I think at some point in the 1980s they did make a decision to explicitly consider toe loop and toe walley the same for purposes of that rule. But that may have been later than 1983, which was the first year of the rule.
The toe-loop and toe-walley became one jump, because the majority of skaters during the 80s that were supposedly doing toe-wally were really taking off from an outside edge.
A ccw skater normally enters a toe-walley from a left forward outside 3, switch skating leg so that the right leg is now the skating leg and is on an inside edge, and the left leg pick behind to vault into the jump. However, if you look closely at the skating leg after the leg switch, 99.9% ofthe skater remained on an oustide edge. I have to take a look at Elaine's toe-walley in slow motion to make sure, but I don't think she ever did a true toe-walley.
Last edited by bardtoob; 08-05-2010 at 08:40 AM.
One thing that does strike me is how pro Sumners that Peggy Fleming is. I think Fleming was devastated when Sumners didnt win the Olympic Gold in 84. Fleming is so cold to Elaine. The way she talked about her in her book was horrible.
I would need to see the scores of the LP to see if they were fair. I would probably have scored them like this though:
Zayak- technical 5.8, artistic 5.7
Sumners- technical 5.7, artistic 5.9
I would have put Sumners ahead in the LP but it is close.
Elaine could have easily skated Roz's program. No way could Roz have skated Elaine's. Other than a hand down on a triple salchow, Elaine skated flawlessly, with much more difficulty. I think there should have been way more than one-tenth of a point difference in their technical scores, with the nod going to Elaine.
At the top, in the URL, she added #t=4m17s.
Getting back to Elaine, I have to wonder if Roz could have made the comeback at Nationals in '94 that Elaine did. Sure, Roz had done alot of pro skating by then, but Roz came back from being completely out of shape to challenge Harding and Kwan. I was really inspired by that. Off to read the articles at the start of this thread now!
That is an interesting point and I don't know what jumps Sumners was doing as a pro so unless she was the rare skater who did harder jumps as a pro than as an amateur I doubt that she could do what Zayak did because she was years ahead of the other women!
I seriously doubt that Sumners could have done what Zayak did - the most difficult jump that Sumners had done in years was the double axel and her basic skating skills weren't what they once were either. Plus, even at her peak, Sumners didn't have the technical content that Zayak did.
I liked Sumners as an amateur skater, but I didn't enjoy many of her pro numbers. I've been watching lots of skating from 94-97 as I've been converting it to DVD and the thing that strikes me about Roz is how jerky and awkward her skating was during those years. And her "flirtatious" numbers were just annoying. That said, I should disclose that I might just be so irritated by her commentary (having just watched 96 World Pros) that it has coloured my perception of her skating.
I remember reading in International Figure Skating magazine that around 95-96, Sumners was working on getting her triple toe loop back. She looked really fit and toned back then, IIRC.
I remember watching my first World Pro competition in 1988 - 1)Denise Biellmann, 2) Debi Thomas, 3) Roz Sumners, 4) Dorothy Hamill
Dorothy just came off her pregnancy, skated to Whitney Houston with some doubles nand axels, got some 9.6s-9.8s, and said she expected 1s. Debi Thomas was trying very hard to have more artistic programs. Denise Biellmann was freakin' incredible - it was the first time I saw her skate, and she was so, so, so exciting (speaking of the Zayak-Sumners era).
I remember, having taped it, never ever being able to sit through Roz Sumner's program. It was a French showgirl number, and I do think she had a 2ax, but I remember always being so incredible bored. I wonder if I'd feel the same now.