What does Caroline Zhang need to do to work her way back up to the podium?

[Polymer Bob]

I think Caroline's bad technique is part of the reason why her jumps are so low.

Or maybe ....... "I thought Caroline's bad technique was part of the reason why her jumps were so low.

I am still encouraged by the ( unconfirmed ) report that Caroline has made improvements in her jumping. It seems unlikely somebody can re-work jumps in a couple of months. But four years ago, it was unlikely anyone from South Korea would win the Olympics.

[pinky166]

Or maybe ....... "I thought Caroline's bad technique was part of the reason why her jumps were so low.

I am still encouraged by the ( unconfirmed ) report that Caroline has made improvements in her jumping. It seems unlikely somebody can re-work jumps in a couple of months. But four years ago, it was unlikely anyone from South Korea would win the Olympics.

I admire your optimism. I think there is a good chance Caroline can still fix her technique and speed, and maybe she already has. That being said, I don't think she'll ever be a power jumper, just judging from her build, most of the very powerful lady jumpers have broader shoulders and a more athletic physique while Caroline has more of a pretty pretty princess bodytype.

[Autumn_girl]

Or maybe ....... "I thought Caroline's bad technique was part of the reason why her jumps were so low.

I am still encouraged by the ( unconfirmed ) report that Caroline has made improvements in her jumping. It seems unlikely somebody can re-work jumps in a couple of months. But four years ago, it was unlikely anyone from South Korea would win the Olympics.

I want to believe that she improved her jumps, but we've heard something like this last year and all know what happened next.

I admire your optimism. I think there is a good chance Caroline can still fix her technique and speed, and maybe she already has. That being said, I don't think she'll ever be a power jumper, just judging from her build, most of the very powerful lady jumpers have broader shoulders and a more athletic physique while Caroline has more of a pretty pretty princess bodytype.

It's not even her bodytype, it's natural qualities. Yes, she could jump higher with better technique, but not much higher, her jumps would still be low, lower than other top skaters jumps.

[pinky166]

I want to believe that she improved her jumps, but we've heard something like this last year and all know what happened next.



It's not even her bodytype, it's natural qualities. Yes, she could jump higher with better technique, but not much higher, her jumps would still be low, lower than other top skaters jumps.

I think some people just naturally have huge jumps, and Caroline isn't one of those people. She's never going to have a triple lutz like Sebestyen or a triple flip like Gao.

[Polymer Bob]

Oooops, repeat post.

[Polymer Bob]

I don't think she'll ever be a power jumper, just judging from her build, most of the very powerful lady jumpers have broader shoulders and a more athletic physique while Caroline has more of a pretty pretty princess bodytype.

If you compare videos of Caroline from this past season and the 08-09 season, it seems her shoulders have gotten broader. She seems more athletic and muscular than before. The only way to increase her jump height is by pumping iron in the gym. I have read reports that she is doing just that.

[key65man]

It's not even her bodytype, it's natural qualities. Yes, she could jump higher with better technique, but not much higher, her jumps would still be low, lower than other top skaters jumps.

I am not sure what you meant by natural qualities. Obviously, Caroline is not capable of muscling a big jump. So, it is a matter of how she handles speed to generate enough energy and therefore a good flight time.

Well, I certainly don't believe she can handle speed so well as to jump like Yuna. But, she was able to manage reasonably good speed when she was younger. Even now, she shows decent speed doing Arabesque spiral. With better technique, she should be able to create a flight time long enough to handle triples.

But, the problem is that she should have started adjusting, if not overhauling, the jump mechanics way sooner. It is very difficult right now to adjust/overhaul her jumps so comprehensively.

[ChibiChibi]

I wouldn't underestimate her talent. She's been reworking on her jump techniques, and she's doing very well in such a short period of time. Of course it's not consistent yet, but she's already landing the 3F without mule kick. Her 3L-2A Seq looks nice, and her 2A-3T is very powerful. Give her more time, and I believe she'll be back in the game again.

[chipso1]

I wouldn't underestimate her talent. She's been reworking on her jump techniques, and she's doing very well in such a short period of time. Of course it's not consistent yet, but she's already landing the 3F without mule kick. Her 3L-2A Seq looks nice, and her 2A-3T is very powerful. Give her more time, and I believe she'll be back in the game again.

The 3L-2A sequence I can kind of believe, but where did you hear/see that she was working on a 2A-3T combo? IIRC, she's never put a combination on her 2A because she literally has no speed on the landing. How is she mustering up the momentum to tack a 3T on?

[pinky166]

If you compare videos of Caroline from this past season and the 08-09 season, it seems her shoulders have gotten broader. She seems more athletic and muscular than before. The only way to increase her jump height is by pumping iron in the gym. I have read reports that she is doing just that.

Yes but she still doesn't have the athletic build or broad shoulders like Mirai, Ashley, Mao, Yuna who are all big jumpers.

And 2a-3t ?! I really want to see that. And the 3f with no mule kick. If this is actually true it will be quite a treat to see her skate come fall.

[RockTheTassel]

I wouldn't underestimate her talent. She's been reworking on her jump techniques, and she's doing very well in such a short period of time. Of course it's not consistent yet, but she's already landing the 3F without mule kick. Her 3L-2A Seq looks nice, and her 2A-3T is very powerful. Give her more time, and I believe she'll be back in the game again.

I'd love to believe you, but that does seems like a stretch. Also, have any other skaters been able to fix bad technique and come back? I think someone in this thread mentioned Joannie Rochette, but I'm not sure what her jumps used to look like. Surely they were nowhere as bad as Caroline's.

And 2a-3t ?! I really want to see that. And the 3f with no mule kick. If this is actually true it will be quite a treat to see her skate come fall.

Yeah, I'd love to see it too. Even if she just used next year as a building year and didn't place very high, it would be great to see a little improvement. She's only seventeen. If she used the next couple years to make changing her jump technique her number one priority, she might get back in the mix. I don't have high hopes, but I suppose you never know.

[pinky166]

ChibiChibi do you skate with Caroline? Have you seen in person Caroline do these combos (2a-3t, 3lo-2a, 3f with no kick) you mentioned? I REALLY wish a video of her practicing would come out!

[briancoogaert]

I wouldn't underestimate her talent. She's been reworking on her jump techniques, and she's doing very well in such a short period of time. Of course it's not consistent yet, but she's already landing the 3F without mule kick. Her 3L-2A Seq looks nice, and her 2A-3T is very powerful. Give her more time, and I believe she'll be back in the game again.

I believe it when I see it ! With so bad basics, I don't think she is able to fix her problems in such a short period of time.

[RD]

Same here. Show me a practice video...or better yet, show me during a competition.

[Polymer Bob]

Same here. Show me a practice video...or better yet, show me during a competition.

I think Caroline's next competition will be the Golden West in Culver City.

[pinky166]

I think Caroline's next competition will be the Golden West in Culver City.

That's in August right? Maybe she'll compete at Liberty in July? I'm really curious to see the "new" Caroline skate!

[oleada]

Yeah, even if what's reported is true (a big if), it's one thing to do it in practice and another to do it in a program, in choreography and where muscle memory kicks in.

[pinky166]

Yeah, even if what's reported is true (a big if), it's one thing to do it in practice and another to do it in a program, in choreography and where muscle memory kicks in.

I'm more interested in her speed than whether or not she fixed the mule kick. I mean, the mule kick is distracting and will be hard to not let creep in in competitions, speed can be acquired and maintained. If I were Caroline, speed would be my #1 priority, not only will it help her jumps but it will also boost her PCS.

[Marco]

If Zhang could fix her mulekick and axel issues, improve on lutz and loop technique, do interesting choreography, and skate about 3 times faster, I can be on board.

[ChibiChibi]

I don't skate with her on regular basis, but I do once in a while. I don't know what others think, but I personally think she has already made a great amount of progress since the Nationals. To be honest with you, I had never thought she could improve her jump techniques, but she proved me and most people wrong.

As I said in me previous post, her 3F without the mule kick is not consistent at all yet. It's obvious that doing it during practice, in her programs during practice, and doing it in competitions are totally different matter. I just think we all should give her time to re-work on her jumps. She will probably not do well next season, but if she keeps working on her jumps, speed, and power, she'll eventually come back to the top level. She's only 16 (has she turned 17 yet?). She still has time, so let's wait and see...