Yuzuru Hanyu to be coached by Brian Orser

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, Apr 25, 2012.

  1. Hedwig

    Hedwig Rarely here anymore but I try to be better!

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    I don't understand the coaching situation - is his old coach still his coach when he is at school in Japan? Or does he train on his own then?
    Is Orser his primary coach or an additional coach when he is in Canada?

    this commute. :yikes:
     
  2. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

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    Just one thing to say. TOO MANY TOP-RANKING SKATERS IN ORSER'S CAMP.
     
  3. NMURA

    NMURA Member

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    Reportedly Hanyu ended the coaching relationship with Nanami Abe peacefully. He basically lives in Sendai and travels to Toronto occasionally.
     
  4. NMURA

    NMURA Member

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    WTT is a so-called cheesefest sponsored by Japan money. We can't make any serious conclusion out of this. Takahashi also has received incredible scores at NHK trophy (90+ for the quad-less SP). In a sense, it's similar to Skate Canada.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2012
  5. BittyBug

    BittyBug Kiteless

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    ^ This. If Hanyu had to be sent anywhere, I'd have rather seen him go to someone like Frank Carroll or John Nicks.
     
  6. Jaana

    Jaana Well-Known Member

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    Maybe, just maybe some skaters are hopeless cases, who ever the coach might be, LOL.
     
  7. Hedwig

    Hedwig Rarely here anymore but I try to be better!

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    Thanks.

    So that means that he trains on his own while in Japan? (sorry to be dense if that has been said already :eek: ) This really worries me.
     
  8. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Orser may be spreading himself too thin to be of maximum benefit to any of them.
     
  9. aemeraldrainc

    aemeraldrainc Active Member

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    How many top-ranked skaters does Orser actually have?
    I know Javi, Elene G., Cynthia Phaneuf, and now Yuzuru. Did I miss anyone? Honest question.
    How many skaters does Morozov have? :lol:
    Also, remember that it's a team effort in Orser's camp. It's not just him taking care of his "flock." There's Tracy Wilson, David Wilson, other technical coaches,etc.
    I'll give him a chance before I declare he's taking too much on.
     
  10. bek

    bek Guest

    How long does Hanyu have left of high school. It may be that he will travel their frequently for a little while and then move down their when high school is over. Plus isn't their ice issues in Japan. This coaching change may mean that important times, he'll get more ice team. Which isn't a little thing. His old coach might not be able to uproot her life for one student, but it might be in his best interest to have another place to train.

    Not to mention I think everyone can benefit at times from new inputs. His former coach did an AMAZING job but is she really the one to fix the posture, she's had a LONG time to work on it with him.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 26, 2012
  11. luCN

    luCN New Member

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    you said what I want to say.
    Orser didn't have too many students now,especially top ones.it's not a big problem.
    then Yuzuru may skate David Wilson's program?can't wait :cool:
     
  12. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    In reading the announcement about Phaneuf going to Orser the thing that struck me was that Brian mentioned not changing too much at all about her skating just working on confidence. When you think about Yu Na's bent leg on her layback and that they never fixed it, it seems like a glaring error to us but clearly to Brian it's not. I am sure that if it were costing her they would change it.

    My point is that there are some things that we as internet coaches would repair that clearly do not effect the skater overall so the coach wont fix. It must make perfect sense to them. I
    I think that most of us want to see happen other skaters when they switch; the drastic metamorphasis that is that happened to Michelle when she went to Lori or Yagudin/Kulik when they went to Tarasova or even Angela Nikodinov when she went to Elena. It doesnt always work that way...
     
  13. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Active Member

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    He may NOT though if he does not have a lot of beginner skaters. Tarasova used to coach multiple singles skaters and dance teams at the same time. Igor and Marina do it... Lets not presume to know it all...
     
  14. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    Who will Hanyu train with in Japan then if not Abe?
     
  15. Willowway

    Willowway Well-Known Member

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    Since I don't read Japanese, I couldn't tell what the article actually said. Does it specifically say that he is leaving Abe? If not, he may be adding Orser and still working with Abe when in Japan.
     
  16. Rock2

    Rock2 Well-Known Member

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    Cynthia's jumping technique and basic skating is already excellent. (except for the flip). Her problem is in her head and there's no guarantee that he or anyone can fix that. Head cases are really hard to turn around, especially late in their careers.

    Someone complained earlier about Orser's inability to fix Rippon's 3A. Keep in mind we only know parts of the story so be careful about the conclusions you draw. Rumor had it that Rippon didn't follow Orser's plan to improve his jumps which included more off ice work. It takes two -- both teacher and student -- to create success.

    In general though I love all the moves. To me this is a big picture signal that skaters are really game to develop and grow. As a result they take all they can from a coach and then when they sense a plateau of any kind they search for additional instruction from others. Risky to do, but can lead to a faster trajectory of growth for the skaters. Love it!
     
  17. bek

    bek Guest

    I know... Orser hasn't shown YET that he can be a Mishin/Carroll and develop a skater from the ground up, but it takes years to develop a skater like that.. And so give him time. But he has shown that he can take a skater with the technical skills, improve their skating in all aspects, and also manage their injuries/make sure they peak at the right time. Which is good for Hanyu.

    There were a lot of coaches not just Orser that couldn't help Rippon with that triple axel, and I actually think Gao improved a lot under Orser from what I can see. There are tons of reports that Fernandez does not have the greatest work ethic, which ISN'T Orser's fault.

    With Hanyu Orser may have his male version of Kim talent wise, heck Hanyu may even be more talented, and so far it seems to me given how much he's improved that the work ethic is there.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 26, 2012
  18. nubka

    nubka Well-Known Member

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    Yes, mammy! :rollin:
     
  19. jjane45

    jjane45 Active Member

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    Worried too. Why does it sound like Mao's arrangement with Tat?
     
  20. carriemarie

    carriemarie New Member

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    Oh, how I wish I could say I was that young or that I didn't take from the late Carlo Fassi, so yeah.......:shuffle:
     
  21. triple_toe

    triple_toe Well-Known Member

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    I think Brian isn't necessarily good at teaching jumps or basics, but is very good at taking skaters who already have the technical goods and packaging them and peaking them well for competitions. I think he can turn already good skaters into champions but isn't a "from the ground up" coach. That in no way means he's a bad coach; one is just as difficult as the other IMO. Simply he's more suited to skaters that are already elite.
     
  22. Marco

    Marco Missing Ziggy

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    Agreed, which is why I think Orser - Gao is not the best match.

    He seems to be better at camouflaging weaknesses than fixing them. Most of his other students can skate clean with a beautiful package and medal, but not Gao.

    Orser - Hanyu can be a good match because Hanyu already has most of what it takes to be the next best thing. But he is going to be facing a bitch of a commute. I hope he is disciplined enough to train on his own while in Japan. (or is his old coach going to look after him still while he is in Japan?) When does he finish highschool? Perhaps he can train full time in Canada after he finishes highschool?
     
  23. ProgramerUSFS

    ProgramerUSFS Member

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    I have heard that Brian puts on seminars for young skaters and also has many young skaters that he works with. One of my friends who coaches at the same rink said Brian took on a young skater who didn't even have double jumps two years ago, and she is now training triple axels. I don't know many coaches who in two years can take someone thru their doubles, triples and to a jump that many females would never even try let alone do. Are you all sure you know what you are talking about? :confused:
     
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  24. bek

    bek Guest

    I'm thinking too that he may switch to Orser full time once high school is up but this gives him an opportunity to try him out now before the Olympic Season.

    As for Orser not being a ground up coach..I don't know how anyone can say he can't develop young talent. Orser has just started talent, and developing a young Hanyu/ Plushenko /Kim takes years and years. And there's also the issue of finding that talent.
     
  25. ChibiChibi

    ChibiChibi Active Member

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    Yuzuru just started his senior year in high school in April, and will graduate from high school in March, 2013.
     
  26. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    I'm sorry but this is extremely hard to believe. So unless any proof can be provided...
     
  27. ProgramerUSFS

    ProgramerUSFS Member

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    Not sure how that would be possible, since it was something I heard. Not really sure if it is true or not. If it is a young unknown skater there may be no proof. Time will tell, might just have to wait and see.
     
  28. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

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    If this skater has all her triples and is training a 3A, I think we would have heard something about her by now.

    Like Ziggy, I find this hard to believe. I can certainly believe that a young skater enjoyed some improvement under his guidance, maybe even major improvement. But if Orser can take someone from no doubles to all her triples in less than two years, why couldn't he help his higher profile skaters more with their jumps?

    But this is besides the point, because Hanyu doesn't need help major help with his jumps. I'm not sure what exactly Orser is supposed to accomplish that Hanyu can't get while training in Japan, but maybe I'll be proven wrong.
     
  29. ProgramerUSFS

    ProgramerUSFS Member

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    To answer your question then, I think Hanyu or anyone would come to Orser as a coach for his experience and guidance in developing someone to the podium worlds or the Olympics. Orser has gotten himself to two Olympic medals and multiple world medals. To me a great coach is way beyond teaching elements, which don't get me wrong, are important. However, if you can't get your skaters mind to the point of competing and winning in the big events, it really doesn't matter how great you teach jumps. I am sure that their are some great coaches who teach jumps, but don't know what to do when the big day comes. All I can say is that Orser got himself to many major events and won them, and then he managed one skater to an Olympic gold and world titles. So I think that Hanyu is coming to him to gain the experience of how to prepare, to plan, and get your training and mind around being the champion before you actually compete. That is what I think Orser offers over most other coaches.

    Now concerning this young skater who is training larger jumps with Orser. You all said that Orser can't bring someone from a lower level skater to larger jumps. And I simply told you that I heard that this isn't so, and in fact this girl had come a long way very fast under Orser, therefore you must be wrong about his teaching. I was told that their was a story on the internet about her, but I haven't been able to find it. So sorry.
     
  30. JasperBoy

    JasperBoy Heading for Helsinki

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    That's it, programer. Brian knows how to train skaters to be champions. And, how to deal with disappointment, too. He's been up and down and seen it all. If anyone can teach elite skaters how to cope it is Brian O.
     
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