Virtue and Moir 29 - Classical and elegant

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by pani, Jun 24, 2013.

  1. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    998
    Yeah the way they addressed it was very unprofessional.
     
  2. professordeb

    professordeb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2001
    Messages:
    3,816
    RE: the bolded part.

    Ding ding ding! We have a winner. For all that these two attempt to be professional in their interviews -- and to be honest I thought they had been doing a pretty good job til that point -- it just comes across as gossipy. It's more the tone of what was said -- and unsaid.
     
  3. aliona22

    aliona22 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2007
    Messages:
    210
    more than a small minority have been on and off this bandwagon, especially after salt lake. seems ridiculous to consider v/m in this context however, considering how talented they are. i do often wonder why chan gets the "chanflation" and v/m don't, when they are as much on "another level" in terms of ss as chan among the male skaters, and certainly more consistent.

    i dislike the patriotism aspect of competitive figure skating; in major dance companies you would rarely seen an audience clamoring for an individual's success based on nationality, over performance ability and skills.
     
    Cherub721 and (deleted member) like this.
  4. Carmen Ovsiannikov

    Carmen Ovsiannikov Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2001
    Messages:
    8,165
    I can't be only because Tessa and Scott are Canadian. B&K and D&L of course were Canadian but while some fans found B&K overrated there were just as many (if not more) who vehemently defended them. Even the American press lacking any dance team of their own to promote took up the cause of B&K. And D&L while not as popular as B&K were, were given their due and none of their placements were questioned.

    I'm really taken aback (although I shouldn't be by now) with how V&M have been treated this entire quad thus far. I've never seen a team who skates at the level Tessa and Scott do subjected to the constant negativity they have been. That includes ridiculous speculation and made up stories about their personal lives. I lost a great deal of respect for Jenny Kirk after that podcast. Heck, perhaps I should offer to be interviewed about the icedance competition as I have just as much "knowledge" as Jenny's partner in that interview (been an icedance fan for almost 30 years). Actually if we are pushing it that far I can name a few posters here on FSU who are far more knowledeable than both Jenny and her partner who IMO is nothing more than a fan with a blog. Jenny should have known better and ITA if that conversation was about any team other than V&M it would have cause a huge blow up.
     
  5. Rotation

    Rotation New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2013
    Messages:
    13
  6. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,836
  7. Bournekraatzfan

    Bournekraatzfan New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2005
    Messages:
    1,748
    Great post and welcome to the boards:)
    That is exactly what bothered me about it. Jenny says the stop was "suspect" (what was so suspect about it?) and passes Tessa's condition off as the normal physiological responses a figure skater experiences during a program. She should have waited to learn the reason for the stoppage rather than assume and tell others that it was basically just a break due to fatigue. I expected more from her. And her sidekick is just ridiculous!

    I have to agree. Admittedly, i have been reluctant to see this because i have loved D&W since their first year in seniors and i really do enjoy rooting for both teams. But if i am being honest, V&M are far superior in terms of their skating skills (with P&B being closest to them in rhis respect, imo), yet they sometimes lose this category of the PCS to D&W. I could understand that more if D&W had more complex programs but the opposite is true (V&M better demonstrate "multidirectional skating" with several seamless changes of direction, and they have wider variety and greater complexity in their transitions). When i look at the compression and extension of the knees, the use of the edge (frequency of use, depth of edge, and edge control) and the amplitude of the patterns, there is a big difference between the two teams. This is apparent in how the two teams use momentum in the program. D&W maintain incredible speed throughout by using their exceptionally quick feet to take crossovers and Meryl sometimes use her toe picks to do the same. V&M vary their speed and suspend their momentum and then rebuild it instantaneously by using the compression and extension of their knees. Also, D&W tend to assist their edges more with their body weight (ie. they shift their bodies to the right for a right outside edge) whereas V&M have greater ankle flexion that allows their upper bodies better range and steadiness.

    I promise this is not an insult to D&W or any other team as they are all incredibly talented. I just think that V&M, like others have said, are a once-in-a-generation kind of team.

    Also, thanks for the info, Rotation, and welcome to the boards!
     
    Cherub721 and (deleted member) like this.
  8. icefan1005

    icefan1005 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2013
    Messages:
    129
    I think jealousy from peers/non-fans has always been a factor for V/M, but it really is ridiculous how obvious it has been this quad. It's terrible how V/M, who are a once-in-a-generation team, continue to experience this. I do wonder if others like the greats and skating experts (who recognize how brilliant V/M are) have also felt the negative treatment of V/M this quad. Didn't Zhulin say something after Worlds iirc?
     
  9. Macassar88

    Macassar88 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,836
    The skaters (besides Davis and White) all say that Virtue and Moir are the best or that they wish they could skate like Tessa and Scott. The only confused ones seem to be the judges and Marina...
     
  10. girlscouse62

    girlscouse62 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2012
    Messages:
    627
    I honestly believe some of Marina's apparent disinterest in Tess and Scott can be attributed to the fact that they are definite about retiring after this year. She has another team , D/W, who have not said they are retiring, and are potentially WCh's for a couple more years. I would think, financially, this is where the bottom line comes for her. But that's pure speculation on my part and definitely quite a cynical opinion!
     
  11. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    998
  12. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2011
    Messages:
    1,592
    I think D/W are definitely retiring after Sochi/Tokyo, though.
     
  13. lauravvv

    lauravvv Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,431
    I agree with Proustable that D/W will probably go to Worlds after Sochi, but will not continue for more seasons. I actually think that those who have said (something like) that Marina would rather like to have two Olympic Champions attached to her name, than just one, are right.
     
  14. MissJD

    MissJD Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2013
    Messages:
    431
    Hey everyone!! I've been reading the boards for a while now for news/ updates, but I avoided posting to avoid the drama. (As if that's even possible when you're a figure skating fan!) Anyway, the suspense for the music choices is killing me, so I finally gave in and decided to join the posting. I'll keep the intro short: I'm American. I looooove V/M. I'm planning to see them at either Skate Canada or Nationals this year (still working that out). Carmen was my favorite program EVER. And I'm stoked for Olympic year, but sad that it's the last. My greatest wish is that this year the judges grow/ find/ have implanted enough brain cells to reward V/M's brilliance! :D
     
  15. frisette70

    frisette70 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Messages:
    238
  16. Shayii

    Shayii Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,874
    Was a bit behind, but caught up now. I'm not sure the hate V/M get is linked to them being Canadian. Maybe some of it, but I'm not seeing that as the main reason. Macassar, I think Marina does see it, but maybe feels there's nothing she can do about it. She has to come across fairly to both teams so she can't throw one under the bus.

    Thanks for the pictures guys! Where is Bouch BTW?

    Welcome! I'm also trying to plan how to go to nationals. At first my first goal was Skate Canada, but I was obviously being delusional as I didn't have the financial means for that specific event (well I thought someone else would foot the bill, but I got a no lol). I actually looked for a job (and surprisingly got it) because I want to go so badly. I thought flight prices from California to Ontario would be rather pricey, but they're not. I really hope it happens!!
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2013
  17. bbkenn

    bbkenn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2002
    Messages:
    1,266
    I have noticed this too. It always made sad.
     
  18. frisette70

    frisette70 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Messages:
    238
     
  19. professordeb

    professordeb Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2001
    Messages:
    3,816
    Just loved the photos by JMG.

    As for why Tessa & Scott are getting the short end of things. My guess is that if D/W were NOT Americans and the U.S.'s best hope for a medal at the Olympics, you would not see so much bashing and anti-V/M -- at least not around here. I still have a difficult time looking back on last season and the results considering how the season started.

    I'm also thinking that Maria is looking to have the "2 different Olympian champions" to put on her resume by this time next season. The key word here is different. IMO, if she had one team win Olympic gold twice, it could look like she was able to carry the momentum of one team through multiple seasons. To me, that would show her brilliance.
     
  20. sap5

    sap5 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 16, 2006
    Messages:
    7,916
    Since she's already had one team win Olympic gold twice, maybe she feels she's already shown her brilliance in that area.
     
  21. lauravvv

    lauravvv Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,431
    She was their choreographer, not their coach. There is a difference.
     
  22. bbkenn

    bbkenn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2002
    Messages:
    1,266
    I can't wait to see them skate again!!!
     
  23. parapluies

    parapluies Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2012
    Messages:
    998
    Same. I can't wait for them to announce their music the suspense is killing me.
     
  24. Rotation

    Rotation New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2013
    Messages:
    13
    Do they usually announce their music? I honestly can't remember :confused: ! Do we usually just find out at high performance camp?
     
  25. Jeanne7

    Jeanne7 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2013
    Messages:
    114
    Listened to only a short piece of Jenny Kirk & her bizarre blogger partner's (who pretends to be an expert) nasty podcast & that was enough. She is an unfortunate & unmemorable ex-skater desperately seeking a few minutes of fame through gossip. She uses insinuates that V/M's stoppage at 4CC was "suspect" & somehow linked to their rivalry with D/W - such bs. We should all just laugh it off because when athletes like V/M are so good, so dominant, all sorts of unbalanced & meanspirited people emerge from the woodwork.
     
  26. skatingfan12

    skatingfan12 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2012
    Messages:
    34
    I feel I need to defend Jenny, Dave, and their videos/podcast. Were their comments about Tessa unpopular on this thread? Yes. Were their comments made about Tessa made without knowledge of her situation? Absolutely. However, at the same time, they are entitled to their own opinion and that's exactly what they are doing. Everyone on this board is welcome to make videos about the same thing they are.

    The Skating Lesson is essentially a fan-run blog, not simply writing the facts of skating news. In fact, I don't think they are doing any more insinuating than a few posters have done on this thread, with accusing Igor of policking against V/M or D/W of gamesmanship. To me, it's actually good to hear both sides of an argument, not just the one side that we like.

    Lastly, if you were to give TSL a chance, their coverage and interviews are excellent. With skating coverage so scarce now, it's giving skating fans something to talk about and engage them in another conversation. It's rare a current skater gets the opportunity to really show their personality and show what mindset they're in (i.e. the Max Aaron interview was a great example of that). They are having Ashley Wagner (someone who TSL has criticized repeatedly, so it's not just Tessa) as a guest on their show in a few weeks. It's going to give her the platform to say her side of the story for close to an hour, rather than the five minutes she's gonna get from the mainstream media in the lead up to the Olympics. That's something I, as a skating fan, do appreciate.
     
  27. Emdee

    Emdee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2011
    Messages:
    1,584
    This is a Tessa and Scott ├╝ber thread.......yes Jenny and whoever can say what they want but WE have a right to disagree with their skewed interpretation of the event.
     
  28. Shayii

    Shayii Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2010
    Messages:
    1,874
    Skatingfan12, how come every posts I've seen you make in the V/M thread is always chastising us? I feel like we're always doing something wrong to you and it's your duty to let us know it.
     
  29. bmcg

    bmcg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,115
    No, you really don't need to. They read this board, if they feel the need to defend themselves they will do it themselves. You are just bored that no one in this thread has giving you a reason to get on your soapbox lately so are grabbing onto this. Find another hobby, I hear knitting can be fun.
     
  30. Golightly

    Golightly Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,232
    Also, people can say whatever they want, it's their opinion, but when you make a YouTube vlog and create an audience for yourself, you owe it to them to do a little research before presenting your "analyses". It is your responsibility. Why do you think guys like Perez Hilton are so widely despised? Because they make a show out of other people's misfortune. If The Skating Lesson people (the irony of that name is not lost on me, by the way) had done a little research, they would've known that Tessa has been struggling with this same injury for years now, muscles tighten and then pain takes over. Oh, and I feel those comments shouldn't just be unpopular on this thread, as you made sure to point out, but elsewhere. It is not right to call out a fellow skater like that, with zero knowledge on the situation, on a public forum and without even having the decency to give her call and ask her what happened. Especially knowing it's Tessa Virtue, an Olympic and World champion. You owe your colleague some respect, no?
     
    maggylyn and (deleted member) like this.