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  1. #521
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuven View Post
    Ah. Noticed that, did you?
    Actually thought that in the previous ep - but really sure now.

  2. #522
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    Well, I read TV Tropes, so I was watching FOR it, but I did think it was a nice touch the new maid (what IS her name) was cast to look just a bit like Cora. Clearly his lordship has a type.

    One more episode and the Spanish Flu! I'm kind of crossing my fingers that Peter/Patrick is being saved for a big plot for series 3. (They ARE doing another, right? I know the 'cliffhanger' ending of the Christmas special and if we never get any answers I will find the writers and belabor them about the head with a very heavy book. Or something. But I will be DESPERATE.) I can't imagine they threw the little gesture in for no reason. Also unless "Peter" is a professional con I kind of wonder that in basically four days (assuming both he and Patrick were first-class passengers boarding at Southampton, giving them the maximum time possible to get to know each other on the voyage before iceberg ahead) he was able to 'learn' Patrick's physical tics that well. (Yes, Peter would have to be in the same class of passenger to interact with Patrick, whom I assume had to be in first, given he was heir to Downton and 'good enough' to be engaged to Mary. James Cameron notwithstanding passenger classes didn't mingle. Then again, Peter could have been a steward--THERE he could disappear afterwards, and mingle easily with the passengers--actually it would be the ideal post for a con artist or thief, rather like being a footman gave Thomas plenty of opportunities to be a manipulative sociopath. Though it wouldn't explain his being Canadian...)

    And poor Edith. Seriously jinxed.

  3. #523

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    Yes, there will be a series 3. They start filming it very soon.
    'Life's hard. It's even harder when you're stupid.'--John Wayne

  4. #524
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    Weren't Peter and patrick acquainted with each other in England before boarding the Titanic?

  5. #525
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michalle View Post
    Weren't Peter and patrick acquainted with each other in England before boarding the Titanic?
    That didn't seem very clear (not to mention everything Peter/Patrick says has to be taken with a grain of salt.) Plus, none of the Granthams have heard of Peter before, and if anything that would make his story even LESS plausible as it means he had tons of time to build up his story and a big knowledge base to draw from. Unlike Matthew Patrick wasn't a near-total stranger, so it seems odd he'd have a Canadian friend they'd never even heard of. Then again, everyone but Edith thinks he's lying anyway.

    Side note, it cracked me up that the writers were clearly trying to show their work, referring so overspecifically to "Fifth Officer Lowe" by name and rank and counting how many got pulled out of the water and how many died. I'm amazed they didn't give his lifeboat number (14, if you were wondering.) But they do that with a lot of things where they're obviously explaining for the benefit of the audience as the characters would know this already.

  6. #526
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    That didn't seem very clear (not to mention everything Peter/Patrick says has to be taken with a grain of salt.) Plus, none of the Granthams have heard of Peter before, and if anything that would make his story even LESS plausible as it means he had tons of time to build up his story and a big knowledge base to draw from. Unlike Matthew Patrick wasn't a near-total stranger, so it seems odd he'd have a Canadian friend they'd never even heard of. Then again, everyone but Edith thinks he's lying anyway...
    Another angle to consider: Lord Grantham mentioned that one of his aunts had married a gentleman named Gordon back during the 1860s. Perhaps this Peter Gordon character will turn out to be a descendant of this aunt. One thing seems inescapable: whoever he is, he spent time around Patrick Crawley and at Downton Abbey in the past. IMO, the most likely scenarios are: 1)He's a bastard child of the family who was dispatched to Canada in order to prevent scandal. 2)One of his parents worked at Downton Abbey when he was a child and emigrated with him to Canada.
    Last edited by Civic; 02-07-2012 at 07:15 AM.

  7. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    Side note, it cracked me up that the writers were clearly trying to show their work, referring so overspecifically to "Fifth Officer Lowe" by name and rank and counting how many got pulled out of the water and how many died. I'm amazed they didn't give his lifeboat number (14, if you were wondering.) But they do that with a lot of things where they're obviously explaining for the benefit of the audience as the characters would know this already.
    Julian Fellowes is doing a Titanic special this year, to air on the 100th anniversary of its sinking. I think it's his divided attention to blame for the show becoming so stereotypically soapy. It was soapy before, but this season is like trope after trope.

  8. #528

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    Sir Richard got CREEPY!!
    Keeper of Nathalie Pechelat's bitchface.

  9. #529

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coco View Post
    Sir Richard got CREEPY!!
    Got creepy? Sir Richard has always seemed more than a bit of a creep to me -- and no amount of money and manners could hide it. Sunday's episode just peeled back his veneer of respectability to fully reveal the rat-bastard lurking inside.

  10. #530
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfan5 View Post
    Got creepy? Sir Richard has always seemed more than a bit of a creep to me -- and no amount of money and manners could hide it. Sunday's episode just peeled back his veneer of respectability to fully reveal the rat-bastard lurking inside.
    Seriously! I mean, I can't 100% BLAME him--he's never made a huge secret what sort of person he is or how he does business--but this is the point where Mary finally seems to connect the dots. If he'll threaten Lavinia and trick Vera, he CAN turn it on her.

    Jullian Fellowes is doing a Titanic special? Be still my liner-loving heart. I know quite a few are coming out, including more fictionalized ones, and I'm just bracing for more idiocy (Cameron's movie is bad enough, the miniseries that came out the year before, the one with Catherine Zeta-Jones....I'm sorry, but when George C. "Can't do accents to save his life" Scott as Captain Smith is the LEAST of your innaccuracy problems....) With Fellowes, I have hope even if it's another pure drama it might not suck!

  11. #531
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    Quote Originally Posted by Civic View Post
    One thing seems inescapable: whoever he is, he spent time around Patrick Crawley and at Downton Abbey in the past. IMO, the most likely scenarios are: 1)He's a bastard child of the family who was dispatched to Canada in order to prevent scandal. 2)One of his parents worked at Downton Abbey when he was a child and emigrated with him to Canada.
    I think he spent time with Patrick to be sure, but not so convinced about the rest. There are many stories about two people sharing intense situations, and tellling each other all about their lives. Then, when one of them dies, the other, for whatever reason, assumes their identity. I mean, look at "Don Draper" - and they weren't even close.

  12. #532

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    It must be popular in the U.S. if Saturday Night Live is doing a parody. The writer of the parody obviously has seen all the episodes and expected the SNL audience to be familiar with them as well.

    I thought it was funny to replace Laura Linney with a Spike TV (tatoos, monster vehicles) announcer to introduce the series.

  13. #533
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    Quote Originally Posted by znachki View Post
    I think he spent time with Patrick to be sure, but not so convinced about the rest. There are many stories about two people sharing intense situations, and tellling each other all about their lives. Then, when one of them dies, the other, for whatever reason, assumes their identity. I mean, look at "Don Draper" - and they weren't even close.
    I'm wondering if he was either a passenger or crew member on the Titanic? Talk about an intense situation...he and Patrick could have exchanged life stories during that fateful night.

  14. #534
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfan5 View Post
    Got creepy? Sir Richard has always seemed more than a bit of a creep to me -- and no amount of money and manners could hide it. Sunday's episode just peeled back his veneer of respectability to fully reveal the rat-bastard lurking inside.
    I love how Entertainment Weekly's recapper refers to him as Vile Richard

    Bridget Jones joke.

  15. #535

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michalle View Post
    Weren't Peter and patrick acquainted with each other in England before boarding the Titanic?
    The answer could be that Peter and Patrick were lovers and because Patrick was going to inherit Downton Abbey and marry Mary, she told all his childhood memories to Peter. But we´ll see...

  16. #536
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    Seriously! I mean, I can't 100% BLAME him--he's never made a huge secret what sort of person he is or how he does business--but this is the point where Mary finally seems to connect the dots. If he'll threaten Lavinia and trick Vera, he CAN turn it on her...
    By the same token, Sir Richard had plenty of opportunity to notice that Lady Mary is spirited and knows her own mind. She doesn't do slavish devotion. Her husband will have to *earn* her respect and loyalty. IMO, they both need to consider if they're well suited to one another.

  17. #537
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    Quote Originally Posted by Civic View Post
    I'm wondering if he was either a passenger or crew member on the Titanic? Talk about an intense situation...he and Patrick could have exchanged life stories during that fateful night.
    [massive Titanic geek sidetrack] They would have had to talk at some earlier point in the voyage, which seems plausible (Peter being Canadian argues he's a passenger, not crew, but as they threw on a lot of last-minute replacements it's possible they had a steward who wasn't English because they took anyone looking for work.) Otherwise a fake Patrick wouldn't have time to learn all the details including the real Patrick's trademark gesture. "That night" took roughly two hours, and rapidly reached a point where you weren't having detailed conversations. In the boats, most people weren't carrying on coherent conversations, especially in the last couple away (A was swamped, D was overloaded, and B was capsized with about thirty men standing on it, focused on not freezing to death or falling off. About twenty managed it.) People who wound up in the water had about ten minutes before they lost consciousness and ten more before they died from hypothermia.

    It's possible they never even met at all--Peter winds up at Downton to convalesce and picks up the stories about the heir, entail, etc. He hears the original heir was lost on Titanic. He's got time while recovering to do a little research (I don't recall from the episode--does he mention Lowe by name or was that the family talking about it later? The crew names would be one thing he probably just couldn't find out casually and I doubt Lord Grantham keeps a copy of the Board of Trade report lying around.) As Mary says, all the stuff he tells Edith he "remembers" are pretty easy guesses, the sort of things a carnival fortune teller can suss out. The conversation about the governess is a bog-standard con-he mentions something general, Edith fills in the details, and he just agrees with her.

    Of course they could REALLY be yanking our chains and he might be the real Patrick. But as that's hard to prove and he is only debatably compos mentis, it might not mean disinheriting Matthew...

  18. #538

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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    It's possible they never even met at all--Peter winds up at Downton to convalesce and picks up the stories about the heir, entail, etc. He hears the original heir was lost on Titanic. He's got time while recovering to do a little research (I don't recall from the episode--does he mention Lowe by name or was that the family talking about it later? The crew names would be one thing he probably just couldn't find out casually and I doubt Lord Grantham keeps a copy of the Board of Trade report lying around.) As Mary says, all the stuff he tells Edith he "remembers" are pretty easy guesses, the sort of things a carnival fortune teller can suss out. The conversation about the governess is a bog-standard con-he mentions something general, Edith fills in the details, and he just agrees with her.

    Of course they could REALLY be yanking our chains and he might be the real Patrick. But as that's hard to prove and he is only debatably compos mentis, it might not mean disinheriting Matthew...
    Apparently Peter requested to be sent to Downton due to a 'family' connection. Personally I don't think he is the heir - I suspect he knew Patrick from before and was hoping that his injury could help him to con the Granthams. As soon as they said they were getting lawyers involved he fled thus proving he was a fake IMHO. Edith was so desperate to believe she inadvertently helped Peter with his con. I seriously doubt that he will be back and (hopefully) that was the end of that storyline.

  19. #539
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    Here is a synopsis from wikipedia regarding Peter/Patrick

    Set in November 1918. A Canadian officer, badly disfigured by burns, asks to be brought to Downton, stating a relation to the family. Lord Grantham agrees, assuming he is some distant relation, sharing common ancestry but he stuns everyone by declaring that he is Patrick Crawley, the supposedly deceased heir. His story is that he survived the Titanic but suffered from amnesia so he was unable to identify himself and lived as a Canadian until a wartime experience restored his memory. Most of the others vehemently deny the possibility even though he remembers many details that only Patrick is likely to have known. However Edith believes him, growing attached to him as he claims that he was always in love with her. Then, Lord Grantham's investigation casts doubt on the Canadian officer's claim, revealing that Patrick Crawley had a friend who emigrated to Canada, leading to his (Peter's)sudden departure, leaving behind a note for Edith that is deliberately ambiguous as to his identity.

    So, they would've known each other years before the Titanic.

  20. #540

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    Quote Originally Posted by Civic View Post
    By the same token, Sir Richard had plenty of opportunity to notice that Lady Mary is spirited and knows her own mind. She doesn't do slavish devotion. Her husband will have to *earn* her respect and loyalty. IMO, they both need to consider if they're well suited to one another.
    I think Sir Richard would rather Mary fear him than respect him, and she does. He knows about the Pamuk incident. Mary was willing to give up Matthew for money and status, she certainly won't cross Sir Richard and risk social/financial ruin. Plus Mary desperately needs to get married - she doesn't have any money of her own - and Sir Richard is her only prospect. She isn't getting any younger and the times are getting harder.

    Her other problem is that even if Matthew inherits, and she can manage to get free of Sir Richard, she doesn't know what Matthew will say when he finds out about Pamuk. The fact that she didn't tell him the first time he proposed only makes it worse.

    Has anyone considered that Sir Richard might be behind Patrick's sudden disappearance? It was apparently news to Sir Richard when Edith said that Mary had been engaged to Patrick, and not welcome news.
    Last edited by aliceanne; 02-08-2012 at 08:28 PM.

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