View Poll Results: Which US ladies will make the World Team?

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  • Mirai Nagasu

    206 86.92%
  • Rachael Flatt

    140 59.07%
  • Christina Gao

    11 4.64%
  • Agnes Zawadzki

    8 3.38%
  • Alissa Czisny

    105 44.30%
  • Ashley Wagner

    39 16.46%
  • Amanda Dobbs

    2 0.84%
  • Vanessa Lam

    3 1.27%
  • Samantha Cesario

    3 1.27%
  • Other

    3 1.27%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by oleada View Post
    Ashley is a really nice spinner, actually. Her layback is gorgeous.

    It's not just the spins, anyway, but I doubt you'll get that.
    She's ok, nothing compared to Mirai or Alissa though. Spins really don't matter much in terms of scoring though, as long as you can get the levels, that's pretty much all you need.

    I know it's not just about spins, but if judges at nationals were willing to give the title to a 14 year old baby ballerina Mirai who looked like she was 10 and had very cutesy juniorish programs, then I don't know why people think it would be so crazy if Christina, who is almost 17, won the US title this season. Err, what?

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by icellist View Post
    I'm actually really surprised that everyone is so gun-ho for Mirai. I love her and I'm so glad people are noticing her more to.
    The thing about Mirai is that the technique is there. She may have a new body, be injured, or be out of shape, but she skates on edges with good speed and turns and has excellent carriage while skating and jumping, including always having her shoulders aligned with her hips while balanced over her blades. She does get edge calls SOMETIMES, but they range from "none" to ! to e and none of her jumps are from wild swinging edges, which means that everything is correctable.

    . . . I will add, since this is the US ladies thread, not the Mirai thread, that there are times when Mirai's technical errors can be attributed to sloppiness or laziness, but Rachel is generally technically on all the time. I say this so that no one thinks that I think Mirai is the end all be all of technique when she is not.
    Last edited by bardtoob; 12-01-2010 at 02:39 AM.

  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    I wouldn't say Ashley or Rachael have better spins than Christina at this point
    (Emphasis mine).

    You are blind. Or joking. Or both. But this is the most ridiculous thing I've read on here today. Christina is a fine jumper, one of the best in the U.S., but her spins are nothing special and do not match up to any of the following: Nagasu, Czisny, Wagner, Zawadzki. Heck, even Dobbs, Zhang and Cesario have better spins. And Gong.

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    I know it's not just about spins, but if judges at nationals were willing to give the title to a 14 year old baby ballerina Mirai who looked like she was 10 and had very cutesy juniorish programs, then I don't know why people think it would be so crazy if Christina, who is almost 17, won the US title this season. Err, what?
    Cutesy, yes. Juniorish, not really. She was fantastic, regardless of how old she looked. I don't think posters are saying it would be crazy if Gao won. I certainly don't think its impossible. She's just facing a bit of a tougher field than when Mirai won in 2008.

  5. #45

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    BTW, regarding Rachel, there is subtly to Rachel's skating that is often missed. For example, in her LP at Skate America, few noticed that she did a counterrotated Camel to Catchfoot Camel in her combo spin at the end, which is not something that is often seen with a skater that is only about jumps.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    Some of her spins are not great but others are perfectly adequate...
    Ahh, perfectly adequate. That's how I want to be described in life.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by chipso1 View Post
    (Emphasis mine).

    You are blind. Or joking. Or both. But this is the most ridiculous thing I've read on here today. Christina is a fine jumper, one of the best in the U.S., but her spins are nothing special and do not match up to any of the following: Nagasu, Czisny, Wagner, Zawadzki. Heck, even Dobbs, Zhang and Cesario have better spins. And Gong.
    They are on-par if not better than Flatt's though, and Flatt just won the US title with the highest score ever, so I think that is proof that spins don't matter that much.

    Oh and Zhang with her tiny jumps, no speed, bad technique, and poor basics got on the podium at US nationals twice, as a 14 and 15 year old. And also how do you consider the field in 2008 weak, Mirai was up against a former World Champion, the reigning Junior World Champion, Alissa, Bebe, and then Rachael and Ashley who had very successful runs on the junior level. In a way the field was very similar to this year, lots of talented skaters, but wide open at the same time. Come nationals, Rachael may still be injured, Ashley, Mirai, and Alissa could bomb like they have in the past, and it might end up being Gao, Zawadzki, Siraj and Lam on the podium.

    Also there may be something to be said about the USFSA wanting the next generation to start taking over. I mean Alissa is a really nice skater, but she's been around for forever, and is not the future of the sport, she'll likely be retired before Sochi. There are some really talented young skaters coming up and could be real contenders for medals at Sochi, Mirai is young and can be included in this group, but Ashley and Rachael have also been on the senior level for a while now and have yet to have a big breakthrough. I mean look at Mirai last season, coming in 4th at Worlds and then leading after the SP at Worlds, it really got her on the map as one to watch, established herself as the top US lady and an international contender. I'd just hate to see the judges hold back some of these young skaters like Gao, Zawadzki, etc back if they really skate well at nationals, because if they do get the chance to go, there's a chance they could do really well and gain a good international reputation. Flatt, Czisny, Wagner already have reputations and one trip to worlds likely won't change them - Alissa as talented but inconsistent, Rachael as consistent but lacking in star quality, Ashley as a complete skater who too often performs messily.
    Last edited by pinky166; 12-01-2010 at 03:53 AM.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    They are on-par if not better than Flatt's though, and Flatt just won the US title with the highest score ever, so I think that is proof that spins don't matter that much.

    Oh and Zhang with her tiny jumps, no speed, bad technique, and poor basics got on the podium at US nationals twice, as a 14 and 15 year old. And also how do you consider the field in 2008 weak, Mirai was up against a former World Champion, the reigning Junior World Champion, Alissa, Bebe, and then Rachael and Ashley who had very successful runs on the junior level. In a way the field was very similar to this year, lots of talented skaters, but wide open at the same time. Come nationals, Rachael may still be injured, Ashley, Mirai, and Alissa could bomb like they have in the past, and it might end up being Gao, Zawadzki, Siraj and Lam on the podium.

    Also there may be something to be said about the USFSA wanting the next generation to start taking over. I mean Alissa is a really nice skater, but she's been around for forever, and is not the future of the sport, she'll likely be retired before Sochi. There are some really talented young skaters coming up and could be real contenders for medals at Sochi, Mirai is young and can be included in this group, but Ashley and Rachael have also been on the senior level for a while now and have yet to have a big breakthrough. I mean look at Mirai last season, coming in 4th at Worlds and then leading after the SP at Worlds, it really got her on the map as one to watch, established herself as the top US lady and an international contender. I'd just hate to see the judges hold back some of these young skaters like Gao, Zawadzki, etc back if they really skate well at nationals, because if they do get the chance to go, there's a chance they could do really well and gain a good international reputation. Flatt, Czisny, Wagner already have reputations and one trip to worlds likely won't change them - Alissa as talented but inconsistent, Rachael as consistent but lacking in star quality, Ashley as a complete skater who too often performs messily.
    Czisny is definitely not going to retire before Sochi. If she does, it's going to at least be right after 2014.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by smarts1 View Post
    Czisny is definitely not going to retire before Sochi. If she does, it's going to at least be right after 2014.
    Do you know this for sure? Let's face it, she's not going to make the team in Sochi when she's 26, that just doesn't happen in the US. She had a great opportunity to make the Olympic team twice and has blown it both times. Sticking around for 4 more years just to see her not make the team again would be painful, IMO. To me it sounded like she was just taking things one year at a time and didn't want to retire after such a disappointing season last year. This season has been good so far so I wouldn't be surprised if it was her last season, especially if she medals at nationals and/or goes to Worlds and does well there. If Alissa sticks around until Sochi, she'll just become the next Fumie - a great skater who's past her prime and who's best days are behind her.

  10. #50
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    for me the running ladies, are
    rachel, alissa, christina gao, mirai, ashley, agnes, those first
    than maybe vanessa lam and yasmin siraj and maybe kiri baga.

    but of the above mentioned
    i kinda of would like,
    eithier rachel/alissa
    alissa/christina
    rachel/christina
    christina/mirai
    christina/ashley
    my ons on bet would be rachel/alissa-but both would have to skate well at nationals.
    rachel-probably will do it. alissa, i hope will if not than it would be christina, ashley, mirai.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    If Alissa sticks around until Sochi, she'll just become the next Fumie - a great skater who's past her prime and who's best days are behind her.
    Alissa will never become the next Fumie. Fumie is one of a kind ;-)

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    Alissa will never become the next Fumie. Fumie is one of a kind ;-)
    You know what I meant though. It's sort of embarrassing watching Fumie skate now because she's such a shadow of her former great self. I don't get why she didn't try and end her career on a high note as she had many great results in the past.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    You know what I meant though. It's sort of embarrassing watching Fumie skate now because she's such a shadow of her former great self. I don't get why she didn't try and end her career on a high note as she had many great results in the past.
    Well, what I am upset is that her choreography and performance, not to mention other things like spins and transitions, are very lacking in her LP this season. She is not living up to her own artistic potential. I would make the same criticisms if she brought this type of lackluster skating to exhibitions.
    Last edited by krenseby; 12-01-2010 at 11:23 PM. Reason: Added a sentence.

  14. #54
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    I can't see Rachael not making it. I picked Mirai too because I think by Nationals her injury will be better and she'll be skating better than Alissa. I don't think she's a total lock though. It COULD be Alissa if she keeps skating well. Of course, others might step it up later on too, like Agnes or Ashley. It just looks like, at this point, it will be Rachael and either Mirai/Alissa, more likely Mirai.

  15. #55
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    I love Cesario, but I doubt she has a legitimate chance.

    I picked Flatt and Nagasu. Wagner and Czisny are also in there. Gao and Zawadzki will be somewhere in the top 6. The rest should comfortably be in the top 10.

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    If Alissa sticks around until Sochi, she'll just become the next Fumie - a great skater who's past her prime and who's best days are behind her.
    You predict that Alissa will win 5 National Titles over 10 years, 3 World Medals, 3 Four Continent Championships, a GPF Championship, and place in the top 6 at two Olympics.

    In that case, I think Alissa should stay in.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    She's ok, nothing compared to Mirai or Alissa though. Spins really don't matter much in terms of scoring though, as long as you can get the levels, that's pretty much all you need.

    I know it's not just about spins, but if judges at nationals were willing to give the title to a 14 year old baby ballerina Mirai who looked like she was 10 and had very cutesy juniorish programs, then I don't know why people think it would be so crazy if Christina, who is almost 17, won the US title this season. Err, what?
    The field is alot stronger than 2008. And Christina to me looks similar to Nagasu of 2008 but just with much weaker spins and more consistent jumps.

    Nagasu also never should have won in 2008. Wagner should have won and Flatt should have been 2nd.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by bardtoob View Post
    You predict that Alissa will win 5 National Titles over 10 years, 3 World Medals, 3 Four Continent Championships, a GPF Championship, and place in the top 6 at two Olympics.

    In that case, I think Alissa should stay in.
    How many of those achievements from Fumie are in the last 4 and a half years since after the 2006 Worlds (the exact point she should have retired from amateur and enjoyed a well earned lucrative pro career, or gone into something else). Fumie in fact achieved all of those impressive things you mentioned over a 5-6 year span since her biggest achievement in the last almost 4.5 years are a Japanese Nationals silver, two Skate Canada silvers, and a 8th place finish at her only Worlds appearance in that span.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    The field is alot stronger than 2008. And Christina to me looks similar to Nagasu of 2008 but just with much weaker spins and more consistent jumps.
    Nagasu of 2008 was more polished than nowdays Christina and had much better skating skills. I don't think Gao has a chance this year, other girls are better skaters than she is

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    if judges at nationals were willing to give the title to a 14 year old baby ballerina Mirai who looked like she was 10 and had very cutesy juniorish programs, then I don't know why people think it would be so crazy if Christina, who is almost 17, won the US title this season. Err, what?
    In 2008 a girl without any senior international experince hadn't go to Worlds to get three spots for the US back. Mirai was not age eligible.
    My thoughts.

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