see who among us is perfect? I just can't believe the snark he's getting for things he mostly did when he was 20 or 21. And they weren't even that BAD. Taking (not stealing--borrowing) a few blankets? Kicking a guy out of a room that HE paid for? Wearing a USSR jacket? Not liking a particular motel? Heavens me! I know it's really fun to snark about people, but this is just ridiculous.

  2. #122

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justathoughtabl View Post
    It does NOT say he took things out of people's rooms. He could just as easily have taken things from a supply closet.
    You're missing the point. It isn't where he took it from; it's that he took things that maybe someone else would have needed, or would have expected to be there. He may think taking it was clever, or that it shows what an anti-authoritarian rebel he is. I think it's really inconsiderate, and I get the sense that he would have been screaming blue murder if some other athlete in the dorm had done the same thing to him.

    There is no reason at all why, if he needed that stuff, he couldn't have asked a staff person to find some to put in his room.
    You should never write words with numbers. Unless you're seven. Or your name is Prince. - "Weird Al" Yankovic, "Word Crimes"

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by overedge View Post
    You're missing the point. It isn't where he took it from; it's that he took things that maybe someone else would have needed, or would have expected to be there. He may think taking it was clever, or that it shows what an anti-authoritarian rebel he is. I think it's really inconsiderate, and I get the sense that he would have been screaming blue murder if some other athlete in the dorm had done the same thing to him.
    There is no reason at all why, if he needed that stuff, he couldn't have asked a staff person to find some to put in his room.

    Message received. It is inconsiderate to walk over to another building and take supplies when none were left for you. Okay. Yes, I would agree with that and I would not do that myself. But could we get OFF criticizing this poor man for things he did when he was 21? I mean, really. What do you think about what he wrote for the Japanese fans? What do you think about what he said in his post-Olympics press conference? Maybe..oh, I don't know...he's grown up a little? I'm just confused about why the Johnny Weir threads I've seen always seem to turn into character assassination. Is that really all you see in him?

  4. #124
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    Welcome to the forum Justathoughtabl. The game is played thus: Someone posts something about Johnny. The haters hate and the fans defend. All threads regarding him are hundreds of pages long and are basically the same arguments and involve the same few people. No one is willing to give an inch. If you've ever seem the documentary about him it starts by saying "You either love him or hate him. There's no middle ground. Yep.

  5. #125

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justathoughtabl View Post
    I ahven't been on here for very long, and I guess my assumption was wrong. I saw the Evan thread on here that's very positive, while even a posting of Johnny's message to Japan didn't get a response. All I can conclude from what you say is that people praise the winners and are disdainful of the people who don't win as much.
    People do love a winner, 'tis true!
    Quote Originally Posted by Triple Butz View Post
    I don't think the Evan hate started until 2007 when he started to talk about all the sparkles and sequins he disapproved of and that he was going to push the sport by doing the quad no matter what. Of course, then he should up to LA and Vancouver quadless and dressed in Vera Wang. Being a hypocrite is the kiss of death in the public eye.
    I recall a lot of hostility when Evan got bronze at 2005 Nationals over Matt Savoie, then he won bronze at 2005 Worlds ahead of Johnny. Many people on FSU were beside themselves at the scores he posted at 2006 Nationals, which he was within a hair of winning. Then starting in the 2006-07 season people complained mightily about him re-using the Carmen FS, even though he had only used it for half of the prior season. ITA that Evan didn't help matters with his public "no-sequins" mantra, but there was plenty of anti-Evan sentiment prior to that.
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by orbitz View Post
    What was wrong with wearing a costume from Very Wang? There are women who design men clothing lines out there. Besides, it wasn't like Evan was wearing one of her evening gown or wedding dress creation out on the ice.
    First of all, I wasn't stating a personal opinion, just recalling events that caused many fans to turn on Evan.

    Secondly, Evan expressed in a few articles that he wanted to start a trend in men's skating that costumes could be simple and masculine. He mocked costumes with sparkles and over-the-top designs. In the olympic season, however, he showed up in costumes with sparkles, feathers, snakes, and even exposed his nips.

    Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with the costumes he chose, they just weren't consistent with the messages he was putting out before so I understood when it casued a lot of from fans.

  7. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justathoughtabl View Post
    Can you please give a few examples of how Johnny embraces diva-ness? Liking fashion really isn't a valid example. Where Johnny does rebel, he seems to have good reason, and I've never heard of him rebelling on a tour. It's usually against FSU rules about clothing, is it not? Is that such a huge deal?
    Are you kidding?! Johnny himself calls himself a Diva. I'm sure there are journal entries on his own website where he declares himself a diva. I personally don't think it's a bad thing, but I also recognise that some doors are simply closed to you when you are like that. Would I be friends with Johnny? Absolutely I'd love to hang out with him and have a laugh with him. Would i want to be his manager/or boss? Not. In. A. Million. Years. I have friends who I love dearly who I would say exactly the same about.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by antmanb View Post
    Are you kidding?! Johnny himself calls himself a Diva. I'm sure there are journal entries on his own website where he declares himself a diva. I personally don't think it's a bad thing, but I also recognise that some doors are simply closed to you when you are like that. Would I be friends with Johnny? Absolutely I'd love to hang out with him and have a laugh with him. Would i want to be his manager/or boss? Not. In. A. Million. Years. I have friends who I love dearly who I would say exactly the same about.
    I think there's a difference between "diva" in the sense Johnny is saying: i.e., having your own ideas and standing up for yourself (positives) and "diva" in the sense that people here are talking about: i.e., being a jerk, talking back to management, not getting along with others, which I really don't associate with Johnny. Johnny has been on tours before and I've never heard a story about him being difficult. COI asked him back every year until they went out of business. Skate for Hope is having him back. Kings on Ice is having him back. Skate for the Heart had him back. Figure Skating in Harlem is having him back. I remember watching "Kaleidoscope" with Scott Hamilton in December, and Johnny came out to say a few words of thanks to the audience. Scott Hamilton introduced him by saying, "And now for something completely different!" After Johnny said his heartfelt words ("Thank you guys for coming. It really means so much" or something else entirely un-diva-like), Scott saw him off by saying, "Well that's great. That's just sooooo great," dripping in sarcasm. So I think people just can't let go of their dislike of Johnny.
    But it's not worth it to keep arguing for him. He doesn't need it. I'm a fan, and I recognize he's not perfect (my favorite people in the world are complex and flawed), and I'm glad he's around and skating and inspiring people.

  9. #129
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    What kind of open supply closet has lamps and bedside tables?

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    What kind of open supply closet has lamps and bedside tables?
    Where's the icon that's banging its head against a brick wall?

  11. #131
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    Look, the whole thing is rather amusing, but to be frank, you're spinning yourself into a corner here. The passage you quoted from the book says absolutely nothing to indicate there was a supply closet or that the items were openly available for anyone to take. The supply closet is in your imagination, and I think it's how you've been able to tell yourself that his behaviour was acceptable.

    What everyone else seems to see is that Johnny, by his own description, went to part of the Village that was as yet unoccupied and helped himself to a bunch of stuff - not just a few extra towels or a pillow, but actual furnishings. He even refers to it as "loot" and paints a picture of scurrying back to his room with it.

    Maybe you think it's acceptable to take things that are meant for someone else, but most people do not.

  12. #132

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    Quote Originally Posted by REO View Post
    Welcome to the forum Justathoughtabl. The game is played thus: Someone posts something about Johnny. The haters hate and the fans defend. All threads regarding him are hundreds of pages long and are basically the same arguments and involve the same few people. No one is willing to give an inch. If you've ever seem the documentary about him it starts by saying "You either love him or hate him. There's no middle ground. Yep.
    Or the people in that middle ground who are indifferent to Mr. Weir don't bother posting in his threads, or even reading them most of the time.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    Look, the whole thing is rather amusing, but to be frank, you're spinning yourself into a corner here. The passage you quoted from the book says absolutely nothing to indicate there was a supply closet or that the items were openly available for anyone to take. The supply closet is in your imagination, and I think it's how you've been able to tell yourself that his behaviour was acceptable.
    Go back and read my posts again. There's nothing in that passage to indicate that he took the supplies from rooms, either. And I said MAYBE he took them from a supply closet...or maybe a basement. Who knows? All I know is that I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.
    This thread is insanity.

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    Or the people in that middle ground who are indifferent to Mr. Weir don't bother posting in his threads, or even reading them most of the time.
    Both of them.

  15. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    Look, the whole thing is rather amusing, but to be frank, you're spinning yourself into a corner here. The passage you quoted from the book says absolutely nothing to indicate there was a supply closet or that the items were openly available for anyone to take. The supply closet is in your imagination, and I think it's how you've been able to tell yourself that his behaviour was acceptable.

    What everyone else seems to see is that Johnny, by his own description, went to part of the Village that was as yet unoccupied and helped himself to a bunch of stuff - not just a few extra towels or a pillow, but actual furnishings. He even refers to it as "loot" and paints a picture of scurrying back to his room with it.

    Maybe you think it's acceptable to take things that are meant for someone else, but most people do not.
    Maybe you should call the Italian police and get him arrested for grand theft lamp! I hope the statute of limitations isn't past!

  16. #136

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justathoughtabl View Post
    I think there's a difference between "diva" in the sense Johnny is saying: i.e., having your own ideas and standing up for yourself (positives) and "diva" in the sense that people here are talking about: i.e., being a jerk, talking back to management, not getting along with others, which I really don't associate with Johnny. Johnny has been on tours before and I've never heard a story about him being difficult. COI asked him back every year until they went out of business. Skate for Hope is having him back. Kings on Ice is having him back. Skate for the Heart had him back. Figure Skating in Harlem is having him back. I remember watching "Kaleidoscope" with Scott Hamilton in December, and Johnny came out to say a few words of thanks to the audience. Scott Hamilton introduced him by saying, "And now for something completely different!" After Johnny said his heartfelt words ("Thank you guys for coming. It really means so much" or something else entirely un-diva-like), Scott saw him off by saying, "Well that's great. That's just sooooo great," dripping in sarcasm. So I think people just can't let go of their dislike of Johnny.
    But it's not worth it to keep arguing for him. He doesn't need it. I'm a fan, and I recognize he's not perfect (my favorite people in the world are complex and flawed), and I'm glad he's around and skating and inspiring people.
    From what i've seen and read about Johnny he knows exactly what diva means, sometimes its serious, often it's in a jokey Tyra Banks/Drag Queeny way. Either way I don't think Diva is either/or of the two options you gave it's a combination of both. I wouldn't say being a diva equlas being a jerk, I think the sometimes negative diva behaviour is being petulant, possibly a little entitled....either way, like I said there is no doubt in my mind that Johnny would own the title of Diva and not be as troubled by someone calling him that as you apparently are.

  17. #137

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justathoughtabl View Post
    I mean, really. What do you think about what he wrote for the Japanese fans?
    I'm actually a fan of Johnny's. But what he wrote for the Japanese fans has nothing to do with anything. I've seen posts on this board that are just as or more touching and wonderful as anything Johnny had to say. The fact is, a person who didn't feel sympathy at this time for the Japanese people would be totally hardhearted.

  18. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by taf2002 View Post
    I'm actually a fan of Johnny's. But what he wrote for the Japanese fans has nothing to do with anything. I've seen posts on this board that are just as or more touching and wonderful as anything Johnny had to say. The fact is, a person who didn't feel sympathy at this time for the Japanese people would be totally hardhearted.
    Ummm...the subject of this thread is Johnny news, quotes, and articles. I posted a Johnny quote, if you will. Because no one else was. I was expressing surprise that no one...or maybe only one person...had anything to say about that, and that instead, people continued to argue about something Johnny did in 2006. This thread disintegrated into Johnny criticism three posts in. My point in all this is just to say that about 90 percent of the Johnny posts I've seen on this board (admittedly, I've only been reading it for a few months) are negative, and if you knew nothing about Johnny's gifts, his personality, etc, you'd think he was just a jerk who had very little to contribute to figure skating. So I thought I'd throw in my two cents. I know he's a polarizing figure, but it seems to me that the bashers are just as hard-headed and stubborn as the people who think he's God's gift. I'm trying to strike a middle ground. But I'm going to stop posting here because it's just futile.

  19. #139

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    The fact is that any uber of a skater isn't going to be happy with multiple opinions about their skater. A skater specific board for Johnny's fans would provide you a place to gush without encountering opposition. You are as welcome here as any skating fan but you have to expect that not everyone is going to agree with you here.

  20. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by taf2002 View Post
    I'm actually a fan of Johnny's. But what he wrote for the Japanese fans has nothing to do with anything. I've seen posts on this board that are just as or more touching and wonderful as anything Johnny had to say. The fact is, a person who didn't feel sympathy at this time for the Japanese people would be totally hardhearted.
    I think her point was that the person who wrote that cannot be the completely self involved, bedside table criminal who has no redeeming attributes and has not grown as a person since he was little more than a teenager. Of course you're right about everyone's feelings for the Japanese people.

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