Which skaters are truly "legendary"...

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Fandango, Oct 25, 2013.

  1. ciocio

    ciocio Active Member

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    I think we've agreed that Yuna, Michelle, Plushenko and Yagudin are legends :D, can we find other legends too?:shuffle:
     
  2. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    IMO being a legend has less to do with popularity than what they brought to the sport (e.g. Midori Ito, Stojko, Cranston, Hamilton -as creator of SOI) and their achievements (e.g. Button, Plushenko, Yagudin, Heiss, Kwan). Achievements are not always measured with the number of titles or medals won (e.g. Janet Lynn, and some of the skaters that made the sport popular in their countries, whether they won any medals or not).

    Popularity at a certain time in history, in a certain part of the world is important, but not in defining a legend because it varies too much. It could be a small part of being a legend, but not a major part. JMO.
     
  3. riveredge

    riveredge Active Member

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    in short.. the word legendary is subjective. just like who is the greatest, etc. :D
     
  4. Meredith

    Meredith what a glorious day!

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    Thank you. :)
     
  5. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    Janet Lynn also was predominantly responsible for making free skating more valued and more important. She was the one who basically forced the immediate reduction and eventual termination of figures (although I know there are some who wish figures were still around in some form).
     
  6. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    I am glad to see the incredible B&S mentioned. I wish more people mentioned them. They combined the best of all pairs teams in history, even though they were vilified unfairly by many after the 2002 Olympics.
     
  7. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    ITA. As a big B&S fan, I often wonder what might have been, had Elena not failed the drug test after the 2000 Europeans. They could have been 3 or 4 times world champions entering the 2002 Olympics and probably Anton's minor error would not have caused such a brouhaha. Our media trashed this beautiful, talented pair. I consider them a legend because they combined the best qualities of the past great Russian pairs (R&Z, speed, G&G's unison and light movement across the ice, M&D's creativity) and their own unique abilities. Sadly they are not mentioned in the same breath as G&G, M&D and the Protopopovs.
     
  8. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

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    They probably would've won the 2000 Worlds. Going into the 2001 Worlds, I'd argue that S/P still win because of how hard Canada had been politicking them. I do think if the skating had been the same at the Olympics though, you would've seen the same trashing and they'd still be hugely underrated today. The best you can hope for is that Marie-Reine Le Gougne stands up to Stapleford's barrage and that B/S remain sole gold medalists.
     
  9. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    What is amazing is people who have seen them live often, like yourself, have even suggested their unision is slightly better than G&G's amazing unision, and their speed slightly more than Rodnina's amazing speed (while achieved with much quieter and gentler stroking and edges, although I admit there was something about the agressiveness, rawness, and attack of how Rodnina and Zaitsev skated I found exciting). That is amazing that they could be even better than the teams considered the best ever in each of their best singular qualities, combining it all, and having their own individualistic ones too. They were truly an amazing team who will never get their full due.
     
  10. hertmirsh

    hertmirsh Member

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    Elena and Anton are one of the most disrespected and mistreated great pairs of all time. Past great pairs were reverred and even allowed to win competitions with mistakes. Elena and Anton skating cleanly were not even allowed to win a competition over Baby Sale and Temper Pelletier, who are quite an average team, unless they had 3 falls or more worth of mistakes. What the skating World did to Elena and Anton in 2001 and 2002 is one of the all time crimes in skating history.
     
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  11. hertmirsh

    hertmirsh Member

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    Legendary is subjective but my choices would probably be Torvill & Dean, Yu Na Kim, Mao Asada, Midori Ito, Janet Lynn, Sonja Henie, Madge Syers, Katarina Witt, Trixi Schuba, Klimova & Ponomarenko, Gordeeva & Grinkov, Evgeny Plushenko, Kurt Browning, Dick Button the 2 Brians due to the names of their rivalry and their pro careers, Scott Hamilton, Artur Dmitriev. Irina Rodnina, Gritshuk & Platov.

    Skaters who I am split on whether they make it or not would be Kwan, Slutskaya, Virtue & Moir, Hamill, Davis & White, Fleming, Stojko, Lambiel, Takahashi, Anissina & Peizerat. Those are more borderline.
     
  12. hertmirsh

    hertmirsh Member

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    What exactly makes Michelle so superior to Yu Na?
     
  13. bardtoob

    bardtoob Well-Known Member

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    She did not skate to James Bond themes and incorporate hand gestures from Charlie's Angels.
     
  14. attyfan

    attyfan Well-Known Member

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    Do legendary skaters have to be the subject of legends? If so, what legends do they tell about each skater? (I've heard that Moskvina made up the story about Anton saving Elena from her abusive partner; and Michelle is the subject of legends, in that many think she won 2 OGMs -- solely because she is so famous, and many equate fame with the OGM)
     
  15. pat decaro

    pat decaro Member

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    That's silly.

    Kim pulled off a truly fascinating program to James Bond themes. I think it was the epitome of a camp program themed to popular culture. It testifies to her versatility and range.
     
  16. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    Five world titles & two Olympic medals vs. Two world titles & one Olympic medal (it's a Gold, however, and valued above the others)
    9 times US national champion (very different from Korean national champ same number of times, if she makes it that many times- no offense)
    Longevity
     
  17. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Julia, Elena, Anna, Liza, and Vera

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    How would she make up a story like that? There were many other skaters that SAW the abuse. There is video footage of Elena in the hospital in Riga after her accident, while skating with Shliakov. Anton did go to Riga to visit Elena in the hospital and he did accompany her to Saint Petersburg, where she slowly recovered. I am sure the support she received from Anton and Tamara helped her a lot in her recovery.
     
  18. munow

    munow New Member

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    Nothing.
     
  19. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

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    Either that or look good in Blackglama.
     
  20. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member

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    I find it interesting that many of the people who don't wish to regard Kwan as a "legendary" skater, won't acknowledge that many of their "favorites" have said that she was the person who most inspired them!
     
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  21. pat decaro

    pat decaro Member

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    I guess the majority here, including me, consider Kwan as a legend. Do you need unanimous votes?
     
  22. Blondie12

    Blondie12 New Member

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    Her longevity; to medal and to win so many world titles spanning a decade uninterrupted is not common. Indeed, to be an active competitor for so many years uninterrupted pretty much is not common for singles. We would not be having this conversation about Michelle if she got the OGM. She has everything else
     
  23. Dancin' Dream

    Dancin' Dream New Member

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    I'm a rude European, and let me tell you, when it comes to the most popular and most beloved US skater here, it's Johnny Weir, certainly not Kwawn. But what do I know, especially when it comes to the term "legendary" ... :rolleyes:
     
  24. pat decaro

    pat decaro Member

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    Agreed. But at the same time, she would not have had such a long uninterrupted career, had she won the OGM.
     
  25. bardtoob

    bardtoob Well-Known Member

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    We don't know that since she was from the first generation that was allowed to be both eligible and professional at the same time. Plushenko has won 3 Olympic medals, including gold, and wants another, and others maintain their eligibility because in this era it is more valuable than just being a pro. It is so 1992 to think a skater that has the OGM will automatically retire from eligible competition.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
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  26. Blondie12

    Blondie12 New Member

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    If Michelle would have won in Nagano, she still would have been a teenager, I think she would have tried to do a Witt and repeat. She might not have lasted till 2006 had she won in salt lake though. She likely would have retired especially if she won two OGM
     
  27. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

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    I agree Kwan was probably always staying until SLC. However I also agree she was gone if she won even 1 of Nagano or SLC. The only reason she was around beyond SLC was the elusive Olympic Gold.
     
  28. giselle23

    giselle23 Active Member

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    Didn't Michelle, when she was 14 or so, say she wanted to go to three Olympics? Not that she should be held to that, but I think she would have tried for two if she had won in 1998.
     
  29. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member

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    Michelle is one of those rare people who truly loved the challenge of competition.
     
  30. ciocio

    ciocio Active Member

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    Usually when people who do not follow FS want to find out who are the legendary figures of this sport, they check the list of OGM on Wikipedia. Right now top 10 looks like this (number of olympic medals): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_medalists_in_figure_skating.

    Gillis Grafström
    Sonja Henie
    Irina Rodnina
    Artur Dmitriev
    Pierre Brunet
    Andrée Brunet
    Evgeni Plushenko
    Sergei Ponomarenko
    Marina Klimova
    Shen Xue
    Zhao Hongbo
    Beatrix Loughran
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2013