Sochi Olympics will test gay rights

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sugar, Feb 7, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Habs

    Habs Well-Known Member

    3,876
    1,095
    113
    They can live on reservations by choice, but it isn't mandated. Native Americans (and Canadians) are free to live wherever they choose.
     
  2. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    20,830
    3,710
    113
    Why would I try to prove that absurd statement. I was refuting your assertion that it was the worst genocide ever, when there was an earlier, similar genocide against Native peoples in the same hemisphere.
     
  3. spikydurian

    spikydurian Well-Known Member

    2,701
    287
    83
    This makes sense to me.

    I wish to add that sports and politics should not mix, if possible. Just like religion should be separate from the judiciary. Race, politics and religion are divisive and potent and we all know we cannot be absolutely similar even among siblings. Fighting and insult throwing will not change the hardcore and will antagonise the fence sitters. To change a culture or common way of thinking, I think education is the best way forward. (OK, I am an idealist.;) )
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2013
  4. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

    2,587
    227
    63
    Both the 1980 and 1984 summer Olympics were boycotted. Only 16 countries sent athletes to the 1980 olympics which were held in Moscow and they marched into the arena without their country's flags. The 1980 summer Olympics in Los Angeles was boycotted by the Soviet Union and some other communist countries.

    After both World Wars, the losing countries were not even invited to take part in the Olympics.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2013
  5. BlueRidge

    BlueRidge AYS's snark-sponge

    42,979
    4,886
    113
    I'm just wondering this: Does anyone contend anything was accomplished by these boycotts?
     
  6. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    20,569
    1,599
    113
    There are no anti-gay laws in China any more.

    Of course I get your point about China in general but it is very slowly opening up. Russia, on the other hand, seems to be going in exactly the opposite direction. :(
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2013
  7. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    10,268
    2,186
    113
    I remember hearing a joke about how Jimmy Carter's boycott of the 1980 Games created a new group of Republicans from those athletes. If that was even partially true, then I guess one can argue it accomplished something. ;)
     
  8. kalamalka

    kalamalka Active Member

    172
    41
    28
    It was 3 summer games in a row that were boycotted - the first was a boycott by mainly African countries of Montreal in 1976. The issue there wasn't Canada, but related to New Zealand playing rugby with South Africa. It did have a significant impact on the Olympics, though, and probably encouraged the boycott of Moscow four years later.
     
  9. iarispiralllyof

    iarispiralllyof Active Member

    774
    70
    28
    I'm Asian-American so I definitely appreciate the importance of respecting cultural differences, but there is such a thing as taking cultural relativism too far. Can we use culture to justify any country stoning rape victims in this day and age? (Which certainly happens)

    It's one thing if Russia just didn't allow gay marriage. The US itself is still figuring that out. But gay people have problems even just living day to day there. And LGBTQ oppression isn't even the only human rights issue in Russia.

    Of course, I agree that the IOC likely doesn't care - short of genocide.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  10. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

    3,379
    578
    113
    No, the only thing that happened was that athletes who worked all their lives to be in the Olympics were denied the chance to compete, many like the gymnasts of 1980 were unable to compete in 1984 because their bodies did not hold up for four more years.
     
  11. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    4,935
    813
    113
    I hadn't heard of Belita before. The vid is from the 1970s ... I wonder is she still alive? Is there any more information on her such as in a book, or a list of her films?
     
  12. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    12,018
    1,355
    113
    She is not still alive, she passed away in 2005.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belita

    There are tons of her videos on youtube. Gorgeous candlestick spiral.
     
  13. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    4,935
    813
    113
    ^^ Thanks Skittl1321. :)
     
  14. overedge

    overedge Well-Known Member

    18,167
    2,713
    113
    Yes, some African-American and Jewish athletes competed or won medals in 1936. But that does not excuse how the IOC conveniently interpreted or outright ignored the awful things that were happening in Germany to "outsiders".
     
  15. Coco

    Coco Well-Known Member

    10,953
    1,567
    113
  16. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

    6,567
    276
    83
    80 countries participated and lots went in with their flags.
     
  17. AJ Skatefan

    AJ Skatefan Well-Known Member

    2,201
    505
    113
    Which venues are those?
     
  18. NadineWhite

    NadineWhite Well-Known Member

    2,649
    299
    83
    This has nothing to do with skating and should be put in another section of the forum that deals with outside non-skating matters. jmho.
     
  19. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    20,569
    1,599
    113
    Pretty much every single city that has hosted the Olympics. Best recent example is Athens. Unused, unneeded venues, falling into ruin already.

    Other than Barcelona and maybe one or two other examples, all the cities hosting the Olympics failed to turn the games into long-term development and just managed to bankrupt themselves.

    It will be interesting to see how London fares. It's something they've apparently put a lot of thought and planning into.
     
  20. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    12,018
    1,355
    113
    I understand the appeal of wanting everything centralizied- but what city could possibly use and support all those sports facilities? Having the Olympics spread out over a broader area makes a LOT more sense. Then many cities in the same general area could benefit from new facilities- one a soccer stadium, one a swimming, one a track, etc, rather than one city being totally burdened by it.
     
  21. Karina1974

    Karina1974 Well-Known Member

    2,662
    228
    63
    Are you referring to Wilma Rudolph, the track and field star? She competed in both 1956 and 1960; she wasn't even born yet in 1936. I think you mean Jesse Owens.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  22. Karina1974

    Karina1974 Well-Known Member

    2,662
    228
    63

    I don't know, Lake Placid doesn't seem to be suffering any. The 1980 Ice arena is still in use as far as I know, and Whiteface is a draw for skiers. When my parents go up to visit my brother who lives outside of Saranac Lake, they take a bypass road so they don't have to drive through the village and get stuck in traffic.
     
  23. lala

    lala Well-Known Member

    2,116
    199
    63
    Yes, of course!!!! You are right!!! Jesse Owens!!
     
  24. Ozzisk8tr

    Ozzisk8tr Well-Known Member

    3,930
    1,494
    113
    Rather silly post, so different when the American tragedy you talk about happened hundreds of years ago. Russia is doing this gay hate thing now. I do hope it's a language thing as I found the first part of your post awfully offensive..
     
  25. Frau Muller

    Frau Muller President of Dick Button Appreciation Club

    8,048
    521
    113
    So is this going to be Johnny's 'excuse' for dropping out of Nationals and halting his quest to make the Sochi team? Jeez, Louise!

    The Jewish lobby in DC has, for years, been harping on alleged mistreatment of Jews in Russia, most recently because prominent Russian Jewish businessmen remain behind bars on (allegedly) trumped-up criminal charges. I'm sure that somewhere in U.S. Congress, somebody is lobbying for a Sochi boycott.
     
  26. danceronice

    danceronice Corgi Wrangler

    6,485
    524
    113
    Including at each other. The Seminoles didn't move to Florida to be nice neighbors. Lots of tribes were wiping preexisting tribes out before Europeans arrived (the Huron didn't go west with the French because they felt cramped, they wanted to put distance and an ally with firearms between them and the Iroquois). And of course the majority of deaths were disease, and not intentionally spread disease (that happened to a degree) but just what happens when new populations meet each other. And of course North America sent Europe a lovely return gift in the form of syphilis. None of the tribes in place at European contact had "always" been there, and quite a few occupied the territories they did because they wiped out the previous residents. Pre-Europe North America (let alone Central and South America) was not a Utopian panacea of brotherliness and living in harmony with nature. Plenty of massacring going on long before anyone arrived going west.
     
  27. manhn

    manhn Well-Known Member

    9,443
    2,042
    113
    Not counting the ski infrastructure as I'm not that familiar with them (the tragedy that occurred at the Sliding Centre is well known, but beyond that, I don't think revenue generated is matching the expenses to maintain it yet), Vancouver only built two new facilities--the curling arena and the speed skating oval. Prior to conception, both were planned to be converted to recreation centres. Both are extremely well used and focal points in their neighbourhoods.

    Non-sports related, Vancouver spent a ton of money building a new transit line from Downtown to the airport--and that is extremely popular, well used. I love the Canada Line. We also improved the road access from Vancouver to Whistler. I took that route during the summer a couple of years ago and it was nice--not sure whether that has the helped the economy in any way, though, or it's caused fewer accidents and deaths.

    There was also the Olympic Village (where the athletes stayed) but I believe about 90% of the condos have been sold and the neighbourhood is really developing. I love the coffeeshop, the pedestrian bridge, the big ass birds. It's one of my favourite stops along the seawall when I run or bike.

    Turin apparently tore down its sliding centre.

    I don't know what will happen to Sochi's Olympic area. All the stadiums are built right next to each other. Great during those 4 weeks, but will they be of use in the future? And you have to build everything. I know a lot of people did not like the Pacific Coliseum for the skating, but it was existing infrastructure and we didn't bankrupt ourselves making some upgrades.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  28. Willowway

    Willowway Well-Known Member

    1,630
    364
    83
    I don't know when the economics of the games went on to steriods (someone else may have a better measure of that) but it happened. I would guess that as you say Lake Placid, Cortina, places like that which were winter sports centers (maybe not huge but established) may have only benefitted. But somewhere along the way, just enhancing what was already there and adding some venues morphed into practically building a city and it's now about building a building/venue for almost every individual event and making them permanent, large structures, etc. Not to say that does't have a point but it went over into money-land a while ago and now it's complete overkill regardless of who has the games.

    Interesting article in today New York Times about Putin's most recent visit to Sochi and his complete displeasure with the cost overruns (massive although one wonders if the budget was a fiction in the first place and it was always going to cost what it is likely to cost), likely corruption on the construction side and blown construction milestones. Not so with the figure skating arena in Sochi (looks beautiful) but that may be the exception.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  29. BlueRidge

    BlueRidge AYS's snark-sponge

    42,979
    4,886
    113
    I'm not equipped at the moment to get into this non-skating argument but I do feel the need to say that the mistreatment of American Indians in the U.S. is ongoing, not simply historical.
     
    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  30. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    20,830
    3,710
    113
    Although Sochi venues are somewhat centralized, at least four of the buildings are temporary and will be moved to other sites around Russia after the Games.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.