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  1. #201
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    I'm sure the book will show up in the Bargain Bins
    Don't you know who I am?
    Remember my name
    (Weir)
    I'm gonna live forever
    I'm gonna learn how to fly
    (High)
    I feel it coming together
    People will see me and cry


  2. #202

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nan View Post
    And I might also guess that he doesn't care for skaters who stand out enough to overshadow the attention he thinks he deserves.
    Right, because Scott's image was EVERYWHERE when I went to see it. His life-size statue was paraded around the ice before, during, and after the show, and you couldn't even pass through the doors without first bowing to the ten-foot poster of Dear Leader on the wall.



    Let's be serious. As much hate as Scott draws on this board, for whatever reason, he's been quite willing to seek attention for other skaters and not just himself.
    Charter member of the "We Always Believed in Ashley" Club and the "We Believe in Ricky" Club
    Old, lonely, pathos-hungry, and extremely gullible

  3. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyliefan View Post
    Right, because Scott's image was EVERYWHERE when I went to see it. His life-size statue was paraded around the ice before, during, and after the show, and you couldn't even pass through the doors without first bowing to the ten-foot poster of Dear Leader on the wall.
    Yes it was just frightening!

    I don't recall any reference whatsoever to Scott anywhere at the show. I do think that he doesn't want anyone to overshadow the whole show... but that would only explain why it doesn't have Michelle Kwan...
    Congratulations 2014 World Ice Dance Champions Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte!!!

  4. #204
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    Lots of fodder in the offseason. Fun to read all the opinions, the jokes and the asides. Lots of good copywriters here.

    All joking aside (pun intended)..., as I recall from earlier reports, some unidentified spokesperson affiliated (?) with IMG leaked to the press that the reason Johnny was not asked to tour with SOI is because he's not "family friendly." Then this "family friendly" reasoning was tied to the sponsor, again through leaked IMG comments. Johnny had no part in any of this until the "family friendly" comment was brought to his attention by the media. When he was asked about not being "family friendly" that's when he commented, and in fact he downplayed the whole thing about not being asked because as he's repeatedly said, he's never been invited to tour with SOI, and didn't expect to be asked after the Olympics. It was the claim that he's not "family friendly" that irked Johnny, and indeed had a lot of skating fans scratching their heads. Based on this recent SOI number, I guess Adam Lambert is loads more "family friendly" than Johnny Weir.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfK6l...ext=1&index=73


    For the poster who asked for details about the faux Johnny/ Evan war:

    http://greginhollywood.com/johnny-we...-a-slore-26923

    In my opinion, the real war is between figure skating PTB and their abject and antiquated fear of male skaters appearing to be "skating while gay," despite the fact as everyone knows many coaches, many skaters, many officials are gay, and some perhaps bi, and even straight too. And, slap my hand for even mentioning that there may in fact even be some lesbians out there on the ice. Pardon me, what century are we living in???

    Johnny and Evan are just casualties of this war, although Evan apparently gets most of the official spoils. I think they'll both find their way and do very well in life. This whole chapter in their lives does deserve an intelligent book, written from the point of view of how it has exposed the depths of this sport's hypocrisy.

    I love the sport and the skaters, and I absolutely love Frank Carroll, so I say this with all due respect. Frank is definitely the person in charge of his skaters. Kudos to Frank because while pigs couldn't fly (at least at 2010 Olympics), Frank was able to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear -- with all due credit to Evan's determined focus, and the usual politics, which obviously will forever govern this sport.

    Kudos to Johnny for being a beautiful and a courageous skater and person. Whether acknowledged or not, he has been an undeniably inspirational force and presence in the sport. He even inspired Evan, and that's a fact. Keeping it real folks, and looking beyond the cockeyed surface of things..., that ain't easy. And, you know what, "he ain't heavy, he's my brother."

    http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/zoola...smybrother.htm
    Last edited by aftershocks; 05-05-2010 at 11:15 PM.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    All joking aside (pun intended)..., as I recall from earlier reports, some unidentified spokesperson affiliated (?) with IMG leaked to the press that the reason Johnny was not asked to tour with SOI is because he's not "family friendly." Then this "family friendly" reasoning was tied to the sponsor, again through leaked IMG comments. Johnny had no part in any of this until the "family friendly" comment was brought to his attention by the media.
    I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

    I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

  6. #206

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nan View Post
    And I might also guess that he doesn't care for skaters who stand out enough to overshadow the attention he thinks he deserves.
    LOL, Scott hasn't skated with Stars on Ice for years - I doubt he's worried about being overshadowed.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

    I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.
    Its part of the Johnny fan mythology now, along with "Evan has said homophobic things," and the "USFSA has tried to fcuck Johnny over for years because he's too gay appearing." Then we roll on the floor hugging ourselves weeping and moaning in the joy and pain of uberfandom.

    sorry, I'm more than a little sick of the bullshit of people who don't care about any evidence for anything and believe whatever is said by all their fellow ubers about the objects of their oh-so-pure and beautiful fanly desires.
    Congratulations 2014 World Ice Dance Champions Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte!!!

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by WildRose View Post
    LOL, Scott hasn't skated with Stars on Ice for years -
    Yes. I know. That's kind of the point. Gone, but never allowed to be forgotten.
    If this is to end in fire
    Then we will all burn together

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by judiz View Post
    Whatever the reason, Johnny has fans who have been known to fly in from Japan just to watch him skate in one show.
    I sat next to a group of nine or ten of young Japanese women for post-Torino COI, and they made a double double-header of the trip in Seattle -- both Everett shows and Ichiro with the Mariners -- and they were there for Weir, and they also mentioned Portland. They had signs for him, and I thought Elvis had risen from the dead from all the squealing and swooning. (One woman did have one of those mask-like signs on a stick with a beautiful cartoon of kawa, yay!) In 2007, I was on the on other side of the arena, but saw recognized one of the cuter signs. I don't know if the same women were back, or if they passed on the signs.

    I saw COI shows in several west coast cities, and Weir was among the top two or three in ovations each time.

    Anecdotal to be sure, but what isn't is that his fan clubs are more geographically distributed and organized than many of the other US skaters, and they rally around him. Also, I've never heard that he is anything but gracious to his fans, which keeps the cycle going, unlike a certain headliner who I witnessed trying to sneak out of a CSOI pre-performance practice without meeting the TV sponsor's contest-winning guests...

    Quote Originally Posted by numbers123 View Post
    as someone who hasn't attended SOI for 4 years and the previous COI for nearly 8 years, the addition of Johnny to any cast would not have taken me away from IN or other media outlets for competitive skating to see.
    Whereas for me it was the opposite. I wasn't about to subject myself to another year of Weiss and Eldredge for a glimpse of Yuka Sato and was planning not to go, especially since I now live in a CSOI city, but, thankfully, LadyNit told me I had missed Davis/White on the Seattle roster, and they were enough of a draw for me to make the trip down.

    Quote Originally Posted by Polymer Bob View Post
    This all makes sense. But why WASN'T Johnny invited?
    You mean then, or now?

    2003 was the first time Kurt Browning's SOI history list mentions guests, and both were former cast members, Gordeeva and Hamilton. In 2004 it was the first time they had cast members who were contracted for part of the tour (Gordeeva and Sato) and the first time a part-time guest, Michael Weiss, had not been on the tour before. In 2007 they expanded again to 11 in the main cast, with Gordeeva and Nikodinov splitting cities, and five guests, former cast members Kulik and Browning, and then Cohen, Hughes, and Meissner; the women guests got the men/women ratio into better balance.

    In 2008, the first year of the merger, the roster was one of the smaller ones -- 8 regular acts -- with two guests, Kulik () and Sale/Pelletier. There were three women on the regular roster -- Cohen, Robinson, and Sato -- and two men -- Weiss and Eldredge (who was not yet phoning it in) -- and Kulik for half the shows. They were a smaller roster, and, they were anything but top heavy with men.

    The SOI press announcement that Cohen was joining the cast plugs Shen/Zhao as "two-time Olympic Bronze Medalists", not as World Champions, and Ina/Zimmerman as "World Bronze Medalists", not US Champions, which suggests that bronze at the international championship level is shiny enough for them.

    Weir was contracted to COI through the 2007 tour. 2008 was the year Weir lost a tie-breaker for the US National Championship, something that was widely discussed by fans, if not casual viewers, and he was the only US medalist at Worlds. 2008 would have been the obvious time to invite him for some post-Worlds guest appearances.

    Weir wrote in his April 2008 blog entry that he had three firm post-Worlds touring commitments, two in Japan and one in Skokie, but was reviewing other offers. He wrote "I wish I was performing more in the U.S but at this point it looks like it could be three shows tops for this touring season." Whether this meant "No one else in the US asked me" or "Sorry, suckers, I turned down SOI to skate in Bratislava" isn't clear from the statement, but I'm assuming the former, since it would have been very easy for SOI, when asked about Weir this year, to have said, "We've asked him in the past, but he was busy" if the latter were true. In his July 2008 entry he noted a robust touring schedule, including with Plushenko.

    By 2009, Weir was off the National podium, although he was reigning World Bronze Medalist, at least through LA, plus he was free after January . The cast was balanced between men and women (three each), and there were four guests, Belbin/Agosto, Meissner, Buttle, and Lysacek.

    Do I think that Smuckers didn't want him hired in 2008 or for guest appearances in 2010? Do I think that USFS was unhappy about Weir being the only US medalist in 2008 and that the 7th place finisher at US Nationals would have been preferable? Yes and yes. Can I prove it? No and no.

    That was then. As for now, had Weir replied with "never asked" or "ask them", it is possible that he would have been one of the skaters added later for a few performances, especially on the West Coast, which is a straightforward trip from Asia; Vancouver, a big destination for young Japanese tourists, is only several hours away from Seattle by bus or train, Portland several more, and Ichiro is still playing for the M's ( ). Both sides had face-saving stories in Mr. Weir's busy touring schedule ("It took a while to arrange"), he could have dropped in, done his solos, been on the bus for a week or so, and not have had to be part of the group numbers, all of which sounds win/win to me.

    Once he accused the sponsors of discrimination, it was Game Over. That he didn't have the balls to stick with his story made him lose my respect.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  10. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRidge View Post
    Yes it was just frightening!

    I don't recall any reference whatsoever to Scott anywhere at the show. I do think that he doesn't want anyone to overshadow the whole show... but that would only explain why it doesn't have Michelle Kwan...
    Ahhhh... the Ambassador. Guess she's too busy going to graduate school and flying to other countries trying to improve/rescue our reputation with the rest of the world. Pity she can't save figure skating's reputation, or SOI's for that matter.

    BTW, I don't think it's a secret that Scott Hamilton has asked/ wished for/ wanted Michelle Kwan to skate with SOI. If the Kween did find the time to skate in a few appearances, I'd bet anything it would improve ticket sales in those venues.

  11. #211

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    Do I think that Smuckers didn't want him hired in 2008 or for guest appearances in 2010? Do I think that USFS was unhappy about Weir being the only US medalist in 2008 and that the 7th place finisher at US Nationals would have been preferable? Yes and yes. Can I prove it? No and no.
    I think USFS was very happy that Johnny medaled at 08 Worlds. I think they were disappointed that he was the only one - particularly with B/A finishing 4th when they were the favorites to win after DomShabs withdrew. But I don't see how the USFSA being disappointed with a less-than-stellar showing overall means they were disappointed about Johnny - after all, he was really their only hope in the men's event after Evan withdrew.

    I don't think Kimmie and Johnny's appearances (or lack thereof) on SOI that year had anything to do with the USFSA. Kimmie is an IMG client and I believe she had a multi-year contract with SOI (even in 07, she did a few winter shows and then did COI after Worlds). I'm sure when SOI signed her to a contract they were not expecting her to finish 7th at 08 Nats.

  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

    I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.

    Apparently the report was originally blogged here:

    http://glaadblog.org/2010/03/11/john...s-on-ice-tour/

    The source who provided the information, as indicated, wished to remain anonymous. I'm sure (actually, I know) there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes that we don't know about. Who knows, maybe GLAAD inquired of IMG why Johnny wasn't invited to tour, and an anonymous source told them and then it was reported. I think it's a stretch to say that Johnny came out first with the claim he wasn't invited because he wasn't considered "family friendly." (Unless you choose to believe he or his agent is the anonymous source). It was the media who brought up to Johnny the report about the "not family friendly" comment. Contrary to what many believe, I don't think Johnny seeks out attention, he doesn't need to. Very similar to Adam Lambert, Johnny is someone with talent and charisma, and that attracts attention as well as fans and critics. There's a thin line between love and hate.

    As I said previously, it's often hard to dig beneath the cockeyed surface of things. "Only love is real. Everything else illusion, adding to the confusion."

    While Johnny and Evan hopefully move forward, the war continues between fear and the sport's PTB, and between fans with varying opinions, experiences, illusions, delusions, and maybe not a few denials and repressions, perhaps even jealousies.

    But remember, "only love is real," and that's what I feel when I watch a joyous, in-the-zone skating performance, such as Pang/Tong 2010 Olympics; Davis & White 2010 Olympics; Shen & Zhao 2003 Worlds, 2004 Worlds lp; Savchenko & Szolkowy 2007 Europeans; Michelle Kwan 1998/ 2004 Nationals, 2003 Worlds, 1996 Worlds, 1998 World Professionals; Rudy Galindo 1996 Nationals; Johnny Weir 2004 Nationals, 2004 TEB, 2006 Nationals sp and numerous exhibitions; Brian Boitano 1988 Olympics; Paul Wylie - his transcendant professional performances; Toller Cranston - practically his entire career.

  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    I believe that the only "family friendly leaks" have come from Johnny's agent.

    I may be wrong on that, but I don't recall any other spokesperson saying anything of the kind.
    You are right on this. All the BS and petitioning started after Johnny's agent told the leader of the Johnny fan board this information and she set up the petition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by igniculus View Post
    You are right on this. All the BS and petitioning started after Johnny's agent told the leader of the Johnny fan board this information and she set up the petition.
    Johnny needs a new agent, like yesterday. She comes across as really unprofessional and bargain-basement. I bet a better agent would have gotten Johnny on the SOI tour.
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    Apparently the report was originally blogged here:

    http://glaadblog.org/2010/03/11/john...s-on-ice-tour/

    The source who provided the information, as indicated, wished to remain anonymous. I'm sure (actually, I know) there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes that we don't know about. Who knows, maybe GLAAD inquired of IMG why Johnny wasn't invited to tour, and an anonymous source told them and then it was reported. I think it's a stretch to say that Johnny came out first with the claim he wasn't invited because he wasn't considered "family friendly." (Unless you choose to believe he or his agent is the anonymous source). It was the media who brought up to Johnny the report about the "not family friendly" comment. Contrary to what many believe, I don't think Johnny seeks out attention, he doesn't need to. Very similar to Adam Lambert, Johnny is someone with talent and charisma, and that attracts attention as well as fans and critics. There's a thin line between love and hate.

    As I said previously, it's often hard to dig beneath the cockeyed surface of things. "Only love is real. Everything else illusion, adding to the confusion."

    While Johnny and Evan hopefully move forward, the war continues between fear and the sport's PTB, and between fans with varying opinions, experiences, illusions, delusions, and maybe not a few denials and repressions, perhaps even jealousies.

    But remember, "only love is real," and that's what I feel when I watch a joyous, in-the-zone skating performance, such as Pang/Tong 2010 Olympics; Davis & White 2010 Olympics; Shen & Zhao 2003 Worlds, 2004 Worlds lp; Savchenko & Szolkowy 2007 Europeans; Michelle Kwan 1998/ 2004 Nationals, 2003 Worlds, 1996 Worlds, 1998 World Professionals; Rudy Galindo 1996 Nationals; Johnny Weir 2004 Nationals, 2004 TEB, 2006 Nationals sp and numerous exhibitions; Brian Boitano 1988 Olympics; Paul Wylie - his transcendant professional performances; Toller Cranston - practically his entire career.
    Its all been discussed previously in at least 3 million five hundred thousand two hundred and thirty-three threads, but the main one I believe was the one started by the same poster who started this thread and you can find it here:

    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...ht=Johnny+weir
    Congratulations 2014 World Ice Dance Champions Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte!!!

  16. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by igniculus View Post
    You are right on this. All the BS and petitioning started after Johnny's agent told the leader of the Johnny fan board this information and she set up the petition.
    Yes, all the stuff with GLAAD came way after the petition and the furor on the messageboards, so the "anonymous source" consulted by GLAAD also happened after that, as did the media attention. So saying the media brought it to Johnny first---uh, no.

    And I might add that at no point is the "anonymous source" attributed to ANYONE at IMG, so I don't know where that came from.
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

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    GLAAD stated to me in an email communication that the anonymous source was anonymous. But they assured me that the anonymous source surely was a source, just one that wanted to stay anonymous.
    Congratulations 2014 World Ice Dance Champions Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte!!!

  18. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by Debbie S View Post

    I don't think Kimmie and Johnny's appearances (or lack thereof) on SOI that year had anything to do with the USFSA. Kimmie is an IMG client and I believe she had a multi-year contract with SOI (even in 07, she did a few winter shows and then did COI after Worlds). I'm sure when SOI signed her to a contract they were not expecting her to finish 7th at 08 Nats.
    I don't think the USFS specifically kept Weir off the tour, but if they had any influence, which was suggested earlier in the thread, I don't see them pushing him forward.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  19. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Debbie S View Post
    Well, a book doesn't need to be great literature to earn a lot of royalties.

    But I agree that I'll probably read more from the book on FSU than I would ever want to pay for.
    The majority of books don't earn any royalties at all. Unless you get a very unusual contract, authors are normally paid an advance, and then if the book earns out its advance they recieve royalties on it. Most books never earn out and end up remaindered. Or, as Clive James so brilliantly put it, "The book of my enemy has been remaindered, and I am pleased."

  20. #220
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    Or to be technical about it, the royalties earned are applied against an advance until/if they exceed the advance, in which case the author earns royalties in excess of the advance.

    From a recent article in The New Yorker called "Publish or Perish: Can the iPad topple the Kindle, and save the book business?"

    They also give advances on royalties, without which most writers of nonfiction could not afford to research new books. The industry produces more than a hundred thousand books a year, seventy per cent of which will not earn back the money that their authors have been advanced; aside from returns, royalty advances are by far publishers’ biggest expense. Although critics argue that traditional book publishing takes too much money from authors, in reality the profits earned by the relatively small percentage of authors whose books make money essentially go to subsidizing less commercially successful writers. The system is inefficient, but it supports a class of professional writers, which might not otherwise exist.
    http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...#ixzz0n60CFRbi
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

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