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  1. #421
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    so, i dont suprise why pang's jump is so weak this year and why they choose rest

  2. #422

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    Quote Originally Posted by 93ning View Post
    They wont charge their mind.
    PANG/TONG both not in good health this year
    especially Pang ,i dont know now,but about one month ago,just about 38kg

    they need rest
    Thank you for the information. I wish them health and happiness in the future.
    And so, dear Lord, it is with deep sadness that we turn over to you this young woman, whose dream to ride on a giant swan resulted in her death. Maybe it is your way of telling us... to buy American.

  3. #423
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    Pang has nephropathy(Do i spell it right?) and a weak digestive system for many years

    that is one reason why she always such thin.

    they said if they have a good condition,they will back and to attend the 2014 Olympic Games

  4. #424
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    Quote Originally Posted by benedict_david View Post
    If we follow the other article, we can see that they paired up in 1998. And let's review their controversial ages:


    So if we are to believe the listed ages, then in 1998, Dan Zhang was 10~11 and Hao Zhang was 15~16. (Notice that Dan Zhang said that "Hao Zhang was 12", not the reporter)
    And that would explain why he was so tall at 12 years old.

    I haven't seen any description about Dan Zhang doing triple jumps when she was about 11 or something. Would you point it out for me? And I'm not that surprised if that's true, it's not a miracle for an 11-yr-old to be able to do 3S or 3T.
    Yes, it was Dan Zhang said Hao Zhang was 12, and that was what I used to guess the year of birth for Hao Zhang. I believe Dan Zhang was telling the truth as it was a recall of the past and it was a no presure situation. There was no reason to believe that she would even think about lying about his age when they paired up. She was simply saying that Hao Zhang was exceptionally tall for his age at 12 when they paired up. That does not match when they paired up. If it was 1998, then Hao Zhang would be either 14 or 16 depending on which birth day to use, the ISU or the web form. So I assue the 1998 pairing date is not correct.

    I don't know if Dan could do triples at 10-11 years of age. I just have the impression that they could do those when they were junior, and if Dan Zhang was really that young, than she could do those at that age. All speculation or induction

    I would be really pissed off if the allegations are true, unfair to other skaters. But I don't know who to trust. The articles as you can see are not reliable source of information, and everybody knows website info concains tons of errors.

  5. #425
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    I'd like to correct the concept that there could be only one year difference when using different age counting system. In China, one could be considered two years old when one's only two days old, especially in the North, we call it xu/mao sui, or unreal/approximate age. One is considered one year old when he/she was born, and every chinese new year or a New Year, depending on which system one use, add another year to your age. So if a person is born on Dec. 31, she or he would be 2 years old by Jan. 1 next year.
    So it is quite difficult to determine one's year of birth by conversation. Many would clarify by asking is that xu/mao sui or shi/zhou sui (real/full cycle age)?
    Also people in different occasions also choose to use different way of counting. I would fully understand people use shi/zhou sui when trying to emphasize what a genius a kid is.
    Sorry I don't think this could be the excuse. Because according to what you said and all the chinese calender staff, no one can be younger than ISU bio age/"western age"/full cycle age. They can only be older than that.

    So for girls: they are younger than ISU bio age.
    for boys: they are older than ISU bio age, but as you said, chinese people won't use the older one because they would like to emphasize the talent.

    And no matter what, that can't account for the discrepencies. They were born in 80s~90s, by then the western calender should be used officially in China. I have friends from China and they told me everyone get registered soon after they were born. Can you imagine Sui's parents went registered for their 1-week-old daughter in 1995 and said she was born in 1997 or vice versa?
    That doesn't make sense at all.

  6. #426
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    Yes, it was Dan Zhang said Hao Zhang was 12, and that was what I used to guess the year of birth for Hao Zhang. I believe Dan Zhang was telling the truth as it was a recall of the past and it was a no presure situation. There was no reason to believe that she would even think about lying about his age when they paired up. She was simply saying that Hao Zhang was exceptionally tall for his age at 12 when they paired up. That does not match when they paired up. If it was 1998, then Hao Zhang would be either 14 or 16 depending on which birth day to use, the ISU or the web form. So I assue the 1998 pairing date is not correct.

    I don't know if Dan could do triples at 10-11 years of age. I just have the impression that they could do those when they were junior, and if Dan Zhang was really that young, than she could do those at that age. All speculation or induction

    I would be really pissed off if the allegations are true, unfair to other skaters. But I don't know who to trust. The articles as you can see are not reliable source of information, and everybody knows website info concains tons of errors.
    But the 2009 article says they have been paired up for 12 years, right? Then the paring date would be 1997~1998. If we have to accept that Hao Zhang was 12 then Dan Zhang would be 7 according to the same article.

    The only discrpency in this article is the datum "12", which comes from Dan Zhang. Otherwise the article is consistent with itself and others.

  7. #427
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    Quote Originally Posted by benedict_david View Post
    Sorry I don't think this could be the excuse. Because according to what you said and all the chinese calender staff, no one can be younger than ISU bio age/"western age"/full cycle age. They can only be older than that.

    So for girls: they are younger than ISU bio age.
    for boys: they are older than ISU bio age, but as you said, chinese people won't use the older one because they would like to emphasize the talent.

    And no matter what, that can't account for the discrepencies. They were born in 80s~90s, by then the western calender should be used officially in China. I have friends from China and they told me everyone get registered soon after they were born. Can you imagine Sui's parents went registered for their 1-week-old daughter in 1995 and said she was born in 1997 or vice versa?
    That doesn't make sense at all.
    you misread my post. I said specifically that age in conversation is confusing, not the registered date of birth. It not even chinese calendar or western callendar. There should be only one year of birth no matter how they count their ages, it only happens in conversation. That's why even using the information from that articles there would be different conclusions. I'm just saying that the articles don't really mean much.

    By the way, I just cheched their wikipeia page and it says they paired up in 1997, not as mentioned in the article as 1998, so that would make Dan Zhang 1 year older, which matches the year on the form.

    Anway, I think I'm wasting my time doing analysis using information not reliable. I quit
    Last edited by Ilvskating; 02-16-2011 at 06:42 PM.

  8. #428
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    Quote Originally Posted by benedict_david View Post
    Sorry I don't think this could be the excuse. Because according to what you said and all the chinese calender staff, no one can be younger than ISU bio age/"western age"/full cycle age. They can only be older than that.

    So for girls: they are younger than ISU bio age.
    for boys: they are older than ISU bio age, but as you said, chinese people won't use the older one because they would like to emphasize the talent.

    And no matter what, that can't account for the discrepencies. They were born in 80s~90s, by then the western calender should be used officially in China. I have friends from China and they told me everyone get registered soon after they were born. Can you imagine Sui's parents went registered for their 1-week-old daughter in 1995 and said she was born in 1997 or vice versa?
    That doesn't make sense at all.
    its a way
    if ISU want to sure their age,they can apply the police to refer
    maybe another cards can be change
    but the first register in policestation and the hosipital' register cant be change
    ------------
    i dont know about american
    but in China ,after couples got married and before their baby born,they need receive a ....(i dont know how to translate it,just like a register certificate ,) from policestation and after the baby born ,hosipital will give them a 出生证明. then
    they will register the baby's information in policestation.
    -------------------
    i dont know if u can understand

    i just want to say the hosipital's information is the most true information
    according to the law ,the information should be preserve at least 30years.

  9. #429
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    93ning... i can't understand a lot of the english you wrote..... but you are clearly on the chinese fed's side.

    Maybe I can say, i am sure that Hao Zhang's age is fake, same as Han Cong, I just can't tell you how i know the information now. but trust me! those ages are fake, cause i'm sure! i'll keep it quiet for now. LOL. oh yeah, so credible.

  10. #430
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    you misread my post. I said specifically that age in conversation is confusing, not the registered date of birth. It not even chinese calendar or western callendar. There should be only one year of birth no matter how they count their ages, it only happens in conversation. That's why even using the information from that articles there would be different conclusions. I'm just saying that the articles don't really mean much.

    By the way, I just cheched their wikipeia page and it says they paired up in 1997, not as mentioned in the article as 1998, so that would make Dan Zhang 1 year older.
    I would hesitate to say that the articles are not reliable or something. The first one (which states there's 5 years difference between Dan and Hao Zhang) is from Wenhuibao, which is quite influencial and credible I would suppose.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wen_Hui_Bao Actually, there's not much peculiarity except "12", because that would make:
    1. If the 5 years difference is true:
    Dan Zhang was 7 when paired up
    2. If 1 is not true, and it was 1998:
    There's no way that Hao Zhang would be 12
    3. If 1 and 2 isn't true, it was 1997:
    If Hao Zhang was 12, then the ISU bio birthdate(1984) almost matched up, still 1 year difference
    3.1 If Dan Zhang was born in 1987 (listed):
    Dan Zhang was 10 in 1997, matched up.
    3.2 If Dan Zhang was born in 1985 (ISU bio):
    Doesn't match, she would be at least 11 by 1997

    And the 2006 article contains a lot of dates, it seems to say that they got their first world junior title after training for only 10 months. Again consistent with itself but not with wiki.
    Last edited by benedict_david; 02-16-2011 at 06:49 PM.

  11. #431
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yukari Lepisto View Post
    93ning... i can't understand a lot of the english you wrote..... but you are clearly on the chinese fed's side.

    Maybe I can say, i am sure that Hao Zhang's age is fake, same as Han Cong, I just can't tell you how i know the information now. but trust me! those ages are fake, cause i'm sure! i'll keep it quiet for now. LOL. oh yeah, so credible.


    i understand your meaning
    1i dont said "trust me",just said some things i knew,bebieve or not is your things
    2 not any sides, i just want to a truth
    i said i am not sure others ,even some lawless way ,now i still not sure,i dont believe any media included Chinese media.

    --------------------
    Now ,i just waiting for the time i could go to Harbin (Zhangs & SH' hometown )

    Being a Chinese skating lover,its sure fake will make me sad.
    but i want know truth
    Last edited by 93ning; 02-16-2011 at 06:52 PM.

  12. #432
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yukari Lepisto View Post
    93ning... i can't understand a lot of the english you wrote..... but you are clearly on the chinese fed's side.
    Wow! That's not the impression I get at all. My impression is that 93ning wants the truth as much as the rest of us, and is willing to do some research on his/her own to get it. He/she also provided us with the info that the one place where the birth dates can't be changed is police/hospital records. Don't see how that puts her on the Chinese fed's side.

  13. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by alilou View Post
    Wow! That's not the impression I get at all. My impression is that 93ning wants the truth as much as the rest of us, and is willing to do some research on his/her own to get it. He/she also provided us with the info that the one place where the birth dates can't be changed is police/hospital records. Don't see how that puts her on the Chinese fed's side.

    Agreed. Allowing for less than perfect English (still a whole lot better than my Chinese!) it would seem that 93ning is trying to explain what he or she knows, meaning there is some contact with some of these skaters, and is offering to do more research to back it up or find out otherwise.
    "Youth and vigor is no match for age and deceit." -- Prancer

  14. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by benedict_david View Post
    I would hesitate to say that the articles are not reliable or something. The first one (which states there's 5 years difference between Dan and Hao Zhang) is from Wenhuibao, which is quite influencial and credible I would suppose.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wen_Hui_Bao Actually, there's not much peculiarity except "12", because that would make:
    1. If the 5 years difference is true:
    Dan Zhang was 7 when paired up
    2. If 1 is not true, and it was 1998:
    There's no way that Hao Zhang would be 12
    3. If 1 and 2 isn't true, it was 1997:
    If Hao Zhang was 12, then the ISU bio birthdate(1984) almost matched up, still 1 year difference
    3.1 If Dan Zhang was born in 1987 (listed):
    Dan Zhang was 10 in 1997, matched up.
    3.2 If Dan Zhang was born in 1985 (ISU bio):
    Doesn't match, she would be at least 11 by 1997

    And the 2006 article contains a lot of dates, it seems to say that they got their first world junior title after training for only 10 months. Again consistent with itself but not with wiki.
    Doesn't that mean the same as the conclusion I got from the articles? Hao Zhang's dob on isu is correct and Dan Zhang's might be questionable?

  15. #435
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93ning View Post
    Being a Chinese skating lover,its sure fake will make me sad.
    but i want know truth
    So do we all. And, yes, it is very sad if any of the Chinese skaters' birthdates are proven to have been changed officially. Thanks for posting here!

  16. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    Doesn't that mean the same as the conclusion I got from the articles? Hao Zhang's dob on isu is correct and Dan Zhang's might be questionable?
    Only if we take "12" and throw away "5"

  17. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by benedict_david View Post
    Only if we take "12" and throw away "5"
    Yes! I'm pretty sure the "5 years older" is nonsense. I believe Dan Zhang when she said Hao Zhang was 12 years old when they paired up. That makes Hao Zhang innocent. There is no way a coach would pick a 7 years old at 1.39 cm girl for pair skating, and one can definitely tell the difference between an 8 years old and a 13 years old( at their first competition). And I just don't believe an 8 years old can win any international competition, no matter how talented she was.

  18. #438
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    Thank you 93ning. Looking forward for your investigation. What matters is the truth, not what we say on this board or what Chinese official claimed.

  19. #439
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    "Hao Zhang:
    ISU Birthdate: 06.07.1984 (26)
    Listed Birthdate: 06.02.1982 (29)"
    according to benedict_david

    when looking at this, it makes me blieve more that Hao Zhang's listed bd is an error. why on earth would he change his day of birth to July 6 from Feb. 6? July 1 is cut off date, he could simply change it to Feb.6 , 1983 to achieve the same goal for competition as July 4, 1984 would do, without bothering to remember a different month and day of birth, also one year less of "movement" of year of birth.

    benedict_david, here is a good example how tricky it could be when talking about age. From the age you listed (26 and 29), there is three years' difference when you counting by the month, but only two years when counting by the year.

    So when you say somebody is 12 or 10 in 1998 or 1997, it depends on how you count and when did you say it in a specific year. Without knowing that it is all a myth.

    I should be grounded now. no more comment on this issue.
    Last edited by Ilvskating; 02-16-2011 at 08:08 PM.

  20. #440
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    Ilvskating, that doesn't explain why these discrepancies are consistently in opposite directions for males versus females.

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