Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by muffinbiscuit, Dec 4, 2010.
Is he competing at Nationals this year?
Yes, it will be his Senior debut.
Here's a thread with links to some articles on Miner from September (after he competed at the Middle Atlantics club competition in NYC): http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/showthread.php?t=74972
ETA: Link to the current top scores of all the U.S. Senior Men who are known to be competing at 2011 Nationals.
Did he have a bye through Easterns?
He competed on the GP, so he has a bye through to Nationals.
He was 7th at CoC and 9th at NHK.
More specifically, the dates of NHK Trophy gave Miner a bye through New England Regionals and Cup of China gave him a bye through Eastern Sectionals.
So, bumping this thread up... it turned out to be quite a senior debut for Ross Miner!
Post-Nationals article published today: Miner takes major step with bronze medal
Another of "my" SCoB kids! (Hey, I fed them all for a year...) I am thrilled beyond words for Ross!
"...tennis is his second passion after skating..."
Atta boy, Ross! I knew I was gonna like this kid.....
Terrific debut for Ross. Here's hoping he repeats at Worlds.
Ross and his dad usually are at Liberty. Very nice people.
The Casablanca program has come a huge long way since Liberty. We absolutely loved it at Nationals-the pattern of the program on the ice is particularly pleasing, something that shows up best several rows up.
And the effortless glide and speed, particularly in the spread eagle sequence up and down the ice, ending in a 3/2/2, was particularly great live. And I've got to say, I really enjoyed the waltz circular step that he began with, too.
I was not as crazy about his sp, Partkiki by Piazzolla, billed as a Salsa Medley. However I did like the flying upright spin, as something a bit different, and I do like his spread eagles, and the height of his jumps these days. He could use a more Salsa-esque costume, I think, too.
Plus he's a nice kid.
Ice Network has a nice interview with him, where he says he felt he squandered his Grand Prix opportunities, came back from China and sat down with his coaches, and completed changed his training regimen.
It's the article link I posted earlier: Miner takes major step with bronze medal
Go Ross! I admit I was not much of a fan of his over the last few years, found him rather stale- but I really felt a huge improvement from him at Nationals. I'm not sure exactly what changed but I really like what I see from him now. It's really nice to see the progression of guys like Dornbush, Miner, and Mahbanoozadeh from fairly boring but solid juniors to quite exciting senior men! Congrats to these guys and their coaches on their tremendous improvements!!!
BTW, if you actually look at the fields Ross was skating against at his GP events, I thought he did fairly well for a debut season. Of course he could have placed a couple spots higher, and I'm confident he will manage to do so next season, but he shouldn't feel too badly about how he did.
If Nationals is to be taken seriously by the competitors and the public as the ultimate showdown competition, the placements here should determine the world team. Skaters talking about "peaking at worlds" should save this talk for AFTER they compete at nationals and earn their spot. Ross earned it fair and square. This doom and gloom talk helps no one, least of all figure skating as a sport. I look forward to seeing Ross compete for the US at Worlds.
yep ross earned the spot fair and square ... i like his clean style of skating. he really put in everything but the kitchensink last week. off you go to tokyo my friend!
Ross's LP was much better than his SP. I wish he and his team would re-choreograph the SP to put more Oomphs into it.
I think the heavy forward lurch Ross does before his 3A gives that jump somewhat of an unstable feeling for me. I wonder if Mitchell and Johanssen have trouble teaching 3A, because their former student Steven Carrierre also had a weird entrance into his 3A.
Previous to Nationals, Ross's 3A wasn't as high, and tended to finish low. So he has obviously been working on it, because it went sky high at Nationals. However, you're right, and some more work to smooth it out is in order.
And I agree that his SP needs something. For one thing he needs a costume that says "Salsa Medley" rather than "Zorro".
And something else for the LP, too, but obviously he can't wear a fedora and a trench coat.
maybe the dinner jacket and black bowtie look with the black pants from the bar scene where Sam is playing "As Time Goes By"?
I would swear Ross used to have a show program to Casablanca, and wore something more akin to a dinner jacket for it. This was a few years ago, though, so it's been a while and I might be misremembering the costume.
Casablanca (with the dinner jacket style costume) was his 2007 novice free skate.
BTW, I love the way he skated up and threw snow from his skates into the camera and followed it up with a Mr. Frack cantilever in the Gala. (Skating to Born to Run by The Boss)
If a field goal kicker misses a field goal or two in a crucial playoff game, is he going to lose his spot to a talented but unseasoned second-string kicker for the most important game of all, the Superbowl? This is probably a silly analogy, but my point is that considering a skater's recent international results in picking the World team is smart thinking, not "unfair". In gymnastics, the World/Olympic team selections are based on several recent results, rather than one competition. Are they being "unfair", or are they just trying their best to send the team that has the greatest potential to do well?
I really liked Ross's LP in Greensboro, and I think he had a decent showing in his GP debut. I, personally, would have named Abbott to the team, and therefore, I hope nobody gets on Miner's case (or Dornbush's) if the US men cannot retain 3 spots. For someone like Ross, it's a huge success just to even be there. A decent finish would be a bonus for him.
I think the responsibility of getting the US 3 spots for 2012 should rest mostly on the shoulders of the National champion and the 2nd place finisher. The 3rd person on a World team is almost an afterthought.
As the article says, "For Kickers, Tenuous Job Security Is the Norm".
And skating is an individual sport, in any case.
Boston Globe article today:
Using your analogy, if the kicker misses field goals and costs his team the game, he wouldn't be going to the Super Bowl. The 'kicker' needs to either deliver the goods or go home and watch the game on tv.
tell that to Shizuka Arakawa and Sarah Hughes...
If said "seasoned" kicker messed up in the three Superbowls in a row, and had a history of inconsistency, said kicker would have been long gone.
Jeremy Abbott is a fabulous skater, but the guy is completely unreliable competitor. You want to mention gymnastics, I"d point out to you that Marta would have been through with Jeremy years ago. The fact that this is an individual sport is the reason Jeremy has gotten the chances he has.
Reputation has a lot to do with PCS and skaters like Dornbush, Miner are never going to get good PCS if they are never given a chance to compete at the big international events. At this point the USFSA is pretty much just trying to figure out which of their youngsters to start investing/supporting. And part of figuring out who to invest/support is also seeing who you can rely on to deliver in competitions.
Thanks for the article link. I was impressed with Ross as a junior and hope he has great success as a senior. Show 'em, Ross!
Well once in a bluemoon all the stars and planets are aligned for the non-favorites to steal the spotlight
I agree, those two didn't exactly set the world on fire with their career.
But you have to agree that they were each the right 3rd skater from their Federation to go to Olympics
If Jeremy had made the GPF or medalled at last year's World's I would have argued for him to have gone to Tokyo.
I think federations should go off book sometimes where warranted and not always stick to nationals placements. Imagine if Jeremy, Johnny and Evan all skated poorly at nationals last year and finished off the podium. The more a federation sticks to nats placements, the bigger the controversy they will face if they advance lower-placing skaters when they really need to.
While in theory, it seems like the committee should pick the best possible team based on lots of results. But in reality, that often results in people being picked for political reasons rather than for real results and that old favorites who have performed well in the past but are not performing well now get sent over younger less experience athletes who are performing well now but don't have the rep.
For example, what if someone who didn't participate in the GP wins Nationals? They have no former results to go on. Maybe they weren't on the GP due to an injury which is now healed though. Or they didn't have a SB score the prior year because they were too young. So not being on the GP doesn't mean they usually suck and winning Nationals is a fluke.
I think in reality it's impossible to pick the "best" team based on multiple factors. Therefore, I'm fine with doing it based on the results of Nationals.
If Jeremy could do that... he probably won't be where he is right now.
Okay, what about this....S/S got sick and didn't go to their nationals or europeans and H/W won, do you think the german fed wouldn't send them because it was the rules? I think the rule would be broken and that would be in any federaltion be it Russian, Canadian, American or anyone.
The feds want to send the best team, even if the best team don't aways win nationals.
You can't compare the two scenarios though. Even the US federation makes exceptions for injuries etc. But in order to qualify for said exception, you have to have amazing qualifications. Jeremy's track record doesn't not in anyway compare to S/S. He doesn't even have a world medal, let along being a reining Olympic bronze medalist, and 2 time world champ.
And how do we know for sure that Jeremy will do better than the three that were on the team. Who would have though two years ago that Mroz would do better than Jeremy at worlds, Mroz! But Brandon did. Its not like Jeremy is a consistent skater, with consistent placements.
Different federations have different rules. Not every federation is required to go by the results of their nationals. Plus, in most NGBs there are rules for how to deal with injured skaters. So sending them wouldn't be against the rules in most countries including the US.
But if it was against the rules, they wouldn't be broken, at least in the US.
The problem with just sending whomever you want regardless of the rules is that you get sued for not following your own rules. This is why NGBs have leeway in their rules. USFS only has to send the winner in each discipline, for example. The other slots are up to the discretion of the International Committee. However, USFS rarely goes against the results of Nationals even though technically they can. I think they've figured out it rarely pays off and it pisses off the athletes.
I'm not sure how gymnastics compares anyways. Nowadays gymanstics is 3 up 3 count and with five/six person team lineups are incredibly important. You may have finished 4th in the All Around at Nationals in gymnastics, but you might have done so being 5th on every event, while perhaps the person behind you was 1/2 in two events. All the girls competiting for gymnastics spots know that its about where they place in lineups.
And really the thing is the US system has overall worked very well for us. Is there a federation in its long term history (I'm not talking about just a decade) that has had more singles medals than us? Making nationals important makes it easier for young talent to get notice and the ability to compete. And the thing is if you can't handle your national championship, are you really going to be able to handle worlds.
I think the main thing is that the skaters know what they have to do to make the teams ahead of time for example the Russian federation pretty made it clear that if you wanted to make the Europeans team, you needed to place top 3 at nationals. And then to I/K and R/T that how they did at Euros would determine Worlds spots..
You can't go changing the qualification after the fact.
Ross Miner posted a blog entry on his official site that recaps the ankle sprain injury that forced his withdrawal from 2010 Nationals/Junior Worlds and his season to date through 2011 Nationals: http://www.figureskatersonline.com/rossminer/blog-february2011.html
Separate names with a comma.