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  1. #81
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    This "uplifting" thing is really crazy. On the one hand I'd love never seeing another girl done up in a straight jacket and skating to psycho music (I can't recall the names, but one of the French dance teams a couple of years ago) or Dracula routines, but does that also rule out poignant music like "Schindler's List"? There are some beautiful, sad, sombre routines through the years that I wonder would be penalized now. Heck, operas (both storyline and music) generally are tragic (Turandot, Tosca, etc.), are they going to be banned? It's ridiculous.

    -Bridget

  2. #82

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    The ink is hardly dry and already they need a clarification communication

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    The ink is hardly dry and already they need a clarification communication
    Says a lot, doesn't it.

  4. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by dinakt View Post
    No druggies, no voidy clocks that indicate we all die... no 9/11 programs, no Romeo and Juliettes, no giant crosses on the chests, mea culpa, mea culpa...
    ...depressed now.
    Not at all~!
    Druggie program - to the soundtrack of Hair - program ends while the characters are still high - definitley uplifting and just choose a drug to be high on that most people have a basic knowledge of

    9/11 program from the perspective of the terrorists. The event was a success for them and therefore the story is uplifting!

    Romeo and Juliet - just change the ending.


    crosses on chests - to super uplifting gospel music.

    All of these easy to understand and uplifting!~ No worries

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by Asli View Post
    That's the way to do it. However, in order for this evaluation to be fair, members of the audience should not be allowed to speak to each other or compare notes.
    Or, we can have those remote control thingamagigs that has directions of push the red button if you understood the program and push blue if wasn't perky enough.

  6. #86

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    I would like advice from the ISU on which of the following programs should incur the 3 point music penalty (the year is approximate and from memory):

    2010
    V&M Mahler
    D&W Phantom
    DomShabs - Throw me with bands
    Capellini/Lanotte Requiem for a Dream
    P&B - Time/(Requiem)
    I&K - Schindler's List
    Zaretskis - Schindler's List

    2009 D&W Samson & Delilah
    Domshabs Spartacus

    2008 V&M Umbrellas of Cherbourg
    D&W Eleanor Rigby
    P&B Madness
    K&N Night on Bald Mountain

    2007 Denkova & Staviyski Seven Deadly Sins
    DelSchoes Bonnie & Clyde
    D&L Somewhere in Time

    2006 N&K Carmen
    DelSchoes Masks/Venice

    2005 Grushina/Goncharov Escape from Hanging

    2002 A&P Liberty
    L&A 911/Turn, Turn, Turn
    B&A Sarajevo

    1998 G&P Memorial
    A&P Romeo & Juliet
    K&O Carmen

    1990/1991 Duchesnays Missing I & II

    I don't remember the year
    FP/M Dracula


    Add any others you'd like to know about? Then we can submit it.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    I would like advice from the ISU on which of the following programs should incur the 3 point music penalty (the year is approximate and from memory):
    This is such BS. The ISU never cared about whether or not the fans liked something. This is just one more ambiguous rule that they will use, when they feel like it, to hold a team back.

  8. #88

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    Yes, cruisin, I completely agree with you. And "uplifting" is such an ill-defined term that it's hard to know what programs it wouldn't apply to.

    Would dancing to Bugs Bunny Loony Toons be 'uplifting'?

    Is the Charleston done as Betty Boop uplifting?

    I have no clue.

    That's why I would like to see the ISU apply their rule to well known programs and say which are appropriately "uplifting".

  9. #89
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    Its the music, not the actual programme, that must have the "uplifting" effect, though. How on earth does one define whether or not a piece of music is uplifting?

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by DORISPULASKI View Post
    Yes, cruisin, I completely agree with you. And "uplifting" is such an ill-defined term that it's hard to know what programs it wouldn't apply to.

    Would dancing to Bugs Bunny Loony Toons be 'uplifting'?
    No, that can't be up lifting, Elmer Fud would bring it down, he carries a gun and hunt's wabbits. Dead bunnies are never up lifting . It also could be seen as making fun of someone with a speech impediment, no up lifting there .

    Is the Charleston done as Betty Boop uplifting?
    Nah, Betty Boop would be a terrible role model for a woman of today, not uplifting for women. Or some crazed religious right person might see Betty as a floozie . Can't win, I'm afraid

    I have no clue.
    That's the whole point, they don't want you too. And they don't want the athletes or coaches to either. It will change on a whim.
    Last edited by cruisin; 05-09-2010 at 01:11 AM.

  11. #91
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    As we all know, non-uplifting themes don't create good dances:

    1. couple both die at end (Bolero, Torvill and Dean)
    2. Fickle woman cheats on man she stole from nice, upstanding girl and gets killed for it (Carmen, Krylova and Ov.)
    3. Married couple have a conflict (at least this is how I understood it) (Masquerade Waltz, Krylova & Ov.)
    4. Sweet young people kill themselves (Romeo & Juliet, 8000 dance teams)
    5. Woman appears to be sacrificed in a prehistoric drama (Savage Rites, the Duschenays)
    6. Couple engage in a bacchanal, horrors (Bacchanal from (?) Spartacus??, Davis & White)
    etc etc

  12. #92
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    For some reason I keep picturing in my mind that we'll see a lot of circus-themed routines or clowns next season

    Or maybe everyone will play it safe and not do theme-based programs, but rather skate to pretty music.

    Or maybe they'll skate to whatever music they like and just grin and smile through the whole damn thing.

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by nalgene View Post
    Or maybe they'll skate to whatever music they like and just grin and smile through the whole damn thing.
    That's what they should do!

  14. #94

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    Who decides what is uplifting?
    Cinquanta?

    By applying this rule, they are trying to push Ice Dance back in time to what it was before Torvill and Dean, Klimova and Ponomarenko, and so many others (most listed in Doris' long post above) raised it out of obscurity.

    Do the last thirty years of the discipline count for nothing?
    In one stroke, the lifework of many of the greats of the sport has been cheapened and belittled.

    Shame on whoever made this decision.
    Thank heaven for video!

  15. #95
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    Everyone will skate to Wind Beneath My Wings and You Raise Me Up. Then they will make them compulsories, then they will bring compulsories back because there are only two pieces of music allowed. Then Ice Dancing will disappear from the sport. Nothing "Up Lifting" about that.

  16. #96
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    Could they possibly have come up with more subjective, impossible to judge wacky crazy "rules"?

    I just don't understand it. Are they going to hand the audience little clickers to vote on whether it was uplifting?

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRidge View Post

    Personally I don't have a problem with smacking down the bullshit idea that "angsty" is somehow creative or voidy or art in and of itself anyway.
    Okay, I'm agreeing with BlueRidge on too many threads lately....when is the off season over?

    Possibly they would like to appeal to the average viewers and/or singles/pairs fans, who tend to react to the flinging and dying and attempts to portray the dark plight of the doomed and damned as "Wow. So am I supposed to go slit my wrists now? How is this a sport?" Maybe even they started sending the memo with V/M's soft, lyrical, generally non-angsty FD beating out the theatrically DRAMATIC! PotO from D/W, and BOTH beating...whatever the heck that was DomShabs were doing.

    Even in ballet, art doesn't have to mean dark and angsty. Ballanchine didn't just do Apollo or Agon--he could also do Stars and Stripes or a 'princess' piece like Diamonds or even make a new Nutcracker. Maybe they're thinking that the trend has been skewing too much towards the blood/death/depression/utterly incomprehensible for long enough and it needs to be kicked back in the general direction of joy and hope.

    And also away from Cirque du Soleil on Ice with the DomShabs rule, though they were about six months late with that.

  18. #98
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    Perhaps they should have added a bonus for "uplifting music" instead of making it mandatory.

  19. #99
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    Oh, crap, they're trying to turn Ice Dance into Stars on Ice
    Last edited by kwanfan1818; 05-09-2010 at 02:17 AM.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  20. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    Okay, I'm agreeing with BlueRidge on too many threads lately....when is the off season over?

    Possibly they would like to appeal to the average viewers and/or singles/pairs fans, who tend to react to the flinging and dying and attempts to portray the dark plight of the doomed and damned as "Wow. So am I supposed to go slit my wrists now? How is this a sport?" Maybe even they started sending the memo with V/M's soft, lyrical, generally non-angsty FD beating out the theatrically DRAMATIC! PotO from D/W, and BOTH beating...whatever the heck that was DomShabs were doing.
    Well maybe the issue is that the sport will be pretty boring if everyone is skating to uplifting music or everyone was skating to dramatic music Nobody's saying that you can't have a good uplifting program or that all dramatic programs are great. But what is needed is a balance.

    And who says the audience can't enjoy some dramatic programs. Bolero is one of the most memorable programs of all time, and I'm not so sure that can be called "uplifting".

    And as for Mahler, I found it boring, and I preferred POTO as a program, even though I did think V/M deserved their win.

    The problem here is that the rules are subjective, hard to interpet and its going to make ice dancing cookie cutter.

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