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  1. #741
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    If so many competitors in this sport are dopers, how come most of them don't get caught with the rigorous anti-doping tests that go on all the time? Are the tests so un-advanced that they can't detect the drugs being used by most of these competitors? They apparently keep test samples for years, and I can't believe they still can't get a positive test for doping techniques from a decade ago.

  2. #742
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    One popular "doping" method is homologous blood doping in which athletes draw blood, and reinject the red blood cells from their own blood. Since it is their own blood, it doesn't get picked up in tests. This is one reason behind the blood passports which test levels over time and look for variations that don't seem natural. But that is an inexact method and still relatively new.

    Operation Puerto which tripped up a number of cyclists in 2006 was related to blood doping and one theory holds that Vino got caught only when his doctor mixed up his blood bag with another rider's on the team. Doping isn't for those with weak stomachs!
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  3. #743
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    Volta a Portugal
    26-08-2012; 10th stage; 149,5KM (Sintra / Lisbon) - The final day
    Winner: Reinardt van Rensburg from South Africa (MTN)
    Van Rensburg sprinted to victory in Lisbon leaving Boy van Poppel (Holland) from United Healthcare in 2nd place. Samuel Caldeira (Carmin Prio Tavira) was the best portuguese guy on the stage and finished in 3rd place. Bradley White (USA) from United Healthcare crashed and withdrew in the very last day.

    Conclusion:
    Individual: David Blanco (Efapel) had a great time in the last 3 stages of the Volta and managed to claim the victory to get the yellow jersey. Hugo Sabido (LA Antarte) stayed in 2nd place only 22 seconds away from success. Surprisingly, Sabido didn't sound frustrated at all. It looks like this second place finish gave him motivation to attack it in 2013. 3rd: Rui Sousa (Efapel); 4th Daniel Silva (Onda Boavista); 5th David de la Cruz (Caja Rural); 6th Brice Feillu (Saur Sojasun); 7th Sérgio Ribeiro (Efapel); 8th Nuno Ribeiro (Efapel); 9th Darwin Atapuma (Coldeportes); 10.º Vergílio Santos (LA Antarte); Massive disappointment for Carmin Prio Tavira cause they couldn't get a single cyclist in the top ten.

    Blue jersey (Mountain) - Rui Sousa (Efapel) was the winner with a comfortable margin.

    Orange jersey (Youth) - David de la Cruz (Caja Rural) managed to get 1st place. Omar Fraile (Orbea Continental) was 2nd and José Gonçalves (Onda Boavista) was 3rd. Just out of curiosity: Domingos Gonçalves, the twin brother of José Gonçalves, finished in 7th place.

    Red jersey (points): Reinardt van Rensburg (MTN) won the last stage and secured the 1st place here. United Healthcare didn't do bad cause Jason McCartney finished 6th and Jay Thomson finished in 8th with Boy van Poppel and Kai Reus in positions 11th and 12th.

    Teams - Top 10:
    1.º - Efapel (Portugal)
    2.º - LA Antarte (Portugal)
    3.º - Onda Boavista (Portugal)
    4.º - Carmin Prio Tavira (Portugal)
    5.º - Caja Rural (Spain)
    6.º - Columbia / Coldeportes (Colombia)
    7.º - Orbea Continental (Spain)
    8.º - Saur/Sojasun (France)
    9.º - Burgos (Spain)
    10.º - Lokosphinx (Russia)

    Video summary of the last stage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdIcE10p3zQ&feature=plcp
    Important note: David Blanco is the first ever cyclist to win the tour of Portugal for 5 times.
    Last moments of the stage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r17xPeBWgic&feature=plcp

    I hope some of you liked the info and the videos about this tour.
    Last edited by DaiKozOda; 08-28-2012 at 12:19 AM.

  4. #744
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaiKozOda View Post
    I hope some of you liked the info and the videos about this tour.
    Thank you very much! It sounds like an exciting race and unfortunately it didn't get that much coverage here since it was competing with the Vuelta and the race in Colorado.

    And Boy Van Poppel is one of my favorite names in the peloton!
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  5. #745

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    Likewise- I've enjoyed your updates- thanks for posting. I wish we could see more of this race- you've peaked my interest. I'm sorry your posts seemed to get lost in all of the Lance stuff.

  6. #746
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    Thank you Garden Kitty and Kedrin In case you have any questions about the race, feel free to ask. I'll be happy to answer if I can.

  7. #747
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    To think that fun is simple fun, while earnest things are earnest, proves all too plain that neither one thou truthfully discernest.

  8. #748
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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    IDK. "We were all doing it!" from a notorious doper doesn't exactly convince me.

  9. #749
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    Quote Originally Posted by vesperholly View Post
    IDK. "We were all doing it!" from a notorious doper doesn't exactly convince me.
    Except it's not just him. Or even one or two others. For me the testimony of almost a dozen people is stronger to me than one saying "I've never failed a doping test."

    But I guess it must be hard for many of those people who bought into the yellow wristbands to admit to themselves that they've been conned.
    To think that fun is simple fun, while earnest things are earnest, proves all too plain that neither one thou truthfully discernest.

  10. #750

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    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/repo...strong-samples

    Apparently USADA now has positive results from retesting samples from earlier in Armstrong's career. Looks like the game is up completely.

  11. #751

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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    Except it's not just him. Or even one or two others. For me the testimony of almost a dozen people is stronger to me than one saying "I've never failed a doping test."

    But I guess it must be hard for many of those people who bought into the yellow wristbands to admit to themselves that they've been conned.
    I think it's possible to be skeptical about Armstrong's claims regarding testing and still feel that relying on the testimony of the likes of Hamilton (who has his own interests) and cyclists offered various deals by the USADA is problematic. At this point, there's really nobody I'd consider believable on either side. I realize that the USADA is not held to the same standards that govern regular legal proceedings, but I am not very impressed with their handling of this case, and I suspect if they had any strong scientific proof, it would be on every US website by now - not just as a leak to someone from Stade 2.

    A lot of the people who bought into the yellow wristband stuff did so because they needed inspiration at a difficult time in their lives, so it's not surprising that they would like to hold on to that belief.
    Last edited by Zemgirl; 09-03-2012 at 01:57 PM.

  12. #752
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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    But I guess it must be hard for many of those people who bought into the yellow wristbands to admit to themselves that they've been conned.
    Please. I don't own a stitch of inspirational anything, much less an ugly yellow wristband. It's possible that he both doped AND the USADA can't prove it and is overzealous in their pursuit of him.

    IIRC, the anti-doping agencies all state that their criteria for banning/stripping of results is positive drug tests, NOT testimony from other riders. This isn't a court of law. They have rules and they appear to not be following their own rules just for the sake of taking down the "Big Dog" of cycling. It has a whiff of witchhunt to me.

    blood samples taken earlier during Armstrong's career had been retested under the authority of USADA and "ultimately came back positive".
    If USADA really does have positive samples, Travis Tygart would be screaming it from the hills. Retested under the authority of an organization that is bending over backwards to vilify Armstrong? I've read that USADA has a statute of limitations on retesting, and they have ignored it in retesting his samples. Why?

    One of Lance Armstrong’s key arguments in fighting United States Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) charges of doping and conspiracy was that the agency was acting outside the eight-year statute of limitations. USADA boss Travis Tygart has now revealed that if Armstrong had co-operated with the investigation, that statute may actually have applied. ...

    Tygart told the USA Today that co-operation from Armstrong would have resulted in USADA stripping him only of his 2004 and 2005 wins.

    "[If Armstrong had of] come in and been truthful, then the evidence might have been that the statute [of limitations] should apply," Tygart said.
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/usad...five-tour-wins

    WTF? If he co-operates, we will stick to our rules. But since he said shove it, I'm going for the whole enchilada? Come on. This is ridiculous.

  13. #753

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    Quote Originally Posted by morqet View Post
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/repo...strong-samples

    Apparently USADA now has positive results from retesting samples from earlier in Armstrong's career. Looks like the game is up completely.
    If this is true, .

  14. #754
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    There was an attempt to retest some early samples a few years ago, and the UCI report determined that the samples had not been maintained in a manner sufficient to ensure that there wasn't tampering. I suspect we'll hear similar arguments if such retesting did occur.

    WADA has definitely maintained that it doesn't need a positive test in order to seek sanctions - that is sort of the whole aim of the blood passports - to detect irregularities that don't trigger an adverse result. The actions against Jan Ullrich and most of the people involved with Operation Puerto were based on evidence found at the doctor's office and not a positive test.

    But in other news, Contador had an impressive day at the Vuelta with some very clever tactics from Riis (and help from an old Astana buddy), and has taken a big stage win and the leader's jersey at the Vuelta.
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  15. #755
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    The Vuelta is being so exciting! I'm loving it.

  16. #756
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaiKozOda View Post
    The Vuelta is being so exciting! I'm loving it.
    Agreed. The Tour is always fun just because of the spectacle of it all, but the Vuelta has had some really exciting racing this year. I loved how Riis had the other riders drop back to interfere with the chase - classic Riis!
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  17. #757
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    Garmin's DS Jonathan Vaughters was participating in a forum discussion on Cyclingnews and "outed" Danielson, VandeVelde and Zabriskie as former dopers by name. Article discussing the postings is on Cyclingnews


    Vaughters says he just got caught up in the debate, but others suspect this was a calculated move to get the news out there before the USADA releases details from the Armstrong investigation. Although Vaughters got a self-serving article in the NY Times for his confession and his riders just get a post on a forum.

    For those who want more details about the mechanics of blood doping, this interview from a few months ago with Michael Ashenden is intersting although a bit technical.
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  18. #758
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    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

  19. #759
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    Tyler Farrar might not be able to go to the world championships. He crashed during a stage of Tour of Britain and suffered a concussion. I wish Farrar gets well soon.
    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/farr...ith-concussion

  20. #760
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    I was worried when I saw a tweet referring to a "severe concussion" - it's almost the end of the season. He should be very careful and not risk another injury while he's still recovering.
    "The Devil is joining in, and that's never a good sign." Phil Liggett

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