U.S. Team Envelope criteria revised for 2014-15 season + ISP updates

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, Sep 24, 2013.

  1. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    http://www.usfsa.org/Athletes.asp?id=350

    Revisions include:

    TEAM B - TIER 2
    Placements 4th - 6th at the 2014 Four Continents Championships

    TEAM C - TIER 1
    2014 U.S. Junior Champion

    TEAM C - TIER 2
    Placements 8th in the senior events at the 2014 U.S. Figure Skating Championships
    Placements 2nd - 3rd in the junior events at the 2014 U.S. Figure Skating Championships

    A new "Team D" (Developmental) envelope has been added below C:
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2013
  2. k6267

    k6267 New Member

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    Any idea why Junior 4 & 5, and Novice 1-3 got dropped from Envelope C to Envelope Developmental, and how that will affect funding?
     
  3. B.Cooper

    B.Cooper Active Member

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    I suspect "Developmental" funding will see some funding but obviously less than the C envelope. USFS is operating on a shoe string budget, and quite frankly, has done little to bring in the funds to support their athletes. They especially depend on the USOC to support the A envelope athletes. They need to market the sport, go after more corporate sponsors. Think outside the box, or make that, think outside the rink. But, this is an old topic. :-(
     
  4. johndockley92

    johndockley92 New Member

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    How much do these athletes get anyways? Is this public information?
     
  5. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    Based on my application of the criteria linked from post #1...

    TEAM A - TIER 1
    Abbott, Gold; Castelli/Shnapir; Davis/White, Chock/Bates.

    TEAM A - TIER 2
    Brown, Aaron;
    Edmunds, Wagner;
    Shibutani/Shibutani, Hubbell/Donohue.

    TEAM B - TIER 1
    Farris;
    Nagasu;
    Zhang/Bartholomay, Denney/Coughlin, Scimeca/Knierim, Kayne/O'Shea;
    Aldridge/Eaton.

    TEAM B - TIER 2
    Dornbush, Rippon;
    Cesario, Hicks;
    Denney/Frazier, Donlan/Speroff;
    Kriengkrairut/Giulietti-Schmitt, Cannuscio/McManus, Hawayek/Baker.

    TEAM C - TIER 1
    Razzano, Miner, N. Chen;
    Long, Glenn, K. Chen;
    Leng/LeDuc, Aaron/Settlage;
    McNamara/Carpenter.

    TEAM C - TIER 2
    Carriere, Moeller, Ma, Omori;
    Gao, Cain, Bell, Baga, Wang, Pierce, Shin;
    Calalang/Sidhu, Liu/Perini, Pearce/Pacini, Budd/Cheban (both are listed on icepartnersearch.com), Takai/Johnson;
    Olson/Lorello, Parsons/Parsons, Moore/Klaber.

    TEAM D - TIER 1
    Belmontes, Vrdoljak, Shum;
    Tennell, Taylor, Lin;
    Middleton/Evans (she is listed on icepartnersearch.com), de la Mora/Wilson, Oltmanns/Santillan;
    Pogrebinsky/Gudis, Lewis/Bye.

    TEAM D - TIER 1 (USFS site says Tier 1, not 2)
    Borromeo, Sjoberg, West;
    Le, Rydberg, Peng;
    Setoyama/Botero, Gillett/Fernandez, Lee/Hennings;
    Becker/Becker, Gropman/Somerville, Feng/Ponomarenko.

    This UNOFFICIAL compilation does not include retirements and/or splits that are not yet official or publicly announced.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2014
  6. clairecloutier

    clairecloutier Well-Known Member

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    I know these are only projections right now. But if someone in Envelope A retires (say, Abbott or D/W), would someone from Envelope B automatically move up to A, or no?
     
  7. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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  8. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    Last edited: Apr 4, 2014
  9. jiejie

    jiejie Active Member

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    Missing from ISP: Baga, Siraj, C. Zhang. I assumed this means they've retired.
    Also don't see Alexander Johnson. :(
     
  10. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    Skaters still can be added to the ISP after being monitored.

    Johnson did not compete at 2014 Nationals due to injury but is training, I believe (ETA: he tweeted a video clip of himself landing a 3A on his "road to recovery" in March).

    Siraj and C. Zhang placed below 15th at Nationals (doesn't mean either has retired). Baga placed 14th at Nationals and is eligible for the C2 team envelope due to her silver medal at Coupe de Nice last fall, so I'm not sure why she wasn't listed in the ISP.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2014
  11. JSB

    JSB New Member

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    In Ice Dance, the Beckers are not listed either. Are they staying Novice? Or have they quit?
     
  12. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    She is 12 and still too young for the JGP.
     
  13. watchthis!!

    watchthis!! Active Member

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    :(
     
  14. clairecloutier

    clairecloutier Well-Known Member

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    I just noticed Christina Gao is down in level C, Tier 2, below Amber Glenn and Karen Chen. :-( Is that typical? I know she may not even continue, but still, not exactly encouraging.
     
  15. jlai

    jlai Title-less

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    She finally broke the fifth place curse but with a lower placement :( Plus no medal at the grand prix
     
  16. lauren329

    lauren329 Active Member

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    Do we have any idea approximately how much $ is in these various envelopes? Just curious.
     
  17. redfiretrees

    redfiretrees Figure Skating Fan in the Tropics

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    I'm very curious too. I wonder if the Team A - Tier 1 money is enough to cover at least 50% of an elite skaters expenses for a season.
     
  18. peibeck

    peibeck Letting Poje be on top

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    I would doubt it. If I remember correctly there was a time when the funding of the envelopes was a published figure (perhaps as far back as the Kwan/Cohen days), and I doubt it would have covered 50% even back then. And if I am not mistaken, funding decreased (or at least the way envelopes are funded) changed quite a bit post-Torino. Maybe Syliva, or some other well connected people can recall better then I do however?
     
  19. jiejie

    jiejie Active Member

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    Doubt if it covers more than about 20%.
     
  20. pairskatingfan

    pairskatingfan New Member

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    :wideeyes: how are skaters in team B and lower expected to want to continue to skate then?
     
  21. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    I posted the following in a U.S. team envelope thread 4 years ago:
    U.S. skaters/teams in the A and B envelopes normally qualify for additional USOC funding as well (I don't know the amounts).

    Skaters' annual training expenses can vary significantly depending on where and with whom they train. Some rinks might offer ice time discounts for skaters that place well at Nationals and/or Olympics/Worlds, for example, or for those who coach a certain number of hours/group classes at the rink.

    ETA that I started this thread back in May 2012 for general reference and info:
    Funding of international skaters: federation/gov't/private/other support & prize $$$
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2014
    Vash01 and (deleted member) like this.
  22. jiejie

    jiejie Active Member

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    Math time. So if a typical Team A single skater's expenses are running in the USD 75,000-80,000 per year--an amount I've often heard bandied about, funding of 18,000 would be about 22-25% of that. Assuming USFS is running even leaner than from 4-5 years ago, Team envelope amount provided this season could be lower. Percentage quibbling aside, it's obvious that it's not even close to the support needed to get the job done, though it is not insignificant either. Team B and below are hurting even more, as many of these skaters aren't yet in a position to have made enough splash to get commercial sponsorships, paid show appearances, or big competition prize money. It's really a tough financial row to hoe and current trajectory of skating in the US doesn't trend favorable.
     
  23. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    At least US skaters don't have to pay their own way to competitions like smaller fed skaters do.
     
  24. clairecloutier

    clairecloutier Well-Known Member

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    I think Jeremy Abbott said recently that his combined funding from both USFSA and U.S. Olympic Committee only covered about 50 percent of his expenses.
     
  25. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

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    Abbott was in the Team B Tier 1 envelope this season. ETA: I believe he elected to have the extra expense of having a trainer accompany him to his competitions as well.

    Right, but many coaches often charge their skaters for "lost lessons" and/or other extra expenses when they accompany them to internationals.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2014
  26. dr.frog

    dr.frog Well-Known Member

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    FWIW, the parent of a JGP skater told me ~10 years ago that every international ended up costing them about $5000 extra in coaching and other expenses. I'm sure a big event like Worlds costs even more.
     
  27. stjeaskategym

    stjeaskategym Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I'm just not thinking hard enough, but how could it cost that much for a US skater? Travel, hotel, and meal expenses are covered (not sure about transportation to and from the airport). Unless a skater is traveling with multiple coaches and/or family members (which a lot of times they don't), or spending a lot of money on optional things like sightseeing/souvenirs/additional food&transportation (rental car/taxi, etc), how could it be costing them such a high number?
     
  28. clairecloutier

    clairecloutier Well-Known Member

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    See Sylvia's response above. Coaches charge the skater involved for the income they lose during competition, that is, the income they would have made teaching other skaters at home. Which makes sense from the coach's perspective. I'll bet there are lots of other expenses we're not aware of either. And you're taking your kid/yourself to a foreign country that you may never visit again, naturally you're going to want to sightsee a bit.
     
  29. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

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    International coaches likely do that as well. But the skater from those smaller feds also has to pay their airfare for themselves and their team.
    It is extremely expensive to be a US skater, but I really think skaters from other feds are much worse of. (And then others much better...)

    That's not a skating expense though.
     
  30. lauren329

    lauren329 Active Member

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    Also I find it interesting that USFS broke the A envelope into tiers (which I think they've moved away from in recent years) resulting in Jeremy, Chock/Bates and Castelli/Shnapir receiving better funding envelopes than Jason, Polina and Ashley.