yes it has been confirmed as hers.
RD, it is monitored by others but it is hers
I don't know if Oksana ever said anything about Nancy.I seriously doubt she did. But I think it is kind of a different situation because Tara was directly asked about Michelle and could not think of any thing to say, at least according to articles in the press. Michelle was then asked about Tara and said "I like you Tara". I actually wish there was a video of this press conference to see how it all went down. I mean there are so many thing she could have said without gushing...like "I knew she skated great and had high scores and I knew I needed to to my best to win" or something like that. She did not have to go on and on about how great Michelle was.That impression is entirely subjective, and it's not one I ever heard at that time. Nobody knows whether Tara was purposely "refusing" to show acknowledgment of Michelle. Perhaps she thought she was doing all that was appropriate. Or maybe her mother advised her not to mention Michelle at all because the media might twist her words. And let's take another OGM--Oksana Baiul, for instance. Nancy was kind of a "sacred cow" in early 1994. After Oksana's victory, did she just gush about what a wonderful champion Nancy was and how unfortunate it was that she only got the silver? I honestly don't remember. But IMO the "back story" thing is irrelevant. IOW, I don't buy the argument that as long as you have a back story, any behavior is fine, but if you don't, then being anything less than total perfection is reprehensible.
tara's official website says she doesn't have a facebook or myspace.
I again ask, why does Tara have to acknowledge Kwan? Did people feel like if she said Kwan skated great it would somehow make up for her "stealing" the Olympic Gold away from Kwan? Why did Tara need to validate how great Kwan skated? Furthermore, did Kwan ever say anything about how great Tara's skating was after she was beat by her at the Olympics? All I remember her saying was she needed to improve her technical content. No word about Tara having an amazing skate.I mean there are so many thing she could have said without gushing...like "I knew she skated great and had high scores and I knew I needed to to my best to win" or something like that. She did not have to go on and on about how great Michelle was.
Last edited by Enero; 08-15-2010 at 06:19 AM.
But I believe the question she was asked was what she thought of Michelle, not what she thought of Michelle's performance, which is why her answer was considered canned and evasive, and Michelle's "I like you, Tara" was considered so gracious and classy.
Also note that Michelle DID say that Tara skated the best of the night and apparently complimented Tara's performance.
As someone said earlier, two minutes max on Google.
Both girls were, in different ways, model competitors and they were quite civil to one another, if not best friends. Only in skating would people be arguing over whether this was "bad" behavior or not.
They're, their, and there. Get it right your in college.
No offense, but Michelle is not even in the same league as a Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods (pre-scandal). No matter how beloved she is in the skating community she did not/does not have the kind branding and popularity that MJ and TW have/had in their respective sports and the general public.
Last edited by Enero; 08-15-2010 at 06:41 AM.
I think the poster meant that MK was for many years the face of figure skating, at least in the U.S., comparable to how Tiger Woods and Roger Federer are the faces of their respective sports.
Youtube has a compilation of ladies 3-3 jumps. Not all of the jumps are labeled correctly because it looked to me like Kristi did a 3Flip-3Toe not a 3Lutz-3Toe but I'm not sure. Was Kristi a flutzer?
Definitely most of the 3Toe-3Toes belong to Midori and Michelle, although Surya did one in Nagano.
Christine Brennan described it as Tara being caught off guard by the question and not really being able to answer. She seemed to pick up on the catty subtext of the question, but was not get herself together fast enough to come up with a safe answer. That was a great moment for Michelle though.But I believe the question she was asked was what she thought of Michelle, not what she thought of Michelle's performance, which is why her answer was considered canned and evasive, and Michelle's "I like you, Tara" was considered so gracious and classy.
When asked at a post-Olympics press conference what she thought of Michelle's performance, Tara said it was great because that's the answer she was supposed to give, but she hadn't actually seen it.
You mess with the bull, you get the horns; words to live by, to my mind. - Robeye
michelle was the michael jordan of her sport and in 2003 in spite of her loss at salt lake (or perhaps even due to public sympathy in light of it) she was declared by many news outlets as the most popular female athlete in the country, not to mention in polls
you have to consider that for one thing, female athletes get nowhere near the amount of public support, endorsements or branding that male athletes do. only rarely do you have phenoms so widely known as serena
Last edited by iarispiralllyof; 08-15-2010 at 08:03 AM.
of course in most sports where the olympics are the crowning achievement the athletes tend to experience their ten minutes of fame during the olympics and quickly fade soon after, but that michelle participated in so many olympics and was presented by the media as an american sweetheart figure each time meant the american public has a much stronger memory of her. I didn't even get into skating until this past year and amongst my friends and colleagues, if they could list a skater (usually only a handful) michelle was always on the list. and I remember being in elementary school in 1998 after the olympics my female classmates and female teachers all seemed to express a kind of annoyance at tara and preference for michelle (I'm not claiming this was the majority of people, but it surely seemed like a trend) and again in 2002 a lot of female classmates who surely were not skating enthusiasts talked about how sad it was that she lost.
skating will never have the broad appeal that basketball, football or tennis have in US. but michelle does have a solid place in 90's and 2000's pop culture. I even remember michelle's loss being enthusiastically discussed on a freaking hip hop radio station back in 2002 after the olympics. ppl might not care except once every 4 years, but during that one time every 4 years, the american public embraced michelle, for sure
Last edited by iarispiralllyof; 08-15-2010 at 08:32 AM.
Of course, I don't have any empirical evidence to definitively support this claim; all I can do is speak from personal observation and experience. But I knew many skating layman back in the day who couldn't tell a lutz from a twizzle, but they were unanimous in their love for Michelle and their active dislike for Tara. And if I had to sum up their collective impressions of her, it boiled down to the fact that they saw her as a spoiled brat.
But maybe we had very different experiences at the time. Given my experiences with those layman people, however, and seeing how much their impressions of Tara mirrored those in the insular community of hardcore skating fans, gave me the impression there was an underlying consensus across the board on how she was being perceived.
But you're right, it's a subjective assessment, so it could easily be an overstatement.
I think that's a fair point. I don't think I ever said Tara is to blame for the lukewarm reception she received in skating. I think my initial assertion from the beginning was that her team mishandled the way she was packaged and marketed to the skating public and, had they made better choices, her popularity with the press and fans could've been a lot higher and longer-lasting. She was only a 15 year old kid, so I hardly expected her to be aware of and negotiate all those variables.Maybe Tara had no idea that she was perceived that way by many, at least not until she got older. Regardless, it doesn't mean any of it was her fault specifically.
I wasn't referring to Tara specifically, but to her team. I was disagreeing with your assertion that Tara's public persona wasn't oppositional, and listed ways in which I thought that perception came to be formed and internalized by fans. And unfortunately the actions of her mother played a big role in that--maybe even the biggest role. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that point.When exactly did Tara do that, and what specifically did she say? (I'm referring to Tara, not her mother.)
Well, it's hard not to assume it wasn't purposeful when she was asked point-blank what she thought of Michelle, and had nothing to say. She might've had a plethora of justifiable reasons to do so, but all that matters is how that action is perceived.Nobody knows whether Tara was purposely "refusing" to show acknowledgment of Michelle.
You're trying to rationalize Tara's thought process, and I'm saying that's beside the point. These perceptions rise and fall and stick for the most nonsensical reasons sometimes, which is why Kwan played it safe and gave, not just a respectful acknowledgement, but a seemingly heartfelt admission.
She could've been lying through her teeth when she said, "I like you, Tara," but the next day the media hailed her as classy and gracious, elevating her appeal even higher, and skating forums roared over the perceived slight by Tara.
I couldn't disagree more on backstory being irrelevant, and ironically you cite the one person who IMO benefitted the most from having a compelling backstory. In fact, I'd argue Oksana owes her world and olympic titles almost exclusively to her Cinderella backstory--but I digress.But IMO the "back story" thing is irrelevant. IOW, I don't buy the argument that as long as you have a back story, any behavior is fine, but if you don't, then being anything less than total perfection is reprehensible.
And I said many times that there are several combination of factors that born these narratives. Having a great backstory doesn't automatically guarantee you anything, but it can compensate for a lot when other aspects of the whole picture are lacking in some way, in the same way a seemingly humble disposition can compensate a lot when someone doesn't necessarily have an easily relatable backstory.
It isn't an "either/or" thing. Each situation is different for each athlete, with its own set of unique circumstances, which can (and do) widely vary from sport to sport. Like ArtisticFan said, you work with what you have, and considering the circumstances Tara faced--being a figure skater, being in direct competition with an already established star, not having an easily marketable backstory, etc.--it would've helped her public image a great deal if she had played up the humble card. Did she have to? No, but there were consequences for doing so, given the circumstances of the situation.
Yes, that's what I meant. Thought I made it clear, but I guess not.(Now, I could accept the argument that her "team" (i.e., mainly her mother) set her up as being oppositional.)
Nope. Again, I'm asserting her team let her down. Sorry I didn't really read your analogy (it's late here) but rest assured, I'm not blaming Tara.I agree with that point, and please correct me if I'm misunderstanding you, but the implication of your argument seems to be, "Tara is directly responsible for all the dislike she received because she didn't do enough to head it off."
Kwan did it and that "I like you" comment is still remembered to this day.
It isn't rocket science. You catch more flies with honey, no?
What about Tara in '97? Her combo certainly helped.Originally Posted by UGG
Well, if people start posting cookie recipes in this thread, then we'll know things have gone completely overboard.Originally Posted by Carolla5501
I think many Kwan fans pick Tara apart for every little thing she did and didn't do simply because she beat their favorite. I mean seriously Tara didn't say "I like you" about Kwan so now she is not being humble? Come on people. Tara was never going to win any points with some simply because she upset the universe by beating Kwan for the Olympic Gold.