Huh. Here I always thought Kwan v Slutskaya was one of the great rivalries. On any given night, either could of won. I always thought they were equally good in their own way.
But L&A didn't skate to jive, which was a 40's dance. They skated to 1950's rock, with the exception of the embarrasing Surfin' Bird song by the Trashmen that they opened with, which was from 1963. And they skated it in Dayglo chartreuse costumes.
Yeah, everyone knows what "the bird" is-it's the NY state bird
And in DC, many people thought they had the dance entirely wrong, plus the costumes were way embarrassing. Not to mention wondering what they were trying to say by skating to The Bird.
There were 30 leven cuts in their FD, none of them, none of which had any coherent relationship to any other.
And there were mistakes in the lifts, AFAIR.
So the applause was polite, but not great.
It was indeed worse that B&A had skated a coherent, credible 50's rock program to Elvis prior to L&A taking the ice.
But it was also worse that the whole program was skewed so that Ilia was facing the judges, in an attempt to distract attention from Irina (injury and all). She, therefore, was facing most of the crowd, because the whole section above the judges was cordoned off, because of the US just starting the Iraq war and worries about different sorts of violence possibly breaking out. So the most of the crowd saw very little of Ilia's entertaining mugging, and saw a lot of Irina's bad knee.
Dorispulaski, your beautiful description made me want to re-watch their FD and man talk about awkward.
Their FD was worse than I remember, but that crowd reaction just made the whole thing even more uncomfortable to sit through. Everything just fell flat (and for good reason).
"Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce
I agree with one of the previous posters that it was very bad year for ice dance and nobody particularly deserved to win.
The piece is seventy-five minutes long...[l]ong enough for an idea to be developed, but not so long that one starts to measure the number of seats to the exits with desperation if the thing doesn’t work" -- Marina Harss
Out of all the times they competed, how many wins did each have?
1996 Centennial on Ice
2000 Skate Canada
2001 Goodwill Games
2001 Skate Canada
2002 Winter Olympics
Short program leads at 2000 and 2001 Worlds might as well be mentioned. I don't know how many times Kwan finished ahead of Slutskaya.
Excluding cheesefests which I dont keep track of the head to head matchups I can think of between Kwan and Slutskaya:
1994 Junior Worlds- Kwan
1995 Worlds- Kwan
1995 Skate America- Kwan
1996 Centennial on Ice- Slutskaya
1996 Grand Prix final- Kwan
1996 Worlds- Kwan
1997 Grand Prix final- Kwan
1997 Worlds- Kwan
1998 Olympics- Kwan
1998 Worlds- Kwan
1998 Goodwill Games- Kwan
2000 Grand Prix final- Slutskaya
2000 Worlds- Kwan
2000 Skate Canada- Slutskaya
2001 Grand Prix final- Slutskaya
2001 Worlds- Kwan
2001 Goodwill Games- Slutskaya
2001 Skate Canada- Slutskaya
01-02 Grand Prix final- Slutskaya
2002 Olympics- Slutskaya
2002 Worlds- Slutskaya
2004 Worlds- Kwan
2005 Worlds- Slutskaya
I am sure I am forgetting something along the way but based on the non cheesefests I remember it would be 13-10 Kwan. I would say that is definitely a rivalry. Especialy since Irina in fact won most of their meetings from 2000 onwards when she became a gold threat which is how she overcame an early 10-1 deficit to make it close in the end.
If Irina had won the 2006 Olympics and 2006 Worlds there would be a real argument for Irina being the most successful skater of this era over Kwan (I didnt say neccessarily the best which can be different than the most successful of course, and I for one much prefer Kwan's skating to Irina's). If she had even won 1 of the 2000 or 2001 Worlds she was favored to it would even be very close between the two overall.
Another funny thing is 3 times in Irina's career she entered her final free skate as the whole difference maker to the entire event. 97 Worlds the scenario was if she was 1st in the free skate she would win silver, Tara would win gold even with only 3rd in the long, and Kwan would drop to bronze. If she were 3rd in the free skate like she was she would not medal, Tara would hang onto gold, and Kwan silver even with winning the long. And if she were 2nd in the free skate she would win bronze, Kwan would pass Tara for gold, and Tara would win silver. And of course at the 2000 Worlds and 2002 Olympics the winner could have been either here, the leader at that point, or the leader in the free skate depending how she fared and was placed.
[QUOTE=judgejudy27;2848389]Excluding cheesefests which I dont keep track of the head to head matchups I can think of between Kwan and Slutskaya:
2003 Worlds for Kwan as well.2004 Worlds- Kwan
2005 Worlds- Slutskaya
IIRC, the deal in place was supposed to help B&K. Both Jean Senft and Yuri Balkov were caught/suspended for negotiating in favor of them winning the bronze. Once they
watered down their OD from GPF that season and had mistakes in their first CD, it wasn't going to happen for them even if they beat A&P in the FD (which they did). Jean Senft gave them a ridiculously high ordinal in the FD, while giving A&P a ridiculously low one, in order to try and still give B&K the bronze. She was cited for personal/national bias, and then became a "whistleblower" on Balkov when she didn't get her own way.
I will never understand how she was made into such a martyr.
Last edited by escaflowne9282; 08-20-2010 at 07:38 AM.
So what? After the 1993 world championships, six of the nine judges were suspended for scoring based on dancers' reputations rather than how they performed in the competition. All six came back to judging. Three of them made it to Lillehammer to judge at the 1994 Winter Games. To play dirty is not a news in FS. I know you like to pretend none of this stuff ever happened but it did. Everyone but you seems to know about it. Nowdays, with the current judging system it is easier than ever to cheat- a judge is never caught and therefore cannot be suspended. Safe play.The deal was the subject of an ISU investigation in 1998. Two judges were suspended.
Probably because unlike Balkov she did not make an Olympic comeback. So, she is a "martyr".I will never understand how she was made into such a martyr.
The deal was to keep B&K from medalling at all by placing them 5th in the CD.
Senft wasn't back judging at the Olympics because Dave Dore refused to send her to another international event after her suspension. She was reduced to judging Canadian Sectionals. After Dore became the VP of the ISU, his successors did send her to international events but only on a limited basis.