What? No children? Fending off the final female taboo

Discussion in 'Off The Beaten Track' started by Aussie Willy, Feb 7, 2013.

  1. Rob

    Rob Beach Bum

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    She had another good one "My husband and I want to have kids before our parents get too old to raise them."

    I didn't have kids because I thought I would be a terrible parent. Always at work, no time or desire to make my life all about all their extracurricular events, no ability to take days off when they are sick. I don't regret it at all. My husband regrets it a little, but he doesn't regret that he didn't have the experience of raising a child, he regrets the "no-one to carry my name or take care of me when I am old" part. I told him once that we could have a kid if he would commit to being Mr. Mom. He wouldn't. Um, there is a guarantee that you have to take care of them, but there is no guarantee they will take care of you when you are old. They might hate you, or have no money, or move across the country to have a life of their own and not want you to move in with them.

    Plus, I think cats are a heck of a lot cuter than people at any age. My cat does what I want to do on the weekend (sleep, eat), and she does not join soccer teams or want to take ballet or piano or karate. She is very tidy, and her bathroom is easier to clean than mine is.

    And something else interesting - about 75% of my longtime female friends do not have children. Some were in dance and didn't want to get pregnant; some never met Mr. or Mrs. Right and didn't want to do it alone; but a lot of them just didn't want kids.
  2. elka_sk8

    elka_sk8 Well-Known Member

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    Slightly OT, but I read this article today about the FMLA in the US and I had no idea that companies under a certain size were exempted. So a benefit that is pretty meager to brgin with doesnt even apply to a lot of workers. Honestly, the policies in this country don't make it easy to have a career and have a kid. It's something I worry about for sure.

    http://m.washingtonpost.com/local/l...1cd468-720f-11e2-8b8d-e0b59a1b8e2a_story.html
  3. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    :respec:

    Next time I have sushi I will think of you.
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  4. Anita18

    Anita18 Well-Known Member

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    Speaking of my hypothetical school/hospital/library, I was reading Bill Gates' AMA (IAmA) Q&A on Reddit and this comment made me :wuzrobbed:

    I mean, very few of us are as rich as Bill Gates to eradicate polio worldwide, but to make such a difference in even ONE kid's life is awesome. Even if they aren't your own. :)
  5. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    Next time ask them why care so much what other people do and, clearly, if they didn't have kids, their life would have more meaning and they wouldn't be so bitter and angry that they have to nag everyone to make the same choices they did in order to make themselves feel better. ;)

    But you should definitely try sushi again. It's awesome. ;)

    There is absolutely no guarantee of this. They may grow up to hate her or to have an uneasy relationship with her as my siblings do with our mothers.

    I have made a difference in one kid's life. I inspired the kid of someone I work with to make cake pops and I gave her some of my supplies and I have a Thank You card on my desk to prove it. So there. :p
  6. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    No, it's not. Blech...
  7. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    I think you have shown your worth by this endeavour alone.
  8. Southpaw

    Southpaw Saint Smugpawski

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    Meanwhile, I still have no eyeballs. :drama:
  9. Angelskates

    Angelskates Active Member

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    That's the kind of thing that should be asked in advance though. I own a very small company (myself and two others) and there's no way I could give maternity benefits. My colleague's wife is pregnant and giving him a week off when his child is born is going to loose me money, and give ME a lot more work (that I will have to do for free). I'm not necessarily even giving him a week, I'm making sure he gets 5 consecutive days off - so if it's born on a Wednesday, he needs to be back at work the following Monday. I just can't afford it, and he knows it and completely understands. I can't afford to pay someone who isn't working, no matter how good they are at their job, they're not good for me if they can't work.
  10. elka_sk8

    elka_sk8 Well-Known Member

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    While I agree it's something that should be discussed, FMLA is unpaid leave, and it applies to more than maternity. One doesn't plan getting cancer, or having a family member get a serious illness.

    Just out of curiosity, what happens when a female in your company has a baby? Do they come back that soon too? I just wonder what women do when they cant even take unpaid leave, many daycare places don't even take babies until they're a couple months old.
  11. maatTheViking

    maatTheViking Well-Known Member

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    I totally get that it is a big burden for small companies, but I find it odd that you are not entitled to leave without pay at least, and some compensation from the government if your company doesn't pay? I wonder why it doesn't work in the US, but many European companies have longer maternity and paternity leaves? (with no exceptions) I can only assume that the difference in law is followed up with a difference in who foots the bill as well?
    I know that when my sister in law gave birth, she was running her own company with no employees, and she basically got unemployment rate from the state for her leave (which was 6-8 months).

    What if you have a female employee giving birth? It would be physically impossible to return to work 5 days after birth, IMHO.

    Btw, out of curiosity, what do yo do if one of you employees get the flu - a real flu can leave you unable to get out of bed for 10-14 days (or any other longer medical issue, but the flu is relatively common and severe)
  12. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    It's because you are childless. Or maybe it's because you don't like sushi. ;)
  13. Angelskates

    Angelskates Active Member

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    The females in my company either have a child and won't have more (she's Chinese) or know the deal (that's me) and will plan accordingly, not that it's an issues. I could not afford to keep someone's job open for unpaid leave, because it costs money for me to employ a new person (visas, bringing them over etc.). My company can only sponsor two foreign visas (by law), mine and someone else's. If that someone else can't work, they need to be replaced.

    I've explained about the females above. I own a foreign company (in Beijing) so the government doesn't pay anything. If someone had a long illness, longer than a week, they would know I would need to replace them. It hasn't happened yet, but everyone signed the contract. If the sick person was me, I would also be on unpaid leave, and would do my best to find a temporary replacement already in Beijing (my visa can't be cancelled since I am the owner, so I wouldn't be able to sponsor another visa), but if I couldn't I would have to cut costs significantly, make some big changes, or fold the business, to be able to cope. It's just the way it is, and everyone knows it. Even me taking one day off loses money (because I have to cancel clients). Small companies have it tough, so it can be tough for the employees as well. The benefits outweigh the disadvantages though, because I've had the same team since I began. But, for me, I would still never choose to work for a big company. My situation seems unique, yet many who set up small businesses here have exactly the same issues, and we deal with them the best we can.
  14. Yazmeen

    Yazmeen Well-Known Member

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    In my mid-fifties. Childless by choice, not a maternal bone in my body, possibly influenced by my own contentious relationship with my mother as an adult. Married a man who also had no interest in children. We are self-employed professionals with two cats we spoil and adore. We like the freedom to work at odd hours, make decisions to do things with last-minute planning, skate and participate in other activities, and travel quite a bit. We love our lives.

    Whenever I'm asked how we've been married so long (coming up on 28 years) and together for so long (10 years longer), we're always quick to mention that amongst other factors, we are childless, because we know it made things much easier for us financially, work-wise and otherwise. According to some, we are "selfish," but we have no regrets. Best decision we ever made for us.
  15. Badams

    Badams Well-Known Member

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    I will never understand why people care so much about why others choose to not have kids, even going as far as singing the praises of kids/parenthood to completely uninterested people. Just like I will never understand people who are childless by choice caring enough to prove the awesomeness of their decision by completely belittling parents and trashing all kids. Who has time for such ridiculous behavior? Aren't there more interesting things to insult each other about?
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  16. Southpaw

    Southpaw Saint Smugpawski

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    People who like Beef on Weck are stoopid.
  17. my little pony

    my little pony snarking for AZE

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    what is a weck?
  18. milanessa

    milanessa engaged to dupa

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    Screw you.

    :eek:
  19. Badams

    Badams Well-Known Member

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    :lol: you might apprecite it more with a tall glass of brown Jersey water, no?
  20. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    And sushi. ;)
  21. mag

    mag Well-Known Member

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    This.
    Although I suppose one could argue that both sides are just being refreshingly honest ....
    IMHO, Rudeness disguised as honesty is still rudeness no matter what reality TV tries to get us to believe.
  22. susan6

    susan6 Well-Known Member

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    Are you from Buffalo?

    Back to the thread....where might one find a guy who doesn't want kids? I have no maternal instinct at all, and that's a deal-breaker for a lot of guys. Granted, give it enough time and my only options will be divorcees in their 50s or 60s who have kids with their first wife, so they won't care if I don't want kids. Oh well.
  23. michiruwater

    michiruwater Well-Known Member

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    I dunno. I tried putting on my online dating profile in clear language that there is a high probability that I will never, ever want children, and that if that is a priority they should move on, but it seems like half the men who contact me don't read the profile and the other half believe I'm just kidding when I point out that their profile says they want kids and I don't.
  24. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    Men never read profiles properly.
  25. MacMadame

    MacMadame Internet Beyotch

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    I think they only look at the pictures. Michiruwater must be pretty. :)
  26. Japanfan

    Japanfan Well-Known Member

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    I understand where you're coming from as a self-employed person, Angelskates. My business situation is different from yours in that it is part-time/contract work, so it might work out for someone with a baby who wanted to work from home. Two of my assistants were stay-home moms.

    But there is really no such thing as 'sick time' in my business as it is work done on deadlines. A dead-line can't be broken once its committed too barring death or accidental dismemberment and I expect my assistant to come through even if she gets a migraine, which she does on occasion, or a sudden flu. And she does. If I get sick, I still have to work. Fortunately I don't get sick, pretty much ever.
  27. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

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    I've never wanted children, for the following reason (and yes, I'm a gay male):

    To me, parenting is about the most important job one can have. I know myself well enough to know that I wouldn't be good at it. (Plus, I've never had any real desire to be a parent, so it all works out.)
  28. Bunny Hop

    Bunny Hop Accept no substitutes

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    Both these drive me nuts. For the first, I've never claimed otherwise. I'm sure it's true. As my mother (who also isn't that maternal) says "Mother nature takes care of these things", but that's not a reason to have a child. As for changing my mind - I'm 42, it ain't happening. Oh, and I don't like sushi either.
    This sort of relates to something I have trouble explaining to people who adore babies and children, namely that I don't have any emotional reaction to children. I don't have a negative reaction, but I also so don't have the "Awwwww" reflex many women get for babies. They're just babies, or small children. It's taken me years to train myself to say "Oh, isn't he/she lovely" in a sincere manner upon being shown a friend's baby.
    Ugh. I will never understand how not having children is considered 'selfish'. I have had a couple of people ask me why I bothered getting married if I didn't want children. I find that attitude appalling, as if the only reason to get married is to spawn. What about commitment to your partner? If the only reason to marry someone is for their breeding use, then to me that doesn't say very much about the strength of the relationship. I'm not talking about wanting to be married before having children, that's different, just the idea that the only purpose of marriage is children.
  29. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

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    These are probably the same people who object to gay marriage because they think that the only reason for marriage is to procreate.
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  30. antmanb

    antmanb Well-Known Member

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    You just haven't met the right fish yet ;)
  31. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    There should probably be a clause that says couples have to seperate after 3 years of marriage if they haven't produced a child.
  32. Southpaw

    Southpaw Saint Smugpawski

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    All you people who keep poking at me with the sushi jabs....you're hoping I'm gonna pull out my left hook, arentcha?

    :paintsnails:
  33. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

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    Ouch.
  34. Anita18

    Anita18 Well-Known Member

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    But it's true! :lol: 80% of the responses I got (and I met Alf online) said "I love dancing and going to bars!" and I specifically said I didn't do bars or clubs and I don't drink! :p
  35. Yazmeen

    Yazmeen Well-Known Member

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    The "you are missing out" philosophy almost cost me a friendship. One of my dearest friends in high school has a son (now grown), and every time we had a conversation, it was all about how wonderful it is being a mom, you just won't know until you have a child, I can't believe you don't want one, ad nauseum. The family holiday letter was a treacle-filled read of everything her darling did, way up until he was in high school, and she is a writer; let's just say these weren't shining examples of her ability. Thankfully we don't live anywhere near each other. Every call or email was always about how much I was "missing out" on. I basically avoided her for her for the most part. We are know Facebook friends and keep more in touch; however, I don't think she ever realized why I wasn't exactly going out of my way to keep in touch previously (you can't exactly say, "will you please shut up about your kid and stop telling me what I'm missing??? I don't exactly hold my vacations over your head and claim how much you are missing out on because your time and finances all went to having a child" as much as I may have been sorely tempted).
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  36. UGG

    UGG Well-Known Member

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    Some people are like that with their pets, too. My one friend one time (before having children) talked to me about her dog for almost 2 hours. I actually left her at the restaurant saying that I had an emergency. I was seriously going to stab myself.

    Also before I had my son I would be SO BORED when my friends would talk about their kids or kid related topics. Like...seriously bored beyond belief.

    Now that I am a mom, I could talk about my son all day if someone let me. I try NOT to talk about him with my friends who do not have children because I think back about my boredom during car seat discussions or formula, or how I thought it was weird that people talked about their kids poop...etc...but it is hard because my life revolves around him.

    And every mother thinks their kid is special and the most amazing child ever and I have to crack up at the people who find this ridiculous. OMG it is their kid...what are they supposed to think? LOL
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2013
  37. PrincessLeppard

    PrincessLeppard Well-Known Member

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    But my cats are interesting! You would understand if you would just spend some time with them!
  38. UGG

    UGG Well-Known Member

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    LOL! One year for work I made my co workers a calendar of my dog. I wonder what they were thinking.
  39. ioana

    ioana Well-Known Member

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    Nonsense! UGG needs to spend time with *my* cat and she'll be a convert in no time :lol:.
  40. UGG

    UGG Well-Known Member

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    ha! The funny thing is I really don't like cats! That would be funny if someone actually told me to spend time with a cat to see if I would change my mind.