Skaters and Doping

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by TheIronLady, Mar 3, 2013.

  1. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    Have any skaters ever been charged with illegal doping? Even if no one has been caught, what substances might some have in fact used? I am aware there was an incident with Marina Klimova, but I believe her tests were ruled false positives. I would speculate her results could have been affected by something as simple as birth control pills. I find it hard to believe female skaters would take androgenic hormones, but Irina Rodnina came out in 1992 and said steroid use was common in Soviet era skating.

    Chicago Tribune: Rodnina Confirms Soviet Steroid Use

    What is the state of doping in skating today? It seems to me that training methods and preparation are so superior now that only unusual cases would resort to substances which could be of marginal benefit and potentially disqualifying.

    But what about banned diuretics and stimulants? Those could be of some benefit. Are any skaters today using these?
     
  2. aliceanne

    aliceanne Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    2,225
    The most common accusation I have heard regarding skaters is blood doping (ie., transfusing oxygen enriched blood into a skater right before a competition in order to improve stamina). I don't know of any cases where it has actually been proven.
     
  3. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2009
    Messages:
    1,664
    Katerina Witt said while many East German athletes were forced to dope, figure skaters weren't, so as to keep that light, lean physique.
     
  4. care bear

    care bear Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    Messages:
    658
  5. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    31,157
    TheIronLady and (deleted member) like this.
  6. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    I hesitate to throw random accusations without specific evidence, but blood doping and diuretics sound like things Chinese athletes might attempt. They are the only country suspected to lie about skater's ages for competitive advantage. For this reason, it's easier to speculate about them experimenting with practices like doping.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2013
  7. madm

    madm Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2006
    Messages:
    575
  8. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    31,157
    From my link posted above...

    Ice Dancer Anastasia Galyeta (UKR) was suspended 18 months by the ISU due to an anti-doping violation. This decision of the ISU Disciplinary Commission was published on May 21, 2012 as ISU Communication 1731: http://isu.sportcentric.net/db//files/serve.php?id=3516

    Yuri Larionov (of Bazarova/Larionov) was suspended after testing positive for Furosemide at the 2007 JGP Final. He was originally suspended for 2 years by the ISU and the Russian federation later filed a successful petition to have his sentence reduced to 18 months.

    ETA relevant link to the ISU site: http://www.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/page/directory/0,10853,4844-128618-129926-nav-list,00.html

     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2013
  9. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Messages:
    18,089
    I think Kyoko Ina got suspended for failing to undertake a drug test.

    The stories from East Germany back in the late 70s and early 80s was around growth stunting of female pairs skaters.

    I do think it is surprising though that out of all the sports, drugs has not be a major problem for figure skating. But then it has probably made up for it by corruption and judging problems.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2013
  10. Sylvia

    Sylvia On to GP & U.S. Sectionals!

    Joined:
    May 27, 2002
    Messages:
    31,157
  11. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Messages:
    18,089
    Thanks for posting that link Sylvia.
     
  12. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    Was Kyoko Ina smoking pot? Why wouldn't you just provide a sample?

    Why are marijuana and other non-enhancing chemicals on the banned substances list?
     
  13. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2006
    Messages:
    3,269
    I just still find it strange that they can show up at a skater's home demanding a sample.
     
  14. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    It's the only way for testing to be random and unexpected. You can see how easy it is to mask steroids, for example. It's necessary, or they would catch few of the dopers.

    What I wonder is why doping has to be monitored with a one-size-fits-all approach for all sports. Shouldn't they have some special procedures for different sports? Or do they? I would hope they spend more resources going after athletics than skating.
     
  15. waltzNo1

    waltzNo1 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    Messages:
    8
    These are indeed "random accusations without specific evidence"!
     
  16. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    I said I don't like doing it, but let me put it this way. Sui Wenjing is 13 or 14 now. If we are looking for people getting away with shadiness in skating, China is a spot I would check out.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2013
  17. Cherub721

    Cherub721 YEAH!

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2002
    Messages:
    14,034
    There were some other issues with it... it was late at night, the agent's accreditation was expired and they brought along a boyfriend. I remember thinking at the time I could understand how she would be like, this is sketchy, I'm retiring anyway, and I don't feel comfortable giving the sample under these circumstances.... but apparently she did try...

    This blog has some discussion about it: http://mizprker.blogspot.com/
     
  18. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    Was Ina afraid this woman was a pervert trying to get her urine? I understand this is inconvenient, but aren't these the norms of random testing? And why again was she unable to provide a sample?
     
  19. overedge

    overedge Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2005
    Messages:
    17,804
    If you hadn't had anything to eat or drink recently - which might be the case at 10:30 pm if you were getting ready to go to bed - you might not be able to produce enough urine to be usable for a test. I believe "usable" usually means enough urine for the test, not that the person couldn't pee at all.
     
  20. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Messages:
    18,089
    Hmmm why would anyone even think a drug tester was a pervert? Or that Kyoko Ina was smoking pot? Sorry but these are really weird things to comment on.
     
  21. Cherub721

    Cherub721 YEAH!

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2002
    Messages:
    14,034
    My sense is that if this happened right before the Olympics or something, she would have basically had them stay until she could produce or do whatever to make sure she was in the clear (no pun intended). She wanted to retire anyway, just hadn't yet communicated that up the chain, so I could see her being like "forget this" after trying to produce a sample and then not even being able to get through to the hotline.

    I wonder if anything ever happened to that agent. Are they allowed to bring "guests"? Are they supposed to be taking samples without having a valid credential with them? I mean, if they want to have the power to ring someone's doorbell anytime and get a sample, isn't it reasonable for the athlete to expect that the agents in turn are strictly following their own code of procedure?
     
    TheIronLady and (deleted member) like this.
  22. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    Willie, Cherub cited that the tester/representative brought her boyfriend as a reason why Kyoko felt uncomfortable with the situation, which makes about no sense.

    Do they not allow the athlete do drink some water and have time to produce a sample? If they do not/did not, then I can agree that Ina was wronged.

    The question about illegal, recreational substances is a legitimate one. Those are tested for by the USADA. When an athlete with nothing to hide doesn't produce a sample, it is a reasonable question to ask if they do have something to hide.
     
  23. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Messages:
    18,089
    But referring to someone as a pervert and suggest that someone is smoking pot?
     
  24. kittysk8ts

    kittysk8ts Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2012
    Messages:
    42
    Elena Berezhnaya (and Anton Sikharulidze) although this was a shame.

    From Wikipedia:


    " In February 2000, the pair won gold at the 2000 Europeans but were stripped of their medals after Berezhnaya tested positive for pseudoephedrine, a substance whose ban was lifted between 2004 and 2010. This resulted in a three-month disqualification from the date of the test, and the medal being stripped. She had taken cold medication approved by a doctor but had failed to inform the ISU as required. Berezhnaya and Sikharulidze missed the World Championships that year as a result of the disqualification."
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013
  25. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    This seems like a plausible account of what she might have been thinking. I only raised the question of her having something to hide like marijuana to be the devil's advocate. We can all sympathize with Ina, for this is a burden placed on the athletes, and skaters are unusually burdened since their sport has little to gain from random testing compared to other sports.

    I hope the USADA takes responsibility for the professionalism of its staff. I assume it does. Ina was part of this situation, and it sounds like she was being careless because she thought she had nothing to lose.
     
  26. viennese

    viennese Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2004
    Messages:
    1,139
    I read a couple of recent athlete autobiographies this past winter and the funniest, weirdest parts are the sections in which the athletes talk about the drug testing procedures - in and out of competition.

    Michael Phelps is hilarious on this subject (yes, he does talk about getting high at a party and how dumb that was).

    In Phelps' book, he talks about he and his teammates (USA and Baltimore swimmers) get random, unannounced every few month visits from the USADA people - at their homes, their training sites, wherever. (USADA people show credential and are same gender as athlete). Athlete has to produce a sample within a time limit or USADA gets a report of noncompliance - which is what happened to Kyoko Ina.

    And like any New Yorker - or woman anywhere - why should she allow anyone without proper ID into her house?

    That's just common sense.
     
  27. overedge

    overedge Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2005
    Messages:
    17,804
    I recall one skater (of course I can't remember exactly who) who said he had to drink three beers before he could produce enough for a usable sample.

    At the risk of getting TMI, I don't think you are allowed to produce it gradually, if you get what I mean....you have to produce the entire sample in one go.
     
  28. AndyWarhol

    AndyWarhol Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,172
    I like to think she was high/recently high.
     
    TheIronLady and (deleted member) like this.
  29. skatingfanfun

    skatingfanfun New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2010
    Messages:
    120
    hi Iron Lady, you definitely found the right place to post this:)
     
    TheIronLady and (deleted member) like this.
  30. TheIronLady

    TheIronLady New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,520
    Are you worried about China's reputation for openness and honesty? ;)