Virtue & Moir vs Davis & White- the best rivalry in skating ever in any discipline?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by judgejudy27, Feb 13, 2012.

?

Virtue & Moir vs Davis & White- best rivalry ever

  1. yes

    30.4%
  2. no

    69.6%
  1. Karpenko

    Karpenko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    9,287
    Give me Grishuk & Platov vs Krylova & Ovsiannikov any day of the week. And in any discipline? Good lord I'm just going to bow out now. :slinkaway
     
  2. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2006
    Messages:
    13,468
    Krylova & Ovsiannikov never beat Gritschuk & Platov. Not even once. Skaters have to be rivals for it be a rivalry. Maria Butyrskaya and Nicole Bobek were even closer to being rivals to Michelle Kwan than K&O or anyone after 94 was to G&P.
     
  3. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,582
    I was going to say the same thing. K&O would have had to have beaten G&P at least once to even call it a rivalry but they didn't. As a result, it was a domination on G&P's part, not a rivalry.
     
  4. EBASKoroleva

    EBASKoroleva New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,675
  5. berthesghost

    berthesghost Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,891
    Some people need to invest in a good dictionary. :lol:
     
  6. PashaFan

    PashaFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    671
    K/O beat G/P in the OD at the 1998 Europeans but lost the Gold.
    I'm with Karpenko on this-it was still a great rivalry-IMO. Everyone who watched the two couples had a different view.
    Also for me Sale/Pelletier V Berezhnaya /Sikharludize was a great rivalry.
    Yagudin V Plushenko was better also.
    I know Lipinski V Kwan only lasted a few years but it was still exciting.
    Butyrskaya V Slutskaya-being in Europe-also very good.
    IMO it's way too early to call the V/M V D/W rivalry the best. It's good to watch but does not have the magic yet.
     
  7. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2006
    Messages:
    13,468
    So they beat them once in the OD when G/P fell. What an amazing rivalry. :lol: Even Maria Butyrskaya beat Michelle Kwan in the short program in probably about 8 of their competitions, and you would never hear anyone call that a great rivalry.

    I actually thought K/O were good enough to be more of rivals to G/P than they were, but the pecking order within their country eliminated any chance of that happening.
     
  8. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    12,452
    A rivalry is when both teams need to work more to beat the other one, and not when titles are well distributed. So, IMO, G&P and K&O can be considered as a rivalry. But it was not a rivalry with much suspens ! lol
     
  9. pani

    pani Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2005
    Messages:
    8,649
    D-W and V-M didnt work hard?
    I dont want to say this is best rivaliry,but i dont understand your argue.
    I see only one thing - a lot off people still in 90th and didnt like today reality.
    G-P and K-O wasnt rivaliry, becasue at that time if you won 1 time you will wim untill you will retier. ;) So K-O didnt have chance to be on top untill G-P retier.
    Its like B-B and K-P rivaliry IMHO.
     
  10. nuge

    nuge Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2001
    Messages:
    4,032
    Well I liked the short rivalry between A/P -FP/M :)

    Also the rivalry between N/K and Denstas who should have won in 04:kickass:
     
  11. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    12,452
    ???
    I was answering to judgejudy to say that, IMO, G&P vs. K&O can be considered as a rivalry. I didn't say anything about V&M and D&W ! ;)
     
  12. kwanette

    kwanette Fetalized since 1998

    Joined:
    May 26, 2002
    Messages:
    2,636
     
  13. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,582
     
  14. kwanette

    kwanette Fetalized since 1998

    Joined:
    May 26, 2002
    Messages:
    2,636
     
  15. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,582
     
  16. rosebrallier

    rosebrallier New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2011
    Messages:
    20
    While D&W vs V&M is amazingly competitive and beautiful to watch, I don't find them dramatic enough personally to qualify as the greatest rivalry. Weir and Lysacek were far more adept at drawing the press and making a big hullabaloo (mostly just Johnny, for all I love him; Evan got dragged into it quite nicely though).
    So definitely among the best professional rivalries, but in terms of a personal rivalry, I don't see our beloved ice dancers going down in any record books.
     
  17. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2006
    Messages:
    13,468
    Kwan did not make a serious error at the 2000 Worlds and 2002 GPF. A wobbly landing on one foot is not a serious error, but a minor one without even a mandatory deduction (and she was never beating Maria in the 2000 Worlds SP regardless). Also your count is wrong. Maria also beat Michelle in the SP at the 97 GPF, 97 Worlds, 94 Goodwill Games, so now adding it up that is atleast 7. It doesnt matter whether she skated perfectly each time or not, it still means Maria did a better program each time. If one discounted when there was errors that would discount almost every competition Maria ever did, and thus she would have almost never really lost a competition to anyone. :lol:

    My point of course was not to suggest Maria was in anyway a serious rival to Michelle Kwan. It was to show how extremely little K/O beating G/P once ever in the shorter dance means. In fact it only emphasizes more what a non rivalry it was.
     
  18. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    12,452
    Wheeee !
    This thread is turning into a Kwan thread ! :cheer2:
     
  19. Karpenko

    Karpenko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2003
    Messages:
    9,287
    Just because K/O never beat G/P doesn't mean that they didn't have a rivalry. IIRC both teams were good friends at one point, then towards the end when G/P left Linichuk for Tarasova K/O wanted to overtake them before Nagano and I remember on more than one occasion, Anjelika being absolutely PISSED (and I mean watch their Carmen, Anjelika Krylova being pissed is the only skater that can compete with Babs in scariness) that they had finished 2nd. They also didn't have the COP to help even out the playing field back then. They were both miles ahead of all of the other teams in 96-98 IMO (just as the top 2 are now) and the perforamnces they both gave in each competition they entered far outshined any fake over the top 10's that judges are just handing out these days. Not to discredit the top 2 ice dance teams at the moment, I just felt like performance-wise, G&P vs K&O rivalry had so much more depth and excitement.
     
  20. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2009
    Messages:
    4,664
    Of course, while V/M and D/W is a great and exciting rivalry, I wouldn't call it "the best ever." Particularly in ice dance, I believe there have been a number of great rivalries, that unfortunately weren't allowed to play out that way because of the entrenched political scoring system that tended to affect ice dancing more than the other disciplines.

    A case in point (before I've read other posts in this thread) is the close competitions between Klimova/Ponomarenko and Usova/Zhulin, where K/P always came out on top regardless. U/Z actually deserved to win over K/P at some point before having to wait for them to retire!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mdij7eJeEzY

    This was a great performance that should have probably won U/Z their first World championship (before they eventually won in 1993). Looking back, I see the Duchesnays won Worlds over K/P and U/Z in 1991, so D/D were also in the rivalry mix in those years. D/D were exciting to watch but did not have the polish and tech skills of K/P and U/Z.
     
  21. dinakt

    dinakt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2008
    Messages:
    3,826
    The fun thing about V/M vs D/W rivalry is that it is happening NOW and it is likely to continue for the next couple of years.
    To me, the greatest emotional rivalry is Yagudin vs Plushenko. In fact, there was so much emotion ( mine, yes, but also public's emotion in general) invested in it, that it continues to this day. Yagudin won short-term ( and my heart still sings thinking of his perfiormances at SLC), while Plushenko is winning in terms of longevity. It was so epic, it is always in the background.
    The other rivalries mentioned , IMO, are comparable to D/W vs V/M rivalry, and D/W/V/M have a chance to surpass them. Scott heat it up with his comments, and who knows what the future brings? FUN to see! ( the fan wars are certainly reaching the epic level, even without NA vs Europe dilemma)
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2012
  22. luna_skater

    luna_skater Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2002
    Messages:
    2,056
    I think I have a hard time considering V/M and D/W a "rivalry" because they're just so darn NICE to each other! No disparaging remarks in interviews, no death glares, no sex skandals. Where's the excitement?! What's happened to ice dance?! :p
     
  23. ~tapdancer~

    ~tapdancer~ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2006
    Messages:
    5,083
    It's the kinder, gentler world of ice dance. :p
     
  24. DORISPULASKI

    DORISPULASKI Watching submarine races

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2002
    Messages:
    9,900
    Absolutely agree. U&Z were 1st in the compulsories, and IMO, should have been 1st in the OSP as well. I could not believe the Duchesnays won the OSP with this skate.

    D&D OSP
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aYAGtNxrh8&feature=related

    U&Z FD
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8nCNYjDhng

    The Canadian commentators thought they should have won with this FD. The audience were shocked too.
     
  25. allezfred

    allezfred Prick Admin Staff Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2003
    Messages:
    43,014
    It sucks. And not the good way either. :p
     
  26. rosebrallier

    rosebrallier New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2011
    Messages:
    20
    ^^This.
     
  27. kia_4EverOnIce

    kia_4EverOnIce New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2005
    Messages:
    434
    Yagudin VS Plushenko...what's best? plus, we had also all the extra backstage fights (aka Mishin vs Tarasova) :)