Virtue and Moir #38: Simply Timeless

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Golightly, Mar 3, 2014.

  1. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

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    That s great I hope many people like her Speak up
     
  2. Wyliefan

    Wyliefan Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I don't know. I can see a well-done ballet number going over well. It might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I would think a lot of show audiences would enjoy it.
     
  3. *Ice Princess*

    *Ice Princess* Member

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    The most yes. :-/
     
  4. Prancer

    Prancer Jawwalking Staff Member

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    :confused:

    I would think that whether something is insulting or not depends on 1) who is reading it and 2) how accurate it is--which, on a forum like this, would depend on who is reading it. I would say there are five people on this entire forum whom I would consider capable of making an accurate and objective technical analysis of ice dance performances, and I've seen all five of them accused of insulting skaters.

    I can't think of too many people on this forum who have been admin slapped for insulting a skater, so I'm not sure why I am being asked, but there you are.
     
  5. Golightly

    Golightly Well-Known Member

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    No, maybe I phrased it wrong. What I meant was that, often, when we talk ice dance, some of us try to explain why we consider D-W to be a lesser team. My question was, is that valid in here? Obviously, some people do not like to read it. If it stayed there, we'd be good. Instead, the debate goes beyond the ice dance ground when people (trolls) from both sides start accusing skater X of being this or skater Y being that. That is what, to me, is uncalled for, not the ice dance debate, which I have always found interesting.
     
  6. Shayii

    Shayii Well-Known Member

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  7. shine

    shine Well-Known Member

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    Thank you.
     
  8. Prancer

    Prancer Jawwalking Staff Member

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    I don't think anyone in the entire history of FSU (even before it was FSU) has ever objected to technical analysis.

    Or I should say, I don't think anyone in the entire history of FSU has ever been admin slapped for technical analysis. Posters here object to everything.

    I think you're still kind of missing our point about what is objectionable. No one cares if you don't like D&W's skating or personalities or anything else. And we don't care if people don't like Tessa and Scott or their skating, either. Sometimes we think a lot of you are stark raving crazy--and by "you" I don't mean V&M fans particularly, but pretty much everyone who posts in uber threads and an unhealthy percentage of people who hang out in The Trash Can all the time. I think it's :lol: when someone goes from one uber thread to another to call those other ubers crazy, but then I must concede that it's likely that person would know.

    I also think the term "troll" is overused and poorly applied by people in this forum (not thread, note--forum). A troll is, technically, a post that is made with deliberate intent to stir people up. That seems simple enough--except that it's really easy to stir people up unintentionally by making an absolutely sincere post. So I am often not sure what a troll is, particularly when I see it being used as what seems to mean "any post that doesn't agree with the groupthink here." Take, for example, the snark earlier, that D&W fans who like V&M should post about D&W only in their thread and only about V&M in this thread. Okay; so what about V&M fans who post about D&W here? Is that okay if you are a certified, card-carrying V&M-only fan but not if you are a fan of both? Or is it only okay to post about D&W here if you are saying something negative about them? Or....well, you get the picture. One of the things that makes me craziest about these threads is that people complain about things like people posting in them when they aren't real fans of X. There is no fan test and I am not at all interested in sorting out who is a true fan and who is just a partial fan and who is not a fan but pretending to be a fan, etc. I don't care enough. You may get all worked up about something someone said in a post somewhere else at some other point in time--just don't expect me to.

    Sometimes we are accused of being one-sided in the way we handle things. Sometimes that's true. And when it is, there are reasons for it. Over the years, we have been contacted by lawyers, assorted government agencies, the FBI,the USFS, and angry family members of skaters, and sometimes that affects the way we handle things, depending on what is being threatened and by whom. We aren't going to tell posters about such things because we can't. Sometimes we anticipate such things; sometimes posters are saying things that we know are issues because they have been issues in the past and are likely to be again, even if the same skaters aren't involved in the discussion. There are a lot of scenarios that can come into play. Things can only be equal when ALL things are equal and that is never the case.

    All of which brings me to three points:

    1. No admin WANTS to be in these threads. We would prefer to leave you to it. I do not consider this a good time.
    2. Nothing we have said comes from the foundation of being D&W fans. I for one don't even like ice dancing, in large part, quite frankly, because of all the :argue: and :soapbox: about it on this board, which is a real turnoff for me. I am tired, however, of having everything I say interpreted as some kind of defense of D&W and I am done with people arguing with me about it.
    3. If we tell you that we are concerned about libel, it is because we have some reason to be concerned about libel; you don't get to know what that reason is and there is no point in your speculating about it, as you will never know. I will tell you that no one from the D&W camp has contacted us about anything said in your thread, because you are all paranoid enough to think that is true and take it as fact and probably will even though I have just told you straight out that no one from the D&W camp has contacted us about anything said in your thread. Other than that, I have nothing to say about it. But when we say, "do not accuse D&W or their coach of colluding without solid evidence," and "do not accuse specific judges of unethical behavior without solid evidence," that is precisely what we mean, no more and no less. You can talk about their crappy skating, crappy costumes, crappy personalities, whatever. You can engage in technical analysis to your heart's content. You can complain about unfair judging, you can mourn the loss of credibility in skating (I will laugh when I read that, but I won't stop you), you can complain about how everyone is out to get you, you can trash D&W fans--I don't care. There is no broad issue here. It's very specific--knock off on making accusations of illegal and/or unethical behavior on the part of specific people unless you have some proof. Otherwise, we don't care.
     
    carolina and (deleted member) like this.
  9. professordeb

    professordeb Well-Known Member

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    Ohhhh, Love Parada AKA Heart Attack. I loved that dance by Shae & Vic -- & Dean!
     
  10. sequins

    sequins Active Member

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    My absolute fave from them. I too would love to see what Chris Dean could do for them.
     
  11. liv

    liv Well-Known Member

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    I would hope they stay far away from Dean. His choreography is evident from miles away and , IMHO, would not suit them. His numbers all look very similar, no mattere who skates them. And, personally, I haven't really ever liked much of his choreography, other than the amateur stuff he and Jane did.
     
  12. kosjenka

    kosjenka Well-Known Member

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    Not even what he choreographed for Duchesnays?
     
  13. geoskate

    geoskate Well-Known Member

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    This is pretty much full-on ballet, and it seemed to be very well-received (Beethoven 'Spring[ Sonata). (This is the barre program that manhn was mentioning earlier in the thread). This was in South Korea, where classical music is quite popular. I'm not sure it would go over quite so well in Canada, but I think it would be worth a try. It would certainly be a good contrast to whatever else is being skated by the other performers.

    I think that now they could do an even better job of a program like this than they did back then.
     
  14. Shayii

    Shayii Well-Known Member

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    Who choreographed this number? It's so cute! I love how they incorporated the bar with the lifts.
     
  15. sap5

    sap5 Well-Known Member

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  16. puglover

    puglover Active Member

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    What would you guys think of a David Wilson ex? I believe he did the free dance for the Spanish team coached by Marie France and Patrice that has been so appreciated this season.
     
  17. Shayii

    Shayii Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the answer and posting the video of KP. Loved it.
    I think that would be great. Didn't he do Jack and Diane? I can't wait to see who Tessa and Scott ask to choreograph their Exs for SOI. I would personally like them to work with Shae-Lynn--I just can't get that imagine out of my head.
     
  18. chantilly

    chantilly Active Member

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    I love David wilson. Some people diss him here but I think he's incredible. He is great at telling story through choreography and can elicit a lot of emotion. However I think I would also love to see Tessa and Scott choreograph their own piece. I hope they still compete. Take two years off and then come back. If it looks like at that point they won't beat I and K then don't compete anymore.
     
  19. Bue

    Bue Active Member

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    Yes! His Somewhere in Time for D/L was also a fabulous piece. Sigh... still wish V/M would have gone with that for their musical choice this season.

    OK this interview was a little cringey... I don't know who this host is but calling Meryl and Charlie "not very nice people" was just too much. She appeared to be basing her entire opinion on some edited shots of Meryl from the reality show. Scott handled it as well as you can handle something so super awkward, I suppose.
     
  20. Emdee

    Emdee Well-Known Member

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    I have never cared for Meryl's body language any time VM won. If you look at all those podiums you will see that....going back to the Olys.
     
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  21. lauravvv

    lauravvv Well-Known Member

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    To tell the truth, I haven't noticed anything out of place. But I bet that every time when Meryl and Charlie won some of their fans saw something wrong with Tessa and/or Scott's body language ;).
     
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  22. princeton123

    princeton123 Member

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    Like Tessa and Scott's body language was that great any time they came second? It's an athlete trying to cover disappointment- it's nothing to prosecute them over.
     
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  23. Wyliefan

    Wyliefan Well-Known Member

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    I LOVE that one. :swoon: Such a clever concept, and so beautifully put together and skated. Plus the music and the costumes are perfect.
     
  24. Cherub721

    Cherub721 YEAH!

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    Cool. Was that inspiration discussed in an interview?

    Now I'm curious who choreographed each of their programs. Is there a list? I couldn't find one on their official site or wiki. It seems like all the info is buried in different interviews and blurbs... annoying. I might try to work on my own list.
     
  25. *Ice Princess*

    *Ice Princess* Member

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  26. Emdee

    Emdee Well-Known Member

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    Actually TS body language on the podium was always proper....

    Not prosecuting nor complaining but just saying....

    After all Scott was skewered for his piss off comment.
     
  27. princeton123

    princeton123 Member

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    Thanks! Tessa looks positively radiant - she really is so beautiful.

    As are Meryl and Charlie's...

    Can you specifically point to an example of them being ungracious or dismissive on the podium?
     
  28. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

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    I thought they acted proper on the podium. It shows they have grown so much and it iss nice to see Scott bring the fun back into the games. I don't blame Meryl and Chartlie if they felt abit jealous of Tessa and Scott that day on the podium and/or afterwards at the Moscow show. Tessa and Scott have this very charismatic quality that they happen to inadvertantly steal the show even when they are just being themselves
     
  29. princeton123

    princeton123 Member

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    I think Tessa and Scott acted fine on the podium too, just like I think Meryl and Charlie have acted fine whenever they came second. Sometimes smiles don't always reach the eyes but I don't begrudge any athlete a moment of disappointment up there. It's not like either teams have ever looked very visibly annoyed or like... wrenched their silver medal off in protest or anything. I don't really know what emdee is talking about. Both teams have been perfectly gracious to each other on the podium, not just at this competition, but all of the times they've competed against each other.

    As for the second part of your comment, I'm not sure why Meryl and Charlie would feel jealous exactly..? The Russian response to their gold medal was certainly very tepid, but the Russian response to everything not Russian was very tepid.
     
  30. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

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    I said so in my previous comment - because V/M inadvertantly steal the show (but that is only one reason) as in "get all the attention and praise at an event or performance". Why is it that it was Virtue and Moir trending higher on twitter than the champions Or I/K who the audience loved? I would be also jealous if my time to shine was overshadowed by someone else (espeicially if they happens to be vastly superior in skill than I ). It is perfectly normal.