U.S. Ladies [#8] All the Pretty Warhorses

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by kwanatic, Aug 2, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2003
    Messages:
    10,120
    No, but people can directly talk to people here and take them to task over it. As people do not have as direct of communication to Gracie and her being a public figure means whatever she says reaches out further than most private people's comments, and as she cares about her image, then a public apology is the best thing people can ask of her and serves as the most beneficial course of action in terms of her own damage control.


    And? Does that negate people's reaction who have had exposure to such ridicule. People may be able to write English here, but this board has a broad population with people who may have learned English as a second, third, etc. language. Also, many may know (either through their own experience or people they know) what is like to be judged of your speaking ability before you even say a word just by your physical characteristics.



    Actually, it's not arbitrary because there's a difference between things you are born with and things that you can actually control. Also, people may not be able to make fun of whole races of people just by their skin color, but people make jokes about specific nationalities all of the time. Look up Nigerian jokes for instance. Does that make it ok? No. I never said you couldn't be racist if you made fun of cultural stereotypes based on behavior. However, I think people tend to distinguish certain things. Not all generalizations are racist, but they can still be offensive. The comment about the quality of Chinese products can be seen as offensive and based on a wrong stereotype (and if you want to take it further, it can be a criticism of maybe the Chinese production model) or it could be people's criticism based on the fact that Chinese products are sought because they are cheaper and can be mass produced as a way to cut costs for businesses to sell to other markets. I'm not saying it can't be racist, but you have to see that there may be legitimate criticisms as well that may not always be based on mockery. Anyway, I forgot what the point of this part of the argument was about.

    Anyway, you yourself have your own personal threshold of what's deemed acceptable and what's deemed offensive. However, you cannot control how other people feel, which is what you're doing by judging people's reaction, then creating your own arbitrary class of people who are deserving of taking offense (Japanese people) and those who aren't (those who aren't Japanese).

    I don't think people here are doing that at all. Nobody is saying that people aren't guilty of bad behavior or that people are perfect. However, the matter at hand is that people were offended by Gracie's Tweet and commented on it. You can have an attitude of thinking since people are guilty of similar actions then they should never criticize other people of doing something similar, but other people disagree and think that as long as it's recognized as offensive, then people have the right to make a comment and inform Gracie of the offensive nature of her Tweet.



    Actually, some people have given examples of Japanese friends being offended and some people have given assumed reactions from Japanese people not being offended. Does that somehow negate the initial negative reaction people have? There's a reason why it hit a nerve with people.

    Again, I am not saying what Gracie did had any malicious intent nor am I thinking that people didn't have some sort of knee-jerk reaction to it. However, I don't blame people for reacting the way they did over it and want some sort of clarification or acknowledgement that the Tweet was a bad judgment call. What I do have a problem with is the dismissive attitude and sort of minimizing the impact it may have had on people, no matter if they should have taken a breath and understand that Gracie did not intend to use racist language (even if the language itself was racist).
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
  2. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2004
    Messages:
    9,009
    This. It was incredibly stupid and insensitive of her to post that, but I highly doubt she had malicious intent and I too am glad she apologized.
     
  3. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2004
    Messages:
    9,009
    Yes, I am nearly positive that she keeps her bye to Nationals. She earned her bye and this unforeseen circumstance shouldn't change that (providing she's healthy by January).
     
  4. YukiNieve

    YukiNieve Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Messages:
    641
    This is one of the tweets made by a Japanese skating fan,
    and she is not the only one who thinks this way.

    As a bilingual Japanese living in the US for more than half of my life,
    I don't necessarily think Gracie's comments as cute but as a silly mistake
    and I think that she should not have said that.

    But I also do not believe that there is any racist thinking behind her tweet.

    I've heard from many Japanese fans that Gracie was very gracious to the skating fans in Japan
    and has left fond impressions among them.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
  5. mtnskater

    mtnskater Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2003
    Messages:
    1,190
    I was really looking forward to seeing Karen Chen in the JGPF. I'm bummed for her that she has an injury and has to withdraw. Is she competing in Seniors at Nationals? That will be exciting to see her debut there if she is. I'm excited about her potential (but not trying to tempt the Skategods too much!)
     
  6. johndockley92

    johndockley92 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2011
    Messages:
    474
    I think it is ridiculous if people are offended by that. People need to get over their unending hatred of Gracie Gold.
     
  7. jlai

    jlai Title-less

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2002
    Messages:
    8,912
    I'm merely commenting from the perspectiveness of offensiveness. What she does as a public figure is a PR thing and I'll perhaps leave that for another conversation.

    I know that distinction, but many things that one can control are still offensive topics. e.g. Assuming people belonging to a type (e.g. social economic class) based on race is still racist. Saying one roots for all countries except Country X to win the Olympics could be racist.

    I think what is racist and sexism has evolved over time, and the majority of the society has always been shaping the definition. Two hundred years ago, the minorities didn't get much say in this at all. Now they have spoken up and more things are now in the offensive category. So perhaps thirty years from now, and with enough people spoken up about it, what I mention here will be openly considered by all to be offensive. I say this merely to point out the arbitrary nature re: offensiveness as a product of cultural norms. Many racist comments stem from ignorance of another culture, and it hurts like hell, and the most hurtful things don't necessarily involve making fun of skin color, accents, or physical attributes.

    It's not arbitrary; the tweet is for Mao and if it is considered offensive against Japanese people, then we should take their feelings into account. I think if people are gonna be offended, let's be clear they are offended for themselves, not for Mao or Japanese people.

    That's because she is a public figure, not anonymous posters behind a login name.
    I'll be honest: I have been offended by some comments about Chinese in the past in the society and here in this forum, But when people think I should be offended, it's often over something I'm not concerned about. The most hurtful comments go beyond stupid errors. Yet even with the most hurtful things I just forget it.

    One instance of a third hand report. See posts above by Japanese fans.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
  8. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2004
    Messages:
    9,009
    No, she is competing junior again in the U.S. this year (she won the junior ladies pewter medal last year).
     
  9. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2003
    Messages:
    10,120
     
  10. mtnskater

    mtnskater Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2003
    Messages:
    1,190
    Enough already. Gracie is a teenager and an athlete. She is not perfect and neither are any of us who post here. Thank heavens there was no Tweet or FB when I was a kid. People complain here because skaters are always too PC and never let you in on their personality and how they hate perfect princesses. Then one mis-step and the critics with their pitchforks and knives come out of the woodwork screaming outrage about what an awful person said skater is and how that tweet, cover photo, etc. confirms it, blah, blah, blah :blah:. People are so quick to judge others character flaws. Gets downright depressing.
     
    OliviaPug and (deleted member) like this.
  11. jlai

    jlai Title-less

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2002
    Messages:
    8,912
     
  12. overedge

    overedge Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2005
    Messages:
    17,824
    Aren't *you* being a little quick to judge by characterizing all the criticism of Gracie's tweet as saying that it proves she is a terrible person? Because that's not what most of the criticism is saying.
     
  13. Blondie12

    Blondie12 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2012
    Messages:
    402
    It looks like it might have been just a typo. Why is this being made such a big deal?
     
  14. Primorskaya

    Primorskaya Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2011
    Messages:
    1,272
    Oh c'mon! :rofl:

    But it doesn't mean she was out to start WW3, either.
     
  15. AndyWarhol

    AndyWarhol Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,172

    I think that if you are in the public eye, you should consider "would this be appropriate to say in a workplace?" attitude. I have no doubt that the tweet was purely in fun, and I'm sure Mao laughed, but it was written publicly on the internet, and some people ARE going to take offence. All the people I showed the article too thought it was a bit wrong. I don't buy the "but she is a kid" thing, because aren't we all taught when we are little kids to not make fun of other ethnicities? It's just a basic thing that she should know not to do.

    The magazine cover is just an unflattering picture. I quite like the smirk, and I'd love it if she played up that side more, we need more personalities. But yeah, just not a good photo. Pity, because she is a very pretty lady.
     
  16. reese

    reese Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2004
    Messages:
    3,384
    That's quite an assumption.
     
  17. AndyWarhol

    AndyWarhol Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,172
    Partial sarcasm :) As someone who did find the tweet offensive, I'm trying to give her the benefit of the doubt that she and Mao really are gal pals with in jokes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.