Oleada, you're officially famous.
Oleada, you're officially famous.
Btw-I'm not 'white'. And I certainly don't consider myself to be a racist when it comes to people who cheat. Notice I said 'people'. I don't need to pull the race card-a cheat is a cheat, and a liar is a liar no matter what race or ethnic group they come from.
"White racist losers'? Uh...if you see my analysis of who'd benefit most if Sui/Han and others are stripped of their ISU medals, you'd see Japan at the top of the list. In the case of Zhang/Zhang at the jr level, other Chinese would move up. Nothing racist about it.
Good job by all posters responsible for bringing this important issue to the forefront. Of course it's not like skating needs another scandal....
Now it will be interesting to see if other news agencies around the world pick up on the AP story. Also I thought it interesting that the ISU already was aware of the "discrepancies." Obviously they are reading FSU as well.
I meant to take the high road.... but I missed the exit.
Kexin Zhang was originally entered for Four Continents, but pinky166 correctly identified on Feb 5 that Kexin is too young (not 15 (only 14) by July 1, 2010) to participate in Senior ISU Championships. Kexin Zhang is no longer entered for Four Continents 2011.
The identification of this error led haribobo and others to wonder about the ages of Chinese ladies skaters in the 4CCs forum in Kiss and Cry. sammyf linked to the Chinese Sports listing of skater ages and RFOS found that Sui's birthdate was different and the rest is history.
Bingwa Geng and Binshu Xu do have age discrepancy issues as pointed out previously in this thread.
Last edited by HisWeirness; 02-14-2011 at 10:40 PM.
pinky166, sammyf, RFOS and oleada
Never for one second did I believe Wenjing Sui was 15 - glad the truth has emerged, and hope something is actually done about it.
My quick take on this: Asian girls/ women can look deceptively young physically for their actual age，so it’s unfair to automatically assume all Ｃhi nese female athletes to be underage. ＯＴＯＨ，Chinese sporting feds have track record of fudging certain athlete‘s ages，let‘s face it，Ｃhinese bureaucracy i sn’t known for being stellarly ethical。Ｔhese two f acts don‘t have to be mutually exclusive of each o ther i.e. they can both be true. Ｔhere exists a middle ground of assessing suspicions without all-encompassing assumptions that delve into ethnic or racial traits. Ｔhis is where things can be interpreted as being r acially insensitive。。。。Ｉget uncomfortable reading certain speculations about Ａsian physical traits a nd such，andＩ’m only partially Ａsian。 I guess whatＩdon’t want to happen is for future skat ers to be presumed "guilty" before evidence or pro of。 Ｗe can be fair and judicious in our discussion s，that goes for both sides。
Kudos to the named FSU'ers for their work ... and glad that Hersh (and others) are giving you the credit that you deserve!
Portia -- I don't disagree with your premise, but I haven't heard anyone suggest that all Chinese skaters are underage. (In fact, in at least one of the cases mentioned, the issue is the guy being too old.)
Seeing her in person, Sui looks like a middle schooler, not a fifteen-year-old, and I say that with years of working in a middle school that has a high ethnic Chinese enrollment. She may be 15 (with the joint wear of a 40 year old from those throw quad attempts, shudder) but I would not be surprised to find that she is younger.
I don't know what is going to be available in the way of "evidence or proof" given that these situations have apparently happened before with the concurrence (and probably active support) of the Chinese government -- but if someone previously convicted of fraud is accused of engaging in new fraud via evidence like this, are you surprised?
I heard this on the radio today and knew where to go for details.
Kudos to the OP and others who found this info!
Last edited by IceAlisa; 02-14-2011 at 11:54 PM.
"Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."
from Speedy Death
article in Chinese: http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/trad/c...ters_age.shtml
and this: http://soundofhope.org/programs/162/181415-1.asp
Last edited by jlai; 02-15-2011 at 01:23 AM.
Well done oleada and of course the other posters like benedict_david who as you say noticed the discrepancies!
Last edited by Sasha'sSpins; 02-15-2011 at 02:01 AM.
Many of the gymnasts on that 2008 Chinese team did NOT look 16. I know some tend to look younger by default, but still- it was looked into, then quickly swept under the rug. As some posters mentioned, I hope they do get busted, even if it's years after the fact.
Kudos to the people who dug up this info- it looks as if the report originated from evidence in this thread- and I hope it brings more scrutiny to the Chinese sports feds. They've done it before, and they'll do it again if there aren't serious consequences. If there is proof beyond a doubt that those athletes competed underage (or over-age), I think the ISU needs to come down hard...impose a ban on participation in any events, take away events from them...and if the ban includes an Olympic Games, all the better. Also strip athletes of any medals they may have won while ineligible. Send the message to everyone, to the world that cheating is NOT ok and will NOT be tolerated under any circumstances. Not fair to other nations to have to deal with this.
I think the bottom line is that results must be stripped. If you don't strip medals and titles then there is no point. Federations will continue to cheat because the results may very well be worth the risk since they will stand.
Of course, this is all dependent on guilt. I have no idea if they are but where there is smoke there is fire and China is one giant smoke stack lately.
"Michelle would never be caught with sausage grease staining her Vera Wang." - rfisher
Based on Oleada's long history of anti-Chinese-skaters ranting on a variety boards, it's no surprise she's such a sensation on this board.
Typical 'liberal' whitey woman.