Downton Abbey--Upstairs/Downstairs, Stiff Upper Lips, and Tea!

[smurfy]

Re - Lord Grantham and the maid,
My Little Pony / Grannyfan - There have been a few things as mentioned that I think Lord Grantham is bored, not able to go to battle, and just does seem to have much to do. Cora seems to running the hospital (or partially running it) and enjoying it. The daughters are busy too.
I love DA, but it does seem to be using cliche soap opera stories this season and Lord Grantham having a fling with a maid would fit in with dead relative with amnesia coming back from the dead and paralysis...

[Lara]

I'll be seriously disappointed if Gratham has an affair - there's more than enough soap opera as is. But agree it looks headed that way.

[aliceanne]

I'll be seriously disappointed if Gratham has an affair - there's more than enough soap opera as is. But agree it looks headed that way.

I think it is more likely that the maid has a history to hide and that when it comes out he will be sympathetic and try to help. He seems paternalistic toward the help, I can't see him ever condescending to treat them as equals. I think he takes himself more seriously than Major Moustache, and he is past the age where hormones will overwhelm him.

[sk9tingfan]

I think he takes himself more seriously than Major Moustache, and he is past the age where hormones will overwhelm him.

What happened to the mid-life crisis?

[aliceanne]

What happened to the mid-life crisis?

I thought midlife crises were for 40 somethings, isn't he older than that? I see him and Cora fighting over control. She's getting bossy and he has nothing to do. She has that other single mother maid to champion, and he has his.

I suppose he could have an affair, but he and Mary seem so asexual to me. I know he's supposed to be hot with Cora, and she is supposed to be catnip to potential heirs, but they both seem so dry.

[Civic]

I thought midlife crises were for 40 somethings, isn't he older than that? I see him and Cora fighting over control. She's getting bossy and he has nothing to do. She has that other single mother maid to champion, and he has his.

I suppose he could have an affair, but he and Mary seem so asexual to me. I know he's supposed to be hot with Cora, and she is supposed to be catnip to potential heirs, but they both seem so dry.

He's an English aristocrat from the old school. IMO, he's not so much dry as he is very controlled. Good manners and self restraint are important to him. Hugh Bonneville does an excellent job of showing us the often intense emotions that run beneath his Lordship's restrained exterior.

[nubka]

No, because she wouldn't be married to Lord Grantham, so the bastard son still wouldn't inherit.

I know. I was just being silly.

[aliceanne]

He's an English aristocrat from the old school. IMO, he's not so much dry as he is very controlled. Good manners and self restraint are important to him. Hugh Bonneville does an excellent job of showing us the often intense emotions that run beneath his Lordship's restrained exterior.

I've been accused of mistaking English aristocracy's self restraint for lack of passion before. Maybe he will explode into a burst of passion over the maid.

I think her storyline will be linked to the other maid with the child as it was rather pointedly declared "we believed HER story". I thought Lord Grantham's questioning her was a device to bring out more of her story and highlight Lord G's loneliness and boredom. Killing two bird's with one stone, not necessarily connecting them.

[danceronice]

I've been accused of mistaking English aristocracy's self restraint for lack of passion before. Maybe he will explode into a burst of passion over the maid.

Lol, that would be very non-English of him. (I like the English stiff upper lip, there's something so admirably Anglican about it.)

I think her storyline will be linked to the other maid with the child as it was rather pointedly declared "we believed HER story". I thought Lord Grantham's questioning her was a device to bring out more of her story and highlight Lord G's loneliness and boredom. Killing two bird's with one stone, not necessarily connecting them.

Again, I'm mum on where Lord Grantham/Jane is going, but I do agree they were trying to highlight the difference, AND with Daisy as well--they have three sort-of 'war widows.' Jane is a true war widow--she was as Mrs. Hughes says a legally-married wife and mother who lost her husband. You have Daisy, whom the world views as a legitimate war widow, but because she was pressured into marrying William and it was literally a marriage of hours, she doesn't feel she is one. And you have Ethel, who may or may not have thought her one-night stand was love (though Major Mustache clearly didn't care), but that's ALL it was whether he was killed or not, so societaly speaking, she's on her own.

[Coco]

I think Ethel and Maj. Mustache were more of a regular thing than just one time.

Not to be ...vulgar...but don't marriages have to be, uh, consummated? Would Daisy and William really be considered married?

[danceronice]

I think Ethel and Maj. Mustache were more of a regular thing than just one time.

Not to be ...vulgar...but don't marriages have to be, uh, consummated? Would Daisy and William really be considered married?

LEGALLY? No, you just need to file the paperwork. They don't even really care about the ceremony details beyond there being an officiant and witnesses to sign the papers, and proof everyone's of legal age or has parental consent.

I think the Anglican position, which is not that different from the Catholic, is it SHOULD be consummated and *refusal* to do so would be grounds for annulment. That's as in one partner actively refuses to have sex with their spouse. Though here, the issue is less that there was no actual sex (as clearly William couldn't provide it--heck, if Lavinia married Matthew as it currently stands, or rather he doesn't, they'd be in the same boat, just not with imminent death as an out) but that Daisy, in her own mind, entered the marriage under false pretenses. She didn't love William, she didn't want to marry him, she only went through with it under extreme duress with outside pressure. She actually only would need to say that she did not mean it, her vows weren't sincere, and it was never a true marriage in her mind. Even in Catholicism, let alone Anglicanism (where divorce is sort of permissible if strongly discouraged) that would be more than enough to declare the marriage having never existed. Basically she said there wasn't a marriage the minute she said she didn't mean it or think of it as a real marriage.

As for Ethel and Major Mustache, whether it was once or a couple times, it was clearly casual sex on his part, no matter what she made up in her head.

[Civic]

...As for Ethel and Major Mustache, whether it was once or a couple times, it was clearly casual sex on his part, no matter what she made up in her head.

My impression is that Ethel always understood that their relationship was a fling. She didn't seem particularly heartbroken when she learned the major had skipped town. She wasn't expecting him to marry her; she only wanted his financial support for their child.

[Lorac]

My impression is that Ethel always understood that their relationship was a fling. She didn't seem particularly heartbroken when she learned the major had skipped town. She wasn't expecting him to marry her; she only wanted his financial support for their child.

I don't agree with this - Ethel has been portrayed as a woman who wanted out of the life she was leading and was actively loking for a man to 'assist' her in this process. I'm pretty sure she wanted to trap the major by getting pregnant and when he fled town she was left in a huge mess!!

[aliceanne]

I think Ethel was enjoying a fun break from her dull routine. She just wasn't planning on getting pregnant. She strikes me as the type who doesn't think before she acts or opens her mouth.

As far as her talk about her future, that was just whining, she didn't have any plan for getting out.

[danceronice]

As far as her talk about her future, that was just whining, she didn't have any plan for getting out.

IAWTC. I think she was a contrast to Gwen, who wanted out, saved her wages, bought a typewriter, took courses, and set goals. Ethel read magazines about movie stars and fantasized about someone taking her away from all this and making her a star. Being "romanced" by a dashing officer probably seemed like another movie-plot adventure, up until she found out that explanation of where babies come from applied to her, too.

On another plot thread....I watched this week's again when my PBS reran it Thursday night and this time it registered, when Anna and Bates are talking "privately" about Vera's death, who's eavesdropping at the grate? O'Brien. Now, regardless of how Vera ACTUALLY died, who had motive, means, and (by virtue of having gone to town on short notice and returned unexpectedly early) opportunity to do her in? Bates. Are the police stupid and NOT going to come investigating? No. Now, has O'Brien learned her lesson about repeating half-overheard gossip and drawing conclusions from it after killing Cora's baby and almost Cora based on misheard rumor? Nope, I'm sure not.

[Reuven]

...and since O’Brien has a bee in her bonnet about Mr. Bates...

[my little pony]

i dont like this at all

i dont like mary hurting carson's feelings
i dont like the dad making a pass at the maid, she's really plain on top of it

bah

[my little pony]

oh please

this was as realistic as Captain Crewe coming out of amnesia and being able to stand all at once in the last minute of A Little Princess

[my little pony]

does it seem like the dad has known this moussy maid longer than since when she showed up at the house?

[my little pony]

Spoiler

is the dad freddie's father?